# Would YOU write a letter of apology to a professor? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 22, 2017, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503 "2017-02-22T20:02:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/1 "2017-02-22T20:02:55Z")
A couple of months ago an Orange County college student secretly recorded his teacher ranting on Trump. This was posted on social media. [LINK](http://www.redstate.com/patterico/2017/02/17/punching-back-student-suspended-filming-professors-anti-trump-rant-threatens-lawsuit/) Now the administration has suspended the student and told him if he wants back in, he should write a 3 age apology. The student has refused and is now preparing a countersuit. Now my question is, would you? Lets say you were in a college class where yes, technically, students were not supposed to record professors. BUT, people did it all the time and she really was going off on a rant and you needed proof. To me this is nothing more than a free speech issue. This was a public college where funding comes from the local community. Its not a corporation or a private college. Lets say then the college went after you. Would you apologize? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/2 "2017-02-22T20:05:31Z")
Sure, I’d apologize if I did something I wasn’t supposed to do. It doesn’t matter that others did it too. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/3 "2017-02-22T20:06:06Z")
I have no problem writing apologies to professors if I am wrong; in fact, I’ve done it before (although not 3 pages.) But in this instance, the student was not wrong. So he shouldn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/4 "2017-02-22T20:32:14Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Lets say you were in a college class where yes, technically, students were not supposed to record professors. BUT, people did it all the time and she really was going off on a rant and you needed proof. To me this is nothing more than a free speech issue. This was a public college where funding comes from the local community. Its not a corporation or a private college. Yes, it’s a free speech issue. But maybe not how you think. The kids’ attorney has as much as admitted this: he called the suspension “an attack by leftists in academia to protect the expressive rights of their radical instructors” [emphasis added]. IOW, even the kid’s attorney thinks the instructors’ expressive rights were under attack. So the kid violated a law in order to try to attack the expressive rights of a professor. Your claim is that because the law is often violated, but violations that don’t attack expressive rights are generally not punished, it’s unfair to enforce the law in this case? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/5 "2017-02-22T20:35:20Z")
No. Because just like the police, college professors shouldn’t have an expectation of privacy while teaching. I also didn’t take classes in shitty subjects. Engineering majors don’t have time for nonsensical \_\_\_\_\_\_\_ studies classes. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/6 "2017-02-22T20:37:39Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > So the kid violated a law in order to try to attack the expressive rights of a professor. Your claim is that because the law is often violated, but violations that don’t attack expressive rights are generally not punished, it’s unfair to enforce the law in this case? It’s a school rule, not a law, right? The article was lacking in a lot of details so I’d reserve judgment. Could the apology be, “I apologize for revealing your true nature.”? ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/7 "2017-02-22T20:38:51Z")
How does one apologize for three pages? With a lot of "very"s? ---
**Author:** ![yellowjacketcoder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/4bbf92/32.png) [@yellowjacketcoder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yellowjacketcoder)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/8 "2017-02-22T20:49:33Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > No. Because just like the police, college professors shouldn’t have an expectation of privacy while teaching. I also didn’t take classes in shitty subjects. Engineering majors don’t have time for nonsensical \_\_\_\_\_\_\_ studies classes. Speaking as someone that went to a top-10 engineering school, engineering majors better be taking “\_\_\_\_ studies” classes or they won’t get their degree because they’d be missing the social science and humanities requirements for those degrees. * * * In general I think professors (and teachers in general) should be recorded, if just so they can’t abuse the power of the gradebook in class. But if the school has a rule against it, the school has the ability to suspend the student. I think the school is generally in the wrong for continuing to employ someone that would rather go on a political rant instead of teaching a subject, but that’s their prerogative. And I say this as someone that’s not a fan of our current President. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/9 "2017-02-22T20:50:52Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > It’s a school rule, not a law, right? The article was lacking in a lot of details so I’d reserve judgment. No, in California it is a law ( CA is a “two-party consent” state ). I believe the only exception in college is for disabled students with special needs who must be accommodated. Otherwise professors can legally refuse permission to tape them. Even back in the Dark Ages of the 1980’s when people used tape recorders, I had a few professors that would specifically refuse permission at the beginning of the semester. ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/10 "2017-02-22T20:52:45Z")
In college, learning what the professor teaches is what you are graded on. This professor thinks a 3 page apology is something that the student can learn from. Do it or don’t. Pass or Fail: its the student’s call. I only have 2-3 questions **and they are not for the OP** , but for the Student: 1. Who is PAYING for your courses, Sonny Boy? 2. If You Fail Out … on _their dime_, what are you going to do with your life? McDonalds or Burger King? Bonus Question Lets Assume for the sake of argument that Snark is not a subject offered at other Universities 1. What other college/university would Have you…? ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/11 "2017-02-22T20:54:27Z")
