# Would you have done the "pay it forward" thing at Starbucks? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 22, 2014, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251 "2014-08-22T23:13:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2014, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/41 "2014-08-24T21:23:16Z")
> [@Sterling\_Archer](#): > > I broke the chain once. I ordered a $2 coffee. I pulled up and they told me, “The person in front of you just paid for your drink.” I don’t think they prompted me any further, so I asked: > > “What is the bill of the person behind me?” > > “$8.50” > > “Um, no I’ll just take the drink, thanks.” I wonder how many people caught wind of this pay-it-foward chain just like the blogger in the OP did and ordered the most [expensive drink](http://www.newsday.com/news/nation/jarrod-johnson-orders-most-expensive-starbucks-drink-ever-1.8875578)? ---
**Author:** ![Uniqueorn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uniqueorn/32/2807_2.png) [@Uniqueorn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uniqueorn)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 10:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/42 "2014-08-25T10:43:57Z")
In Huddersfield, North England, they have a scheme called “Suspended Coffees” where you can pay for a suspended coffee and if a homeless person asks for a coffee, s/he gets the one you paid for. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 10:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/43 "2014-08-25T10:50:48Z")
> [@Uniqueorn](#): > > In Huddersfield, North England, they have a scheme called “Suspended Coffees” where you can pay for a suspended coffee and if a homeless person asks for a coffee, s/he gets the one you paid for. Something tells me a scheme like that wouldn’t go down well here. “Homeless people don’t need coffee!” “Yeah, like I’m gonna pay for a lazy bum’s latte. Get real!” “Why would a homeless guy be in this kind of neighborhood?” Not to mention, Starbucks probably wouldn’t want to attract “suspended coffee” clientele. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 11:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/44 "2014-08-25T11:07:33Z")
Help me out here - how did this guy “break the chain” - surely they could just charge him for his drinks as normal, then apply that still-in-the-system prepaid coffee _amount_ to the _next_ person in line? Making his grand gesture a bit of a fizzle… ---
**Author:** ![Uniqueorn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uniqueorn/32/2807_2.png) [@Uniqueorn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uniqueorn)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 11:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/45 "2014-08-25T11:23:30Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > Something tells me a scheme like that wouldn’t go down well here. > > “Homeless people don’t need coffee!” > > “Yeah, like I’m gonna pay for a lazy bum’s latte. Get real!” > > “Why would a homeless guy be in this kind of neighborhood?” > > Not to mention, Starbucks probably wouldn’t want to attract “suspended coffee” clientele. True that, the scheme is run by small independent coffee shops that actually serve good coffee. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Shine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr_shine/32/464_2.png) [@Mr\_Shine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Shine)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/46 "2014-08-25T12:03:41Z")
I’m obviously verey dense, but I’m not understanding how they know what to charge you for the next person in line, without access to a functional crystal ball. ---
**Author:** ![Lobot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ce7236/32.png) [@Lobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobot)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/47 "2014-08-25T12:17:21Z")
> [@Mr\_Shine](#): > > I’m obviously verey dense, but I’m not understanding how they know what to charge you for the next person in line, without access to a functional crystal ball. It’s a drive-through. ---
**Author:** ![shiftless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9c0ed/32.png) [@shiftless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shiftless)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/48 "2014-08-25T13:38:23Z")
Too confusing for me to deal with before I’ve had my coffee. I don’t find myself at Starbucks much but now I’m going to have to actively avoid them. It seem like a secret club now, a place where I don’t know the customs or rituals and am likely to embarrass myself somehow. ---
**Author:** ![Krouget](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b38774/32.png) [@Krouget](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Krouget)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/49 "2014-08-25T14:17:17Z")
I guess the fun in the idea, is that you can “selfishly” take the free drink (and break the chain), but instead perform the “altruistic” gesture. To me, it sort of loses the impact when the barista asks if you want to\* return the favor\*, since now there is a sense of obligation. As the one article says, you’re still paying for your drink, but simply passing the free drink back until someone eventually accepts it. I asked a few others, and they say it’s about the act, while others think it’s about the reward. For me, the act seems more like participation in a game, less about the substance. However, the guy who went out of his way to break it, was an asshole with too much time. Let people have their fun. ---
