# Would you want to send your kid to a "Public School Social Justice Factory"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 1, 2018, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982 "2018-02-01T20:54:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 4\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2018, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/341 "2018-02-14T23:03:49Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > Well… _No_. Not really. Not at all. The key thing about McCarthyism was _not_ that sometimes, you could get kicked out of college for wrongthink (let alone that you could lose an invitation to a speaking arrangement, or have angry students yelling at you). . I didnt want to quote your entire post but you did a great job discussing your point. You have made me agree that yes, covering “old” topics is still worthwhile. However I still dont see the problem with pointing out that new issues arise all the time and many of those echo back to the issues of the past. Another thing is how can we keep this relevant to the problems the students will encounter in modern life? For example, they wont see “white only” signs above bathrooms anymore but how will they react to a “[no whites allowed](http://newbostonpost.com/around-the-web/no-whites-allowed-space-demanded-at-university-of-michigan/)” sign? Isnt part of the thinking process looking at old issues and seeing modern analogies? If we as a society dont keep vigilant and nip problems in the bud, how can we keep history from repeating itself? Finally, can we agree that problems can come from either side of the political spectrum? I googled “new McCarthyism” and found many [hits including this](http://www.debate.org/opinions/is-political-correctness-the-new-mccarthyism). ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2018, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/342 "2018-02-14T23:48:07Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Another thing is how can we keep this relevant to the problems the students will encounter in modern life? For example, they wont see “white only” signs above bathrooms anymore but how will they react to a “[no whites allowed](http://newbostonpost.com/around-the-web/no-whites-allowed-space-demanded-at-university-of-michigan/)” sign? There aren’t any “no whites allowed” signs anywhere in the [actual facts of the story that your inaccurate clickbait link seems to be referencing](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2017/03/01/a-group-demanded-a-space-for-students-of-color-now-they-say-theyre-being-called-racists/?utm_term=.d0bd1e7b0367): > [@](#): > > A student organization has attracted a firestorm of criticisms after it demanded that administrators create a space for students of color to organize. […] > > “I think it’s just been a really interesting firestorm. Because we asked for a space for students of color, people automatically assumed that no white students would be allowed, whereas that’s never explicit in the language,” Vikrant Garg, one of the group’s organizers, told The Washington Post. […] > > The specific demand that has attracted criticism calls on university officials to create a designated space for students of color “to organize and do social justice work.” The members said in the letter that they want a space separate from the multicultural center that already exists on campus “because we want a space solely dedicated to community organizing and social justice work specifically for people of color.” […] > > University spokesman Rick Fitzgerald said administration officials and have been in “ongoing discussions” with Students4Life to better understand their concerns. > > “We fully understand at this moment that they’re not asking for space that is exclusionary in any way, that they want to do social justice work in the university,” Fitzgerald said of the group’s demands. “That’s one of the many things that we’re continuing to work on.” In other words, what the group wanted was a space devoted to activism and organizing for issues specific to people of color. It’s the reactionary hysteria of a bunch of heavily projecting white conservatives that transformed that in their minds and their media to a proposal for a space that white people would be literally banned from. > [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Finally, can we agree that problems can come from either side of the political spectrum? > > I googled “new McCarthyism” and found many [hits including this](http://www.debate.org/opinions/is-political-correctness-the-new-mccarthyism). Sure, I don’t see anybody disagreeing with the contention that problems can come from either side of the political spectrum. However, I don’t think your link to a bunch of comments from anonymous whiners on a messageboard carries any more weight as factual evidence than the bunch of comments from anonymous whiners on a messageboard (including yours truly, natch) that constitutes the bulk of this thread right here. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2018, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/343 "2018-02-15T02:25:06Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > I didnt want to quote your entire post but you did a great job discussing your point. > > You have made me agree that yes, covering “old” topics is still worthwhile. > However I still dont see the problem with pointing out that new issues arise all the time and many of those echo back to the issues of the past. > > Another thing is how can we keep this relevant to the problems the students will encounter in modern life? For example, they wont see “white only” signs above bathrooms anymore but how will they react to a “[no whites allowed](http://newbostonpost.com/around-the-web/no-whites-allowed-space-demanded-at-university-of-michigan/)” sign? They probably won’t, since they’re extremely unlikely to encounter a single one of those signs in their lives. Extraordinarily few people will. That’s what distinguishes these signs from Jim Crow signs, which were pervasive in their culture and enforced by both police and terrorists, sometimes one and the same. The analogy is ridiculous. > [@](#): > > I googled “new McCarthyism” and found many [hits including this](http://www.debate.org/opinions/is-political-correctness-the-new-mccarthyism). When I say this is a dumb analogy, I’m not saying it’s original to you. Plenty of people who either don’t understand McCarthyism or who have a crazy-ass big ax to grind incorrectly compare it to “political correctness.” ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2018, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/344 "2018-02-15T09:25:53Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > However I still dont see the problem with pointing out that new issues arise all the time and many of those echo back to the issues of the past. I agree! But one thing that history does for us is allow time for reflection. For example: could you have guessed in 2015 just how significant Trump would end up being to American history? Can you tell me now, with certainty, how important the Russia investigation and Trump’s interference in it are going to be for the course of American history? And this matters, because history is often only clear after the fact. McCarthyism ended up being pretty important. Other historical movements which may have seemed important at the time might not have been. I’m not the _biggest_ history buff, so it’s easier for me to take an analogy from Music. 1969 was a _good_ year for Rock. Led Zeppelin II, Abbey Road, Tommy, _Woodstock_… And yet, the #1 hit of that year is a song you probably have only ever heard of _because_ it’s so forgettable now: “Sugar Sugar” by the Archies. Yes, _those_ [Archies](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9nE2spOw_o). So… it’s _hard_ to make these calls ahead of time. This is where I see the moves away from free speech on college campuses (and yes, there _is_ a bit of a move in this direction). Is this an important movement, that actually will mean something 10 years from now? _Maybe_. The trend moving to Google (possibly the single most important non-government entity on the planet) is a sign that it might become more important, but for now, we just don’t know. And sure, we can bring up historical parallels. But we should do so _carefully_. Otherwise, we’re just going to end up making really bad comparisons, blowing things way out of proportion, misreading historical context, and misleading students. This is _especially_ true when it comes to issues which are parts of the culture war, because you’re going to end up with a whole bunch of pundits trying to put their “spin” on any given story, and there will be a lot of confusion about just the basic facts. Case in point: > [@](#): > > Another thing is how can we keep this relevant to the problems the students will encounter in modern life? For example, they wont see “white only” signs above bathrooms anymore but how will they react to a “[no whites allowed](http://newbostonpost.com/around-the-web/no-whites-allowed-space-demanded-at-university-of-michigan/)” sign? There’s no such sign, and comparing this attempt at a safe space to the oppression of Jim Crow is not reasonable, for all the reasons I outlined before. And no white person is going to get lynched or arrested for setting foot in a black “safe space” on campus. And if political correctness actually were “the new McCarthyism”, we wouldn’t have a president who bragged on camera about grabbing women by the pussy. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982.md?page=17)