Would you vote in favor of a national lottery?

Libertarian idealism aside, if you left everyone’s fate to themselves, they wouldn’t have any insurance, establish any money for their retirement, wouldn’t send all their children to school, would drive their cars at insane speeds on residential streets, etc.

For as much as you might joke that stupid people get what’s coming to them, ultimately all of us are at least shortsighted at critical moments or simply don’t have time/inclination to educate ourselves on financing or whatever, and even those who truly are stupid are as much a danger to themselves as they are prey to anyone who can put two cents together. The government’s role is to see to the health of the nation, and so they’ve got to take the lowest common denominator in hand. The only other option is to euthanize anyone with an IQ below 80.

I love how people are so caring and worried about the plight of the poor that they’re willing to make financial decisions for them. :rolleyes:

‘Don’t worry poor folks! You’re so dumb and always screw up your lives; here, let me make your choices for you.’

I’d prefer a much smaller government; but since that isn’t happening any time soon I’d vote for any method of funding government that doesn’t involve forcing citizens to hand over half their paycheck with the threat of prison. A ‘voluntary tax’ of the lottery sort is nothing but good in my opinion.

Of course playing the lottery can make you rich, how could the answer to that possibly be no? the chances of that happening are infinitesimaly low but the answer is unequivocally yes.

What’s your alternate suggestion, then? Or is your argument that people, left to themselves, do properly set aside money for their and their children’s futures? If you go to Japan and look at everyone’s teeth, I think you’ll see what happens when dental care isn’t a standard part of everyone’s employment package.

There is no alternative suggested. In my view, the benefits of freedom of choice outweigh the costs of bad decision making. Obviously, your mileage varies.

Yeah I’d say that I’d rather not live in a country where 80% of everyone had teeth like this or this. Sort of diminishes the marriage pool.

And note that those pictures are the “better” and “worst” ends of the spectrum. The average of guys in their 40s is between those two.

Sucks to be them. Are you seriously blaming their employers for that? My dental health is nobody’s responsibility but my own. I would resent any attempt by others to make decisions concerning my oral hygiene for me.

I’d vote yes.

Of course poor people play it more than the more educated and wealthy. But I don’t see it as my job to save people from their own bad decisions.

I’m a Democrat, and it’s one of the things I dislike about my party is this paternalistic attitude.

I’m blaming the shortsightedness of 70% of the population. You can try to convince yourself that most people are decently wise, but it’s pretty easy to find data that a large majority of people won’t plan for their future health or fiscal welfare if you don’t essentially make them.

Here’s the best cite I can find for the dispropensity of people to save, previous to social security acts being put into place in the United States:

[

](Social Security History)
(bolding added)

Back to the question: a national lottery?..

For those of you opposed, how is your opposition to a national lottery different from a general opposition to gambling, and more specifically, regulated gambling–or at least an opposition to allowing the poor to engage in regulated gambling?

I got it that some of you feel we need to manage the poor’s money for them. I personally feel if you plug up one area they waste it on, they’ll find other places to manage their money poorly. Given that managing the other guy’s money is a non-starter for any kind of workable policy, what’s wrong with a voluntary tax?

And a freebie marketing tag, if I were in charge of marketing:

"The US Lottery: Hope, sensibly priced."

Now that would get them poor coughing up their tuppence like there’s no tomorrow. (Which there isn’t, financially speaking, if you gamble too much.)

You would have to use any profits to feed back into the cycle. Yeah that would be a gifted philosophy.

Most gambling, you usually need to go pretty far out of your way to get to (though with the surge in Indian Casinos, not so much these days.) While as legalised lotteries are generally available at any gas station or convenience store.

A once a decade blow-out in Vegas is pretty small pickings compared to the weekly “lottery tax” in the long run. And the poorer you are, the harder it is to get to Vegas or wherever.

The number of people who participate will also almost always be hire if only due to peer pressure. “Hey Bill, what numbers did you pick?”

The poor do not gamble because they are stupid. They gamble because even though it is a small chance to get out, it is a chance.

The majority of people, rich or poor, are morons, but so what? People make poor decisions. That’s part of the risk involved in being an autonomous free individual. Freedom or security, there is always a trade off. Prisoners and slaves are usually kept well-fed, safe, and healthy, but for some reason I don’t find myself envying them.

So poor people don’t have enough money to save and often go into debt. That’s news?