**Author:** ![Rhiannon8404](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rhiannon8404/32/17929_2.png) [@Rhiannon8404](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhiannon8404)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/50 "2014-08-25T14:29:52Z")
I would likely end up breaking the chain since on the rare occasion I find myself in a Starbucks drive through, I’m usually getting a basic cup of coffee. I’m not likely to pay for someone’s fancy drink just to keep some chain going when I ordered a $3 coffee. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/51 "2014-08-25T14:33:34Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > Here’s another [analysis](http://www.fastcompany.com/3034747/fast-feed/breaking-a-pay-it-forward-chain-isnt-being-a-cheap-bastard-its-good-economics?utm_source=facebook) of the situation, which explains why this thing doesn’t make any economic sense. That is one cranky-ass writer. I was already buying a coffee. Whether my card is run for my latte or the latte of the person behind me isn’t really critical for me. If their total is 8.50, then I simply won’t get a latte next week and I’ll be ok with that. The things that wind people up, good grief. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/52 "2014-08-25T14:55:47Z")
If I were a coffee drinker, I’d avoid any Starbucks that was promoting it’s “pay-it-forward” chain. Because I like being able to say no to stuff without reading in the virtual paper how I was the “cranky ass” who broke the chain. That’s how I first learned about this thing–from a Yahoo article about a woman who declined the free drink. It was right there up among the headlines about Ebola and ISIS. So it’s not like this thing has been without any social shaming–which is why the “cranky asses” are probably writing about it. **Inner Stickler** , I’m curious how you would feel if you were standing in the line at Starbucks and the person behind you asked you to pay for their $8.50 order. Don’t mean to put you on the spot or anything, but I know that if that happened to me, I’d laugh in their face and say no. Personally, I don’t think that’s me being a “cranky ass”. I think it’s me not kow-towing to social pressure to do something that doesn’t jibe with my idea of “random act of kindness” or “fun”. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/53 "2014-08-25T15:11:59Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > The things that wind people up, good grief. ABC is actually putting real time and energy into writing a story about “Person buys someone else coffee”. Because, when all is said and done, that’s all that happened during this 10 hour Pay It Forward marathon. You aren’t being done a favor if you get guilted into paying for the next coffee. Pay It Forward is an old idea, and a kind idea. Doing a good deed for someone in need, helping them in a time of trouble, and encouraging them to help someone else when they get a chance. A Pay It Forward Chain is just a bullshit game played by people who don’t need help and don’t particularly want to help anyone else. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/54 "2014-08-25T15:14:19Z")
No, you’d be a cranky ass if you watched me having the exchange with the person behind me and then opined loudly to everyone about how I made the wrong choice. Is there some nice thing you think the world would be just a smidge better if people did? Do you know why people don’t do it? Because if they do, someone gets annoyed at them for being economically stupid or whatever. They’re not punching you in the face, what do you care if they’re paying for each others’ drinks? ---
**Author:** ![shiftless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9c0ed/32.png) [@shiftless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shiftless)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/55 "2014-08-25T15:21:07Z")
> [@Rhiannon8404](#): > > I’m not likely to pay for someone’s fancy drink just to keep some chain going when I ordered a $3 coffee. Yikes, have we really reached the point where a $3 cup of coffee is considered cheap? Another reason I should not enter Starbucks. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/56 "2014-08-25T15:35:50Z")
At the coffeeplaces around me, you can expect to pay 2 bucks and change for a cup of just coffee. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Lowry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sam\_Lowry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Lowry)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/57 "2014-08-25T16:33:35Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > Here’s another [analysis](http://www.fastcompany.com/3034747/fast-feed/breaking-a-pay-it-forward-chain-isnt-being-a-cheap-bastard-its-good-economics?utm_source=facebook) of the situation, which explains why this thing doesn’t make any economic sense. That was an interesting analysis. I don’t think it’s a bad thing necessarily to start one of those pay-it-forward chains. But it’s true that it’s not a real pay-it-forward situation. Like the economist Russ Roberts is quoted in the article: > [@](#): > > “Nobody’s in duress here. The real idea of ‘pay it forward’ is, I break down on a snowy night, I lose control of my car and