If the classroom rules are clearly stated no recordings, yeah this little Trumpy snowflake should suck it up and either live with the suspension or write the letter. Instructors occasionally go off topic. (Decades ago I had a calculus professor that could wax eloquently on the foribles of his cats.) Unless they are doing it all time and using up significant amounts of teaching time, it’s no big deal. On the job, some supervisors can ramble on for hours and there is nothing like an all staff meeting for wasted conversation. If the student snowflake tried such behavior in most offices he would have been fired. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/12 "2017-02-22T20:55:38Z")
> [@yellowjacketcoder](#): > > Speaking as someone that went to a top-10 engineering school, engineering majors better be taking “\_\_\_\_ studies” classes or they won’t get their degree because they’d be missing the social science and humanities requirements for those degrees. > > * * * > > In general I think professors (and teachers in general) should be recorded, if just so they can’t abuse the power of the gradebook in class. But if the school has a rule against it, the school has the ability to suspend the student. I think the school is generally in the wrong for continuing to employ someone that would rather go on a political rant instead of teaching a subject, but that’s their prerogative. And I say this as someone that’s not a fan of our current President. Yeah but sociology or psychology generally works. Don’t need to delve into the morass of ridiculous fields that will get you employed, if lucky, at Starbucks. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/13 "2017-02-22T20:59:26Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > It’s a school rule, not a law, right? The article was lacking in a lot of details so I’d reserve judgment. > > Could the apology be, “I apologize for revealing your true nature.”? Based on a previous discussion, I believe it’s a state law in California. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/14 "2017-02-22T21:12:41Z")
FTR…its Orange Coast College in Costa Mesa. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/15 "2017-02-22T21:19:49Z")
It’s hard to tell, because I would never do what this student did. Sure, I might leak the guy actually doing something bad to someone else, but not just because he was ranting about something I disagree with. I do generally think that recording should be okay, but that’s for private use, or for the aforementioned outing of people doing things that are truly wrong. Not to try and get people to make fun of them. I’d never sue–that’s dumb. I can tell I have no case, and there’s no way the college is going to be intimidated into backing down. I could see myself–especially my younger self, standing up if I thought I was dealing with an injustice. But I really can’t see how, even if this guy was on the other side, and making a pro-Trump rant, I would think it was an injustice. I can’t even reverse it and make it work. Without that, I take my lumps, and then maybe try to get out of the guy’s class. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/16 "2017-02-22T21:21:00Z")
It’s quite simple. If he wishes to remain in the professor’s class or in the school he should apologize. If he doesn’t and chooses instead to have a 5-minute fame as a ‘hero’ of the left he shouldn’t. Nothing complicated about this. Oh sure, his lawyers can fight it but why would he even want to remain in the professor’s class if he sees him as an enemy of all that is just, virtuous and righteous? Oh, and I wouldn’t record him in the first place, but then I’m not a sneak. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/17 "2017-02-22T21:23:59Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > If he doesn’t and chooses instead to have a 5-minute fame as a ‘hero’ of the left he shouldn’t. ‘Hero’ of the right - the professor was engaged in an anti-Trump rant. Now having established that you had the politics of the situation exactly backwards, does that change your position ;)? ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/18 "2017-02-22T21:28:51Z")
For those who don’t remember, [this is **Urbanredneck** ’s second thread about the incident](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=813329); and the rights of the student to record the professor were pretty well debated in the original thread. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/19 "2017-02-22T21:29:59Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > If he doesn’t and chooses instead to have a 5-minute fame as a ‘hero’ of the left he shouldn’t. Swing and a miss. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2017, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/20 "2017-02-22T21:40:01Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > It’s quite simple. If he wishes to remain in the professor’s class or in the school he should apologize. If he doesn’t and chooses instead to have a 5-minute fame as a ‘hero’ of the left he shouldn’t. > > Nothing complicated about this. Oh sure, his lawyers can fight it but why would he even want to remain in the professor’s class if he sees him as an enemy of all that is just, virtuous and righteous? > > Oh, and I wouldn’t record him in the first place, but then I’m not a sneak. I have never before (discounting a particularly embarrassing error in a fifth grade debate that I’m really glad none of y’all witnessed) seen someone lock themselves so effectively into a principled position that runs counter to their general partisan interests :). [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503.md?page=2)