# Would YOU write a letter of apology to a professor? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 22, 2017, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503 "2017-02-22T20:02:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2017, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/181 "2017-03-03T07:38:30Z")
> [@Aspidistra](#): > > He should totally apologize. > > But speaking for myself, I couldn’t write a three-page apology if you paid me. > > “Dear \. On \ at \ I recorded you saying something I disagreed with, and made that public. I now realize that this was against college rules, wrong, and has caused you a lot of grief. I was completely wrong to put you in that position, I apologize, and commit to not doing it again. Sincerely, \” > > How is that not an adequate apology? > > If I were the professor I’d much rather read something like the above than three pages of drivel and probably flat out lies ghost-written by his mother about how sorry he (doesn’t) feel. > > Maybe that’s why I’m a CS grad… That strikes me as adequate. Add a title page and a bibliography (or a Foreword), and you should be good to go. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2017, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/182 "2017-03-03T20:18:40Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > Uhm - just try to tell faculty what they can and can not say in a classroom - let me know how it goes. That entire statement is the full justification for tenure - so that faculty are free to teach without being told what to say by others. > > I recently lectured on the Middle East as a guest speaker. If the school told me not to talk about Saudi participation in 9/11, or rant about blowback from the Iraq invasion, or the problems that the US faces due to our support of Israel - I would have told them to stuff it. They don’t get to decide which facts to include. > > She teaches on sexuality, and in truth Trump’s campaign did not seem to be very warm to people on the LGBT side of the house. It was proven by dumping the bathroom executive order, BTW. So I would argue that the content was relevant, but her rant was unprofessional. > > Was she ranting inappropriately by singling out Trump Voters (and supposedly asking them to all identify themselves)? Yes. > > Her militancy is irrelevant. She acted out in a classroom, the student violated the school’s rules by recording. Should have been a short conversation and a cup of coffee and move on. Well that is the difference see. You were a GUEST SPEAKER. Big difference - you were not the actual teacher and didnt hand out any grades so the student had every reason to believe the teacher was going to use her knowledge of him being a Trump supporter (sorry - supporter of a terrorist in her words) to give him a bad grade. > [@Algher](#): > > She acted out in a classroom, the student violated the school’s rules by recording. Should have been a short conversation and a cup of coffee and move on. As I said before, she has given NO apologies and shown any remorse and is even proud of what she said so no hope of her giving an inch. And of course, she plays the victim card. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2017, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/183 "2017-03-03T20:35:37Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Well that is the difference see. You were a GUEST SPEAKER. Big difference - you were not the actual teacher and didnt hand out any grades so the student had every reason to believe the teacher was going to use her knowledge of him being a Trump supporter (sorry - supporter of a terrorist in her words) to give him a bad grade. > > As I said before, she has given NO apologies and shown any remorse and is even proud of what she said so no hope of her giving an inch. And of course, she plays the victim card. And after the fact we see that he was given an A, he has complimented her teaching as well. Her RateMyProfessor scores are solid as well, and she has no problem filling the classroom. This whole thing was a tempest in a teapot. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2017, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/184 "2017-03-03T21:10:47Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Well that is the difference see. You were a GUEST SPEAKER. Big difference - you were not the actual teacher and didnt hand out any grades so the student had every reason to believe the teacher was going to use her knowledge of him being a Trump supporter (sorry - supporter of a terrorist in her words) to give him a bad grade. > > As I said before, she has given NO apologies and shown any remorse and is even proud of what she said so no hope of her giving an inch. And of course, she plays the victim card. That’s because she IS the victim and therefore shouldn’t apologize (and hopefully will not be intimidated into giving an inch). A professor strayed from her planned lecture into current politics relevant to the subject matter of the class. We’re talking ten minutes tops out of the semester, so give the snowflake student 75 cents for his “wasted time”. The kid was a brat who broke the school rule deliberately to harass his professor. And he’s made sure that plenty of other instructors will now be instituting iron-clad no recording rules in their classrooms, thus making academic life harder for everyone else. If anybody deserves the treats of bodily harm, it was this student. