I loved being an E5 in the Navy. If I’d have stayed in I would be retiring as a Master Chief next year.
Out here middle management, not so much. Having people snap to and obeying orders isn’t the same.
So I quit all that and opened a shop with one partner. I relish the day we have 50* minions Bwahahahahaha! Me at the top, life will be grand.
*Hell right now I’d settle for a part time minion that will clean the bathroom once a week.
I am and I hate it. I’ve been with my company (grocery chain) for over 8 years, and I thought I knew what the management role would entail.
I badly underestimated how much of my life it would consume. I feel like I’m at work all the time, and when I’m not at work, I’m thinking about work. I’m putting in 12, 13, 14 hour days in a grocery store and getting 5 - 6 hours of sleep every night. I am pulled in so many directions – I have to do my work, assist with much of my boss’s work, deal with idiot employees, handle stupid customer complaints, and so much more – when in the past, I could just call one of my managers to help me out.
In my old position, I handled customers all day long face-to-face and I loved it. In addition, the only person who could ruin my day was me. Now, I have to rely on my 100 associates to do their jobs well every day so that I have a good one.
I’d worked in 5 stores for dozens of managers in my old position, and I never once could say that I hated my job. I’ve often hated my managers and my stores, but I have never hated my job. But, right now, I hate my job.
My store manager is on vacation, and that’s the only reason I haven’t yet talked to her about giving up the position and resuming my old duties at a different location. When she gets back, we’re going to have an awkward, difficult, necessary conversation.
I wouldn’t mind. I’ve managed before, had a gas station, and while software engineers are more immature and whiny than teenagers and retired folks, I’ve done this job long enough that I’d not be too afraid to deal with the endless meetings and paperwork.
I’d much rather stay an engineer, tho.
I’ve been “the boss” for so long, it’s always kind of been my job. I’ve managed departments, projects, a software development team, divisions, even took over and ran a company for about a year and a half before I sold it. I was the head of my company’s 401(k) selection committee in 2002, whereupon in 2004 3 of our selected funds were top-5 in their category. I was once given 75 hours to pull a team together and get them to work over the weekend for a RFP bid that a previous employee had completely dropped, one that amounted to $5 million in business. Hell, I even write manuals (over 500 pages worth, chock full o’ screenshots and examples) that are designed so that the users can contribute (they don’t, however. It’s just the nature of the User. 
).
It’s just what I do. I like making decisions and I’ve been through enough in the business world to stand by them without much worry* - most of them will be good and those that aren’t aren’t unfixable. I was like this when I was a kid - I was always the one organizing all the other kids into yard-rolling extravaganzas and bike jumping contests.
I’m a pretty easy-going boss - I don’t demand, I ask, train, and then expect. I say “please” and “thank you” all the time - why not? You can attract more flies with honey than with vinegar, right? I don’t yell, but I don’t need to: when I’m pissed, it’s easily noticed. My door is always open, but I’m usually wandering the office anyway. I never have a meeting without an agenda, and my agendas (if possible) are always oriented to resolving whatever issue then and there. “Make the damn decision and move on.”
“Life balance” is important with me and I tell my employees stuff like “Look, it’ll look good on your resume in 7 years and will provide a great example when the interviewers ask you ‘when have you gone all out for the team?’” or “You get paid $27k/year, x vacation days, and y sick days. You don’t get a bonus or even a pat on the back if you don’t use up your days… so use them.” I’m not emotionally chained to the office with worry, nor do I expect anybody else to be.
I have one employee whose father died this week - I’m not going to charge her for the four days missed: if I did that, she wouldn’t have enough days for her planned October vacation. Apparently, some places would do that, making her cut her vacation short because she took off when her father died, but I can’t see what’s gained by such a policy - all you do is piss off employees, both her and all those who hear her tale. (Yeah, she could possibly FMLA it, true. I tend to work in small companies that fall outside FMLA control, however.)
I’m not perfect - I’ll have periods where I have too many frying pans in the fire (or one of the fires explodes on me) and I’ll have to let some of my other responsibilities slide. There are some personality types that I prefer not to work with and when they’ve been with me, I haven’t been at my best.
So, anyway, I just wanted to give my side of the story since all of y’all seem to hate a job that I actually enjoy.
*Worry is when you wake up on Monday morning, have a $5,290 payroll due on Thursday (by 2:00pm) and you have $1,324.03 in the corporate accounts and 12,500 in receivables that doesn't have to be paid off another 10 days. Repeat week after week. After that, eh, making a decision on a RFP to accept a .5650/unit counteroffer or stick to your original $.5775/unit quote isn’t really sweatworthy.
Bambi Hassenpfeffer are you [Chad Vader](Bambi Hassenpfeffer)?
Seriously though, I’ve managed several businesses, and I’ve had almost zero complaints from those I supervised. Co-managing conflicts with same level idiots aside.
I didn’t get any sort of “power trip” as a result of being in charge, but I did gain a sense of responsibility, and a sense of employee retention. I ran the office that my Dad and I worked at, he was the Chief Engineer, I was his assistant. I took care of the hiring, firing, receiving, shipping, DSL troubleshooting, payroll, scheduling, and most of the communication with the head office.
There were a few times that my Dad questioned my decisions. I would tell him that we had a good set of Temp workers, we need to make sure things keep going smoothly. There were a few times that I had to drop people, but they were part of a temp service, so they weren’t just out on the street.
We never missed a deadline, even the ridiculous ones, and always provided a quality product.
I would rather be “in management” than just a worker, that’s just a generalization.
I would never want to be a CEO COO or CFO, but I’ll manage people anytime, I can get things done and have my employees like me as well.
Having spent 17 years in the IT field and having worked closely with Actuaries (and having had one as a room-mate for 3 years), I agree.