end up in a ditch, four strangers come along and push me out. Then I’m driving along and I see someone else in a ditch, and I pull over and help them. That’s paying it forward. You made a sacrifice. Paying it forward for someone at Starbucks who’s already got $5 in their hand? That strikes me as a bizarre form of ‘pay it forward.’” I’m not really a coffee drinker, but if I did drink coffee and was ordering at Starbucks, I would feel a little awkward in this situation. I would probably do the pay-it-forward just because I was put on the spot since the worker asked. > [@kk\_fusion](#): > > For reasons I can’t quite put my finger on, I don’t do the drive-through. I always park and walk in even if my order is to take away in the car. And I don’t expect such a forward-thing to work inside the store where you can see the person for who you would be paying standing right behind you. Right, this situation wouldn’t come up for me since I never use drive through if at all possible. I feel uncomfortable wasting gas sitting in my car when I’m able to park and go inside. > [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > Is a bogus warm fuzzy a good thing or bad thing? > > I say bad thing. Or strictly speaking, in my experience, it’s an instant gratification (more dopamine!), but pernicious and negative in terms of bad habits and a bad outlook. It does appear to be a bad thing, in that you feel like you’ve been generous, without actually being generous, and it might make you act less generous later in the day. [Here’s an article](http://qz.com/249649/the-cold-hard-truth-about-the-ice-bucket-challenge/)about the ice bucket challenge which discusses this: > [@](#): > > A similar phenomenon has been studied in the lab by psychologists. It’s called moral licensing: the idea that doing one good action leads one to compensate by doing fewer good actions in the future. In a recent experiment, participants either selected a product from a selection of mostly “green” items (like an energy-efficient light bulb) or from a selection of mostly conventional items (like a regular light bulb). They were then told to perform a supposedly unrelated task. However, in this second task, the results were self-reported, so the participants had a financial incentive to lie; and they were invited to pay themselves out of an envelope, so they had an opportunity to steal as well. > > What happened? People who had previously purchased a green product were significantly more likely to both lie and steal than those who had purchased the conventional product. Their demonstration of ethical behavior subconsciously gave them license to act unethically when the chance arose. I don’t think anyone in the pay-it-forward chain went somewhere afterwards and tripped an old lady or stole from the homeless. But it is possible that you do something generous (or that makes you feel generous) and then you avoid an actual opportunity later in the day to help someone carry something heavy, or give money to an actual charity. > [@monstro](#): > > If I were a coffee drinker, I’d avoid any Starbucks that was promoting it’s “pay-it-forward” chain. Because I like being able to say no to stuff without reading in the virtual paper how I was the “cranky ass” who broke the chain. > > That’s how I first learned about this thing–from a Yahoo article about a woman who declined the free drink. It was right there up among the headlines about Ebola and ISIS. So it’s not like this thing has been without any social shaming–which is why the “cranky asses” are probably writing about it. I agree whole-heartedly. I’m sure some people did feel generous and payed it forward because of that. But I’m sure a good number of people were just giving into the pressure and not wanting to be called cheap. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/58 "2014-08-25T17:21:00Z")
I messed it up last week. I paid for a couple of homeless people instead. The baristas seemed pretty relieved. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Lowry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sam\_Lowry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Lowry)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/59 "2014-08-25T17:38:18Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I messed it up last week. I paid for a couple of homeless people instead. The baristas seemed pretty relieved. That’s another thing I’ve wondered about, how easy is it for the cashier? Is it no trouble at all, just a mild annoyance, or a huge headache for the workers? I’d hate to think I was doing a good thing that turned out to cause major trouble for the already often harassed workers. Has anyone ever worked at Starbucks (or anywhere else) and dealt with this? ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2014, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251/60 "2014-08-25T17:42:48Z")
I doubt most POS systems are really meant to handle paying for future tickets which is why I suspect it happens mostly in drivethrus where there’s a line of tickets that have been ordered but not paid yet, so you pay for your ticket, plus the next one. At a counter POS or a drivethru with no line, it would be kind of a pain in the ass. The best method would probably be to give the cashier a 10 and tell them to use it for their next customer. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-have-done-the-pay-it-forward-thing-at-starbucks/696251.md?page=4)