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2017, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/185 "2017-03-04T04:26:30Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > That’s because she IS the victim and therefore shouldn’t apologize (and hopefully will not be intimidated into giving an inch). A professor strayed from her planned lecture into current politics relevant to the subject matter of the class. We’re talking ten minutes tops out of the semester, so give the snowflake student 75 cents for his “wasted time”. The kid was a brat who broke the school rule deliberately to harass his professor. And he’s made sure that plenty of other instructors will now be instituting iron-clad no recording rules in their classrooms, thus making academic life harder for everyone else. If anybody deserves the treats of bodily harm, it was this student. “Strayed for her lecture to go into politics” Ok if she had just said that she disagreed with Trump I’d be with you but she calls his election a terrorist act and went on to bash him which means she is also bashing any people who voted for him PLUS she pointed out the students who DID vote for him so that to me is going to far. And no, she is not a victim. She opened her big fat mouth too much and got slapped down. Boo hoo. And she damn well better give the kid an A. Because he gave her a top rating just shows the 19 year old has 10 times the amount of class she has. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2017, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/186 "2017-03-04T14:00:18Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > And she damn well better give the kid an A. > > Because he gave her a top rating just shows the 19 year old has 10 times the amount of class she has. Do you seriously see these statements as consistent? You demand that she give him an A, regardless of his classwork? And she rated him highly (with a grade), and he rated her highly (on ratemyprofessor), and somehow these similar actions show him as classier than her? Huh. ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2017, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/187 "2017-03-04T16:44:48Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Do you seriously see these statements as consistent? You demand that she give him an A, regardless of his classwork? > > And she rated him highly (with a grade), and he rated her highly (on ratemyprofessor), and somehow these similar actions show him as classier than her? > > Huh. It seems pretty consistently inconsistent in this thread. I wish I could say I’ve been shocked at the almost celebratory anti-intellectualism of some in here. I really wish I could. I am glad I’ve never had students act like “you’re ma bitch, professor! You work for me, tax mooch! Respect ma authoritay as a ballcapper sitting on his mobile phone all day in the back!” I could see this student sitting in front of Aristotle and then later bitching to the Ecclesia “…but he made fun of the Persian King Trumpestites, and I wanted to learn about squaring the ciiiiiiiiiiiiiircle! (pout)” The university experience is primarily about learning - and learning is more than just expecting professors to be bio-robots teaching all the hyu-mons by rote. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2017, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/188 "2017-03-04T22:52:01Z")
> [@Una\_Persson](#): > > It seems pretty consistently inconsistent in this thread. I wish I could say I’ve been shocked at the almost celebratory anti-intellectualism of some in here. I really wish I could. I am glad I’ve never had students act like “you’re ma bitch, professor! You work for me, tax mooch! Respect ma authoritay as a ballcapper sitting on his mobile phone all day in the back!” > > I could see this student sitting in front of Aristotle and then later bitching to the Ecclesia “…but he made fun of the Persian King Trumpestites, and I wanted to learn about squaring the ciiiiiiiiiiiiiircle! (pout)” The university experience is primarily about learning - and learning is more than just expecting professors to be bio-robots teaching all the hyu-mons by rote. Oh Please. She’s a sex teacher at a community college backed up by a powerful union. She isnt no Aristotle. She had a captive audience and went on a rant she had no reason to go near. Their was no discussion. No back and forth. She was mad her candidate lost and wanted to get back at the people who voted for Trump by calling them out in class. She had her hands slapped and had to deal with it. You know, maybe learning goes both ways? All she had to do was come back to class and apologize which you know, a true professional would have done. But no. She made things worse by acting like she is above all the rules. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2017, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/189 "2017-03-04T23:50:43Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > I see no wrong in trying to hold a professor accountable. They are not perfect. In college we protested things like test questions and many times got questions removed. \*\*We also held professors accountable when what was taught in class wasnt what was on the tests. \*\*We even went after professors who didnt grade fairly. > > Remember also this is a community college and her salary is paid by the taxpayers. If you never get asked anything on a test that wasn’t covered in class, you didn’t get an education, you got a rubber-stamp diploma. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2017, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/190 "2017-03-05T13:36:13Z")
