# Would you want to send your kid to a "Public School Social Justice Factory"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 1, 2018, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982 "2018-02-01T20:54:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Ass\_For\_A\_Hat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ec9cab/32.png) [@Ass\_For\_A\_Hat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ass_For_A_Hat)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/21 "2018-02-01T22:34:01Z")
Many Twin Cities residents will recognize this author, Katherine Kersten. She’s mostly known for her near constant editorializing the the local papers about the systematic persecution of whites and Christians. Her diatribes are always so divorced from reality that I find them to be completely useless. This particular one was mailed to everyone in Edina…and to some in neighboring Minneapolis. I’ve given up reading her, so I’m not going to jump in to the point-by-point on this, but I will share this [counterpoint](http://www.startribune.com/counterpoint-edina-schools-to-this-white-male-there-s-no-culture-of-intimidation/450147873/) from an actual student at Edina High School. I was not shocked to learn that he does not recognize the school that Kersten describes. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/22 "2018-02-01T22:35:36Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > Well, We read Darwin and Marx and Stanton and Wollstonecraft. Of course, we also read Adam Smith and Horace Mann, if that gets me any credit on the other side. We read King, and talk about how the rhetoric of “outside agitators” and the problem of “white moderates” still persist. We take white privilege for granted and talk about its effects. > > I suspect I’d be happy to \*\*teach \*\*a professional development Drudge would describe as “racial equality re-education” and that some of the conversations I’d encourage would sound like “confessing white guilt” to someone who is looking to be offended and frantically trying to protect a fragile sense of self. > > I mean, I stood in front of the class today and talked about how the stereotypes of people of African descent as hyper-sexual were used by WHITE slave apologists both to warn that abolition would lead to rape of white women and to suggest that all the mixed race slaves were the product of Black temptresses looking for an advantage, not rape. Is that “confessing white guilt”? No, I guess not. Because your just talking about the issue in general. But what are the expected outcomes of such “training”? How does a person “pass” such a course? For example, if you made every white person stand up, confess “white guilt”, and apologize to every person of color for the “crimes” of their white ancestors - I’d have a problem with that. What if a person refuses should they be denied a job? ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/23 "2018-02-01T22:39:50Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > For example, if you made every white person stand up, confess “white guilt”, and apologize to every person of color for the “crimes” of their white ancestors - I’d have a problem with that. > > What if a person refuses should they be denied a job? This is a Straw Man that isn’t happening, so there’s no point in answering it as if it is. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/24 "2018-02-01T22:44:25Z")
> [@Ass\_For\_A\_Hat](#): > > Many Twin Cities residents will recognize this author, Katherine Kersten. She’s mostly known for her near constant editorializing the the local papers about the systematic persecution of whites and Christians. Her diatribes are always so divorced from reality that I find them to be completely useless. This particular one was mailed to everyone in Edina…and to some in neighboring Minneapolis. > > I’ve given up reading her, so I’m not going to jump in to the point-by-point on this, but I will share this [counterpoint](http://www.startribune.com/counterpoint-edina-schools-to-this-white-male-there-s-no-culture-of-intimidation/450147873/) from an actual student at Edina High School. I was not shocked to learn that he does not recognize the school that Kersten describes. Yes, it was a well written rebuttal. Did you read any of the comments? Some agree and some dont and some ask for other students from the other side to give their input. But here is the kicker - what if the news outlet wont publish letters from the opposite side? What if conservative writers feel intimidated from speaking out? When it comes down to it people just want more information. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/25 "2018-02-01T22:46:15Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > This is a Straw Man that isn’t happening, so there’s no point in answering it as if it is. Well ok, I was just asking what the goal of such “training” is supposed to be? How does one “pass”? Can a person “fail”? ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/26 "2018-02-01T22:50:08Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > No, I guess not. Because your just talking about the issue in general. But what are the expected outcomes of such “training”? How does a person “pass” such a course? > > For example, if you made every white person stand up, confess “white guilt”, and apologize to every person of color for the “crimes” of their white ancestors - I’d have a problem with that. > > What if a person refuses should they be denied a job? Compared to a normal Professional development, that sounds fantastic. Way better than watching Yet Another Movie Clip and describing How I Will Use What I Saw in My Classroom or, that crowd favorite, SWOTing our data. And I will confess white guilt ALL DAY LONG if it gets me out of an Icebreaker where I am given the opportunity to Share Out. Really, honestly, anything that doesn’t involve chart paper and I’m good. More seriously, that is a total strawman. You just made it up. We can both make up things all day long. ---