Many people in these fields do not have a lot of people management skills in the first place, and I think that upper levels tend to select for organizational skills (being organized, e-mailing, attending meetings) rather than the critical skills of actually dealing with the people who report to them.
Unfortunately, now I’m in the Security field and I can say with some confidence that my current boss was promoted for the same reasons through her previous career as a Police Officer, with the added benefit that she was a woman when they desperately needed to be promoting women. She’s a great Bureaucrat, but a lousy manager of people.
The best places that I have worked were constantly sending their supervisors and managers to training classes to improve their management skills. Unfortunately, those places are few and far between.
On my own end, I was outright offered a position as IT Manager in 1996. No interview necessary. Mine if I wanted it. I turned it down flat. At the time, I was working 25 hours a week (M-F, 7am-noon) for $32/hour, or roughly $40k for part time work. The Management job required 70+ hours a week (M-F 6am-6pm FIRM, plus additional time as needed), required me to wear a suit and tie at all times (I hadn’t worn a tie since 1989) and only paid $75k. Three times the work for less than twice the pay? No thanks.
I’ve been an IT Project Leader and a Security Supervisor. Having grown and changed a little, I think I could handle a management position now.
Why? I’m union, and hourly. I work 24-40 hours a week (24 is my schedule, but they like me to come in for extra).
I have time to pursue school, outside interests, etc. Meanwhile, I have a quick mind, a wealth of institutional knowledge, and the respect of many of the hospital employees I interact with. I also, functionally, direct my coworkers on many of my shifts, and I get a whole dollar extra an hour for doing it, without having to deal with any of the messy HR stuff.
The “bosses” all work at least 60 hours a week, salary. I have come in on occasion to see my boss in the same outfit she was wearing when I left. (I hate that. She’s great, and doesn’t need to run herself into the ground like that.)
Now, I am working towards becoming an MD, which could involve a certain amount of “being the boss”. Not sure how that’s going to work, but probably better than it would if I were a boss where I currently am.
(Practically, I couldn’t be, here. I’m not a Med Tech.)
I am a peon and work this kind of schedule, but I get O.T. As a manager I would be expected to do the same, but as a salaried employee. It sure doesn’t sound like the route I want to take (unless the salary reflects the hours worked…which it rarely does). I just had this conversation with Mr. K. He seems to think a promotion is more valuable than what I’m doing now, but I’m not so sure I agree.
If more managers were like you, attitudes would be different; most of our impressions of bosses are of people who are out of their depth and try to make up for it by being overbearing, or are plain old Type A psychos.
Good on ya, JohnT!
Certainly not, for most of the same reasons outlined in this thread: Don’t want the responsibility/added headache and stress. It’s just not something I’d be good at either. I’m good at fixing things and making them work. (I do software support and development for a small company.) I want to manage information, not manage people.
At least in this company, being a manager doesn’t mean you make more money. We have a very flat hierarchy; there’s one “team lead” who functions as a supervisor, but that’s about it other than the owner. And I make a fair amount more than her.
Maybe it’s shortsighted of me, and I know I could make more managing elsewhere, but I’m not interested.
I am the boss. I have pretty much always been the boss, and I don’t expect things to change anytime soon. I can get a monkey job, doesn’t matter. When I stayed home with the kids for 13 years, I ran our business, I ran mom/volunteer/school groups and I coached. Now that my youngest is getting old enough for school, I’m ramping it up for the business.
I’m kinda smart, somewhat personable, pretty organized, have a good work ethic, and I can be a spaz.
Eventually I’ll be smart enough to keep my mouth shut, move to a town where I am unknown, never have eye contact with anyone I talk to, and display ineptitude in all things. Until then, I am screwed.
No. I had one fling with management (albeit at a company that in hindsight was a slow-motion car wreck), hated it, and have no ambition to be in charge of anything or anybody. I make what I view as plenty of money now and would much rather be down in the trenches doing something that’s obviously useful, as I see it.
There might be enough money in the world to convince me to take up management, but it’s a safe bet that no rational company would pay me the salary I would require to do such a thing.
My job is something I do that I may afford to live my life as I desire. From 9:15 to 5:15 Monday through Thursday and 9:15 to 4:15 on Friday I aim to be the very best there is at what I do. I haven’t yet managed to be the best at what I do, but I’m coming closer all the time. For the rest of the time in my life, I do not want to have to spare a single thought to my job. I have never seen a managerial-type position where one could perform the position competantly and not have the job spread to the rest of their life like ink in water.
I do not want authority. I do not want responsibility for anything external to the correct, efficient and timely performance of my own function. I want to do what I do and do it well. I don’t want to have to spend my time worrying about if Susie is abusing the leave system or if Tom is pulling his weight - or dealing with office politics, client relations (outside my own little sphere). I particularly do not want my performance and productivity rated based in any part on the behavior and actions of others, as would be the case if I were anything other than a peon.
I have been a manager, and I was a *very good * one. I was miserable, though. And I had no real life. The improvement in the quality of my life is worth the differential in pay to me.
Well, I’ll be the only person to disagree. When I was at Bell Labs I enjoyed being a first level supervisor. I could support good ideas my people had, and I got to come up with some good ones myself. Budgets were a pain, especially the way we did them, but performance review was actually not too bad. Our department was close knit, lots of people moved between groups, and it was done as fairly as possible. (I’ve seen worse.)
Now, I was acting second level manager for a while, and I hated that, since that is 100% budgets and politics. But there, at least, first level managers without technical credibility got eaten alive. Those with good technical and people skills seemed to do well.
I’ve managed between 5 and 16 people, and five is better. I’m not a manager now, since we flattened and I only had three people in my group, but that’s okay since I can do what I want and have lots of outside hobbies. But I do kind of miss having a few people to supervise.