# Would you like the US to be a constitutional monarchy? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 18, 2011, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197 "2011-03-18T21:36:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/81 "2011-03-26T06:11:13Z")
> [@MonarchistLeagueLA](#): > > In the Thai example, while it is true the country enforces strict “Lese majeste” laws it is also true that in nearly every recent instance where someone was charged with violating those laws the King himself has personally intervened to dismiss all charges and pardon the individual concerned. You are a little behind the times. That stopped happening some time ago, although Westerners still keep saying it. One red-shirt lady who went by the name of Da Torpedo was sentenced to 18 years for lese majeste and spent almost a year and a half in prison with no hope in sight for a royal pardon. She was only released last month by a court, which ruled there had been some procedural issues wrong with her trial. Whether that means a new trial or not, I’m not sure, but there was no royal intervention at all, as, like I said, that seems to have ended since the king fell into such ill health. More recently, a poster on a local message board was given 15 years for what he posted. The thing is no one could find what he posted after the message board deleted it. The authorities burst into his house and took his computer away, but apparently could not find any evidence on there. Still sentenced to 15 years even though there is no physical evidence still existing. Funny, but you seem to have a similar writing style to a ceertain communist poster. Coincidence, I’m sure. ---
**Author:** ![SecretaryofEvil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@SecretaryofEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SecretaryofEvil)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/82 "2011-03-26T19:11:00Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Funny, but you seem to have a similar writing style to a ceertain communist poster. Coincidence, I’m sure. Now that you mention it, there are some some strong similarities. ---
**Author:** ![SecretaryofEvil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@SecretaryofEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SecretaryofEvil)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2011, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/83 "2011-03-26T19:30:21Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > Eh? That’s like saying republics are bad because Saddam Hussein was a thug who gassed the Kurds. > > A properly-run constitutional monarchy lets the prime minister (or whatever) get on with the dirty work of politics and running the government, while the monarch takes on the symbolic functions. > > Consider: if you are an American, and the US President called you up and asked you to do something, would you do it because "oooh, it’s the President! :: awe :: "? If yes, you are reacting to the President’s symbolic role of representing the nation, when you should be considering the practical politics of the request: is this something that the President is entitled to request of you? A constitutional monarchy lets you separate those two roles, for less confusion. > > [Disclaimer: I live in a constitutional monarchy and have the Queen on my money. 🙂] I have a hard time understanding why anyone thinks they owe anything to the Queen specifically. As a citizen of a nation, I understand that my citizenship comes with certain entitlements and certain duties. But the Queen is essentially just some woman who inherited a fancy house from ancestors who were more or less military and theocratic dictators. Most constitutional monarchies that work well are the ones where the monarch has very little practical power to affect how the nation is run. That’s why I wrote that monarchs are at their best benign. Now a monarch can do other nice stuff, like raise money for charity or say stuff like “Pip, pip, cheerio, let’s not let the Nazis get us down chaps.” (Because that’s how British people talk, right?) Of course, any prominent figure could do things like that. And monarchs can also say and do things that are detrimental to the image of the nation. Prince Philip is apparently quite fond of saying racist and offensive things. ---
**Author:** ![45backer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/9fc29f/32.png) [@45backer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/45backer)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2011, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/84 "2011-03-29T05:54:39Z")
I think we should make Rodney King the first king of America. Or Billy Jean King, but she would have to be queen. But on the reals, the British Monarch is such a drag on the country’s economy and the biggest waste of time and valuable resources on one family who, as far as I can tell, hasn’t done anything in 300 years that justifies all the pomp & circumstance they get. It would never work in America, thank God. This is the 21st century. Kings and queens???Are you kidding? ---