If you could point to me which part of the constitution permits the federal government to hold a lottery, then I’d vote in favor of it. Otherwise, no. The government is already throwing too many schemes that the constitution doesn’t authorize. I’m not one of those ‘eliminate the evil federal government’ people, but I feel like they’re fully large as they ever should reasonably get. If they need more resources, then they can just retrain the DEA to fight in Iraq or build houses or conduct the census.

Many states have lotteries; those who want to participate can play in a state that allows it.

So what’s your suggested solution? Fuck 'em, let them die?

For every dollar they spend on the lottery, it’s one dollar plus 40 years interest lost that the remaining 30% of everyone has to pay in taxes to support those people in their old age, assuming that social security exists. Without social security, it’s one dollar plus 40 years interest less that 70% of the population has to provide for themselves after retirement, which means starvation and death. So the options are to either bail out stupid people for playing the lottery, or saying “You deserve to die.”

I agree that there’s some percentage of people stupid enough that I don’t really care if they run themselves into a hole, but that percentage is significantly smaller than 70% of the entire US population.

If you want to raise money to fund some special program, use normal taxes. Those are (theoretically) balanced to raise money in a way that doesn’t screw the people who can’t afford it, without hurting the economy driving power of those who can afford it. Taxing the poor just adds a layer of overhead to the system of taxing the wealthy, because any way you play it, that’s who’s going to pay.

So, if you personally don’t open a casino you are making financial decisions for others?

I don’t care if someone gambles. I DO care if someone who is operating in my name (the government) is taking advantage of the foolish.

There is a huge difference between allowing something and promoting or sponsoring it.

I would also object if my government were involved in weightloss schemes or selling those detox stickers for the bottoms of your feet. I don’t want the sale of these things to be illegal; I just don’t want it done in my name. And everything done by the government is done in my name.

What’s your solution? Force them to put money they don’t have into a bank account and never withdraw, even if they really need it?

I mean, it isn’t a shock that poor people can’t afford investment banking, as that’s almost the definition of being poor. You can’t teach them or force them to save money; they don’t have any.

Now, granted, they could put that dollar-a-day lotto money in a savings account, earning a hefty 0.5% return. But who are you to decide that for them? Maybe they really like playing the lottery. It is a matter of opportunity cost. For people like you and me, 0.5% is a lot better than a certain loss. For some people, dreams, even impossible ones, are worth that loss. People think nerds are stupid for wasting their money on cheap plastic Star Wars toys or those audiophiles who spend a hundred dollars on speaker wire. But that’s their choice. They did the mental calculations and to them, lottery tickets, cheap plastic kids’ toys, and gold-plated speaker wire are all worth the opportunity cost of that lost 0.5% investment.

I agree. No advantage should be taken. Citizens need to be informed (via PSAs, billboards, etc.) that lotteries are not a dream machine, that they WILL lose, and that the more they play, the more money they will lose. After that, if adults still feel that it is worth their money to play, I don’t think the government should turn down that free, voluntarily donated cash.

And if everything the government does is done in your name, then you are a violent psychopath. Seriously. The government is not you, you are not the government, and nobody will ever be fooled into thinking otherwise.

If they don’t have money, how are they gambling it away? 70% of the population isn’t at a poverty level where they couldn’t invest in their future. Most are at a level where they would choose to buy a Wii/lottery ticket/hooker n’ blow so as to keep up with the joneses or just to have a good time instead of saving up for their retirement. If you hold that money from them, they don’t buy the Wii, et al and they do contribute to social security.

I’m the guy who pays for them to goof off beyond their means. Why should I be taxed to pay for people who would rather buy a lottery ticket than plan for their future?

I really don’t mean this as harshly as it will sound, but this is a bunch of nanny state paternalistic nonsense. I don’t need to be protected from myself and I give my fellow man enough credit to believe they can make rational decisions. Lotteries post the odds of winning prominently and one’s choice to participate is no different from any other voluntary exchange in our society.

I would actually answer no to the OP’s question because I don’t believe the government should hold a monopoly on gambling in the first place. The odds they offer are shameful, only 50% of the prize money is returned to the player. They use the force of the government to prevent competition from taking a piece of the pie. If I had my way I would regulate the information every gambling entity must post prominently when they sell their game and tax those entities like any other corporation.

What is really unethical is that the government rigs the odds in their favor and then sets an insurmountable barrier to its potential competition. I have never bought a lottery ticket, but if private industry were allowed in it could be a reasonably rational decision to do so.