**Author:** ![Ass\_For\_A\_Hat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ec9cab/32.png) [@Ass\_For\_A\_Hat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ass_For_A_Hat)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/27 "2018-02-01T22:56:54Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Did you read any of the comments? Newspaper comments section? You can’t be serious. > [@Urbanredneck](#): > > …what if the news outlet wont publish letters from the opposite side? Huh??? This thing was picked up by conservative media everywhere. Including the Minneapolis Star Tribune. > [@Urbanredneck](#): > > What if conservative writers feel intimidated from speaking out? Yes, the intimidation the the wealthiest, most politically powerful people in Minnesota has to be stopped.:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/28 "2018-02-01T23:16:17Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Yes, it was a well written rebuttal. > > Did you read any of the comments? Some agree and some dont and some ask for other students from the other side to give their input. > > But here is the kicker - what if the news outlet wont publish letters from the opposite side? What if conservative writers feel intimidated from speaking out? > > When it comes down to it people just want more information. What if you found a hard news source on the subject _instead of an advocacy piece_? What if you looked at the article about [The Edina Public School System](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edina_Public_Schools) in wikipedia and found absolutely no mention of this idea? ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/29 "2018-02-01T23:36:12Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Well ok, I was just asking what the goal of such “training” is supposed to be? How does one “pass”? Can a person “fail”? No, you weren’t asking. You were claiming that the school district was doing this and railing against it. Now you’re claiming that you’re just JAQing off. What a cowardly way to defend your position. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/30 "2018-02-01T23:46:39Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > But here is the kicker - what if the news outlet wont publish letters from the opposite side? What if conservative writers feel intimidated from speaking out? What if liberals jumped out of bushes and attacked conservative children with chainsaws, you ask? Why yes! That would probably be bad! You’ve sure got me there! ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/31 "2018-02-02T00:08:09Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > When it comes down to it people just want more information. No. When it comes down to it, _some_ people just want more information _that echoes and reinforces their existing worldview_. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/32 "2018-02-02T01:01:18Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > But here is the kicker - what if the news outlet wont publish letters from the opposite side? What if conservative writers feel intimidated from speaking out? [The answers to all your questions.](http://famouspoetsandpoems.com/poets/shel_silverstein/poems/14819) ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/33 "2018-02-02T01:52:08Z")
In case anyone’s interested, here’s the [Edina Public School](https://www.edinaschools.org/Page/1) website. Here’s the [All for All report](https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.edinaschools.org%2Fcms%2Flib%2FMN01909547%2FCentricity%2FDomain%2F355%2FALLforALL-Report.pdf). And this is the controversial goal. > [@](#): > > Measured growth and high achievement for each and every student > without predictable links to race and income I don’t see a goal of social justice, I see a goal of closing a gap. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/34 "2018-02-02T02:10:31Z")
[ > [@](#): > > QUOTE=kunilou;20762680. > > I don’t see a goal of social justice, I see a goal of closing a gap. That’s the good kind of social justice ---
**Author:** ![Llama\_Llogophile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@Llama\_Llogophile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Llama_Llogophile)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/35 "2018-02-02T02:29:44Z")
What is it with conservatives and BS news stories about supposed outrages in education? This reminds me of the time a few years ago a friend was spluttering about how schools no longer teach about the Holocaust for fear of offending Muslims. After looking into it I pointed out three things wrong with that claim: 1. It was from several years ago, not a recent development as he’d suggested 2. This was in the UK, not the U.S. 3. Perhaps most importantly, IT NEVER HAPPENED. Snopes had [this about a very isolated incident, if you can call it that.](https://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/holocaust.asp) So I’m wondering, do Drudge and the like purposely distort this sort of thing, or just wait for people like my friend to misunderstand and run with it, telling all their friends? ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/36 "2018-02-02T02:53:45Z")
> [@Llama\_Llogophile](#): > > So I’m wondering, do Drudge and the like purposely distort this sort of thing Yes. American right wing media is filled to the brim with patently false tales designed with one intent - make their audience angry. Because angry is addictive, and that addiction keeps them coming back for more. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/37 "2018-02-02T03:21:28Z")
Of course not. Do you happen to know of a school district that in engaged in such behavior? (The Edina district clearly is not.) ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/38 "2018-02-02T03:28:17Z")
It’s the Weakly Standard, which means it’s mostly lies and fake news. So meh. When come back, bring REPUTABLE cite… ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/39 "2018-02-02T03:54:13Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Yes. American right wing media is filled to the brim with patently false tales designed with one intent - make their audience angry. Because angry is addictive, and that addiction keeps them coming back for more. This, coupled with an irrational hostility toward public education, suffice to explain the OP’s cite. The pattern is: 1. Cite something outrageous from public education. 2. Respond to examination of it with vague generalities/what ifs/statements about how we’re nitpicking to actually look at the details. 3. Abandon the effort. 4. GOTO 1. My educated guess is that within a month we’ll have another thread started in GD about some new educational outrage that will also turn out to be a big fat nothing and will follow the same pattern. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2018, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982/40 "2018-02-02T04:17:59Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Yes. American right wing media is filled to the brim with patently false tales designed with one intent - make their audience angry. That is completely not true. Right-wing media also has the intent to make their audience fearful. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-want-to-send-your-kid-to-a-public-school-social-justice-factory/807982.md?page=3)