**Author:** ![45backer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/9fc29f/32.png) [@45backer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/45backer)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2011, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/85 "2011-03-29T05:58:01Z")
Anyway, we have the Kennedy’s here in America. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2011, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/86 "2011-03-29T13:56:39Z")
> [@45backer](#): > > But on the reals, the British Monarch is such a drag on the country’s economy and the biggest waste of time and valuable resources on one family who, as far as I can tell, hasn’t done anything in 300 years that justifies all the pomp & circumstance they get. It would never work in America, thank God. This is the 21st century. Kings and queens???Are you kidding? That’s a misconception. The monarchy actually pays for itself. From George III forward, the royals’ income has derived from the Civil List, and the income from the Crown Estates goes to the Treasury. Originally, this was just to make it easier for Parliament to keep an eye on how much the royals were spending. However, land values in Britain have risen dramatically over the last 250 years, and the Civil List now costs a tiny fraction of the revenue generated by the Crown Estates. Plus, HM and her spawn all pay income taxes like everyone else now. ---
**Author:** ![A.Gwilliam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ea5d25/32.png) [@A.Gwilliam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A.Gwilliam)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2011, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/87 "2011-03-30T01:47:26Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > That’s a misconception. The monarchy actually pays for itself. From George III forward, the royals’ income has derived from the Civil List, and the income from the Crown Estates goes to the Treasury. I don’t think what you’ve said here is in fact an adequate rebuttal, as the Crown Estate is owned by the state anyway. If the UK were a republic, the state would still receive the same income. The British monarchy costs the UK around £40 million a year. Details of the royal finances can be found via the following page: [http://www.royal.gov.uk/TheRoyalHousehold/Royalfinances/HeadofStateexpenditure.aspx](http://www.royal.gov.uk/TheRoyalHousehold/Royalfinances/HeadofStateexpenditure.aspx) At a quick glance, it seems to me that the biggest cost areas by far are (a) the salaries of some 300 staff, and (b) the maintenance costs of the various palaces. Not included in the accounts are of course the indirect benefit to the British economy that the monarchy brings via tourism, etc. This is sometimes advanced as a reason for maintaining the monarchy. In my view, though, this is something of a moot point: plenty of people go to visit Versailles, for example, and a republican UK would presumably find it fairly easy to fully open up Windsor Castle (and perhaps Buckingham Palace) to the public, resulting in much greater direct revenue. But of course a non-monarchical system would have its own costs instead; this seems to be a point that’s often forgotten. And staffing and maintaining historic palaces is never going to come cheap, regardless of whether there’s a monarchy. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/90 "2013-12-11T16:54:21Z")
> [@A.Gwilliam](#): > > I don’t think what you’ve said here is in fact an adequate rebuttal, as the Crown Estate is owned by the state anyway. If the UK were a republic, the state would still receive the same income. I’m responding to this two years late, but the Crown Estate consists not only of property held by the monarch in trust but also personal property of the Windsors. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/91 "2013-12-11T17:28:18Z")
We have had pseudo-monarchies with the Kennedys, the Clintons and the Bushes. We need a break. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/92 "2013-12-11T17:43:37Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Personally, I think a constitutional monarchy seems to work really well for those countries that have one: You have some folks whose entire job is to cut ribbons and give speeches and have sex scandals, sparing the elected folks who actually run the country from having to waste time on those things. The trick, though, is that you can’t just impose a ceremonial monarch by fiat: The only way to get a ceremonial monarch is to first go through the history of having a monarch with actual power. For a country that already has that history, like the UK, it’s a no-brainer, but for a country like us that hasn’t, it’s too steep a price to pay. I know I’m late to the party on this, but it sounds a lot like being Vice-President. ---
**Author:** ![James\_Toothpaste](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e56c9b/32.png) [@James\_Toothpaste](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/James_Toothpaste)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/93 "2013-12-11T21:50:13Z")
No, I like it as it is. ---
**Author:** ![Weeping\_Wyvern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/858c86/32.png) [@Weeping\_Wyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weeping_Wyvern)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/94 "2013-12-11T22:11:59Z")
I’m an American monarchist who believes in the divine right of kings, but I think it would be rather pointless for the United States as a country to become a monarchy. I’d rather see Alaska go to the Romanovs, Hawaii to the native Hawaiian dynasty, the Southwest to Juan Carlos I of Spain, Louisiana to whoever the French heir is these days, and the rest to Elizabeth II. Except maybe give I’ll give New Amsterdam back to the Dutch. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/95 "2013-12-11T22:37:09Z")
> [@Weeping\_Wyvern](#): > > Except maybe give I’ll give New Amsterdam back to the Dutch. Fuck that noise. Those people wear such uncomfortable shoes. Can’t we just reestablish the Iroquois League? I hear they wear moccasins. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2013, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/96 "2013-12-12T01:21:00Z")
> [@Gleena](#): > > In real terms, the monarch (which, BTW, not arguing for a monarch) or head of state has the power to force an election to solve a problem. This is seldom used but a very important tool (or threat) to force Parliament to find ways to work together. As I said, it’s been used once in Australia in 110 years since Federation. Governor General Michaëlle Jean of Canada prorogued the parliament in 2008, on the advice of Prime Minister Stephen Harper. Theoretically, at least, she did so in the name of the Queen. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2013, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/97 "2013-12-12T01:28:44Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > We have had pseudo-monarchies with the Kennedys, the Clintons and the Bushes. > > We need a break. The phenomena of the Kennedys, the Clintons and the Bushes (not to mention the Roosevelts and the Adamses), go to show how much Americans actually yearn for a monarchy (not that I think it is a healthy yearning, myself, but it seems to have some sort of deep psychological appeal). ---
**Author:** ![Weeping\_Wyvern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/858c86/32.png) [@Weeping\_Wyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weeping_Wyvern)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2013, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/98 "2013-12-12T01:49:58Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > The phenomena of the Kennedys, the Clintons and the Bushes (not to mention the Roosevelts and the Adamses), go to show how much Americans actually yearn for a monarchy (not that I think it is a healthy yearning, myself, but it seems to have some sort of deep psychological appeal). Oh it’s a very healthy yearning, but elected politicians are an unhealthy way of satisfying it. As C. S. Lewis said: “Where men are forbidden to honour a king, they honor millionaires, athletes, or film stars instead; even famous prostitutes or gangsters. For spiritual nature, like bodily nature, will be served; deny it food and it will gobble poison.” ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2013, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/99 "2013-12-12T02:57:29Z")
> [@Weeping\_Wyvern](#): > > Oh it’s a very healthy yearning, but elected politicians are an unhealthy way of satisfying it. As C. S. Lewis said: “Where men are forbidden to honour a king, they honor millionaires, athletes, or film stars instead; even famous prostitutes or gangsters. For spiritual nature, like bodily nature, will be served; deny it food and it will gobble poison.” And that’s why I’m thinking we in Canada should Canadianize our monarchy. We’ve already Canadianized things like the [1982 constitution](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_Act,_1982) and the [Canadian Heraldic Authority](http://www.gg.ca/document.aspx?id=81). I want to be Duke of Toronto. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2013, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/100 "2013-12-12T03:33:46Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > I want to be Duke of Toronto. 🙂 I’ll settle for being the Earl of Whitchurch. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2013, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/101 "2013-12-12T04:39:59Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > The phenomena of the Kennedys, the Clintons and the Bushes (not to mention the Roosevelts and the Adamses), go to show how much Americans actually yearn for a monarchy (not that I think it is a healthy yearning, myself, but it seems to have some sort of deep psychological appeal). And let’s nor forget, starting in 2017: President Chelsea Clinton. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2013, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197/102 "2013-12-12T16:22:22Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > I want to be Duke of Toronto. 🙂 > [@Spoons](#): > > I’ll settle for being the Earl of Whitchurch. 😉 Dibs on Thane of the Wascana! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-like-the-us-to-be-a-constitutional-monarchy/575197.md?page=4)