> [@F.U.Shakespeare](#): > > If you never get asked anything on a test that wasn’t covered in class, you didn’t get an education, you got a rubber-stamp diploma. Exactly! A physics professor told us we didn’t have to memorize equations, he’d provide what we needed. People expected the midterm to contain a sheet of equations, but there was none. Hands went up immediately. He wrote on the board in large letters F = MA. He told us we could derive everything necessary from there. I loved physics and wound up taking more than I needed to satisfy my major requirements. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2017, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/191 "2017-03-05T14:29:06Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Exactly! > > A physics professor told us we didn’t have to memorize equations, he’d provide what we needed. People expected the midterm to contain a sheet of equations, but there was none. > > Hands went up immediately. He wrote on the board in large letters F = MA. He told us we could derive everything necessary from there. > > I loved physics and wound up taking more than I needed to satisfy my major requirements. I guess it depends on what was on the test. I don’t see a way to answer questions like, “You drop a 10 kg ingot from the top of a 400m building. Ignoring air resistance, how long does it take to hit the ground?” I suppose it could be answered in terms of A, but if I saw that question I would understand it to be asking me to know the acceleration due to gravity on Earth is 9.8 m/sec[sup]2[/sup] and apply that to the distance formula. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2017, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/192 "2017-03-05T15:58:44Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > I see no wrong in trying to hold a professor accountable. They are not perfect. **In college we protested things like test questions and many times got questions removed. We also held professors accountable when what was taught in class wasnt what was on the tests. We even went after professors who didnt grade fairly.** > > Remember also this is a community college and her salary is paid by the taxpayers. I’ve been involved in teaching part-time for thirty years (post-secondary mathematics and engineering classes). I also know quite a few college teachers. IME, student complaints about “unfair” grading were overwhelmingly directed at teachers who graded “too hard”. Teachers who grade easily are rated higher. The ones who don’t go along to keep their (less frequently tenured) position get low ratings, and complaints. The result is a race to the bottom, which undermines standards. Also IME, such complaints are much less common at top-notch institutions (and in challenging majors at any institutions), because the students who are able to get admitted to those places and programs understand that getting an education requires hard work. Such institutions still maintain a “client” relationship between teacher and student. Schools which adopt a “customer” relationship (invariably to maximize enrollment, and revenue - _“the customer is always right!”_) can’t be as rigorous, and their reputations suffer for it. If you’re going to brag about forcing college professors to teach to the test, don’t complain about declining education quality, because you’re part of what causes it. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2017, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/193 "2017-03-05T16:14:50Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I guess it depends on what was on the test. I don’t see a way to answer questions like, “You drop a 10 kg ingot from the top of a 400m building. Ignoring air resistance, how long does it take to hit the ground?” > > I suppose it could be answered in terms of A, but if I saw that question I would understand it to be asking me to know the acceleration due to gravity on Earth is 9.8 m/sec[sup]2[/sup] and apply that to the distance formula. When students questioned him, he was able to show ways to drive what was needed. He did assume certain things to be “just known” since they were used repeatedly in class and lab. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2017, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/194 "2017-03-05T16:24:32Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > When students questioned him, he was able to show ways to drive what was needed. He did assume certain things to be “just known” since they were used repeatedly in class and lab. He might have been more explicit about the difference between \*equations \*(which are derivable) and _constants_. As \*\*Bricker \*\*suggests, a nice touch would have been to leave the answer in terms of A. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2017, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/195 "2017-03-05T17:20:54Z")
> [@F.U.Shakespeare](#): > > He might have been more explicit about the difference between \*equations \*(which are derivable) and _constants_. As \*\*Bricker \*\*suggests, a nice touch would have been to leave the answer in terms of A. Right. The other problem I have with that is while it’s true I can derive lots of stuff from F=ma, there’s some time involved in taking that step. This may not be an issue if the test gave you enough time to work through that kind of deductive derivation. With an inclined plane, you have the weight of the object that’s resting on the plane, and the force that’s normal to the plane and exerted by the inclined plane on the object. That’s a pair of vector equations to resolve. F=ma is being solved, yes, but if you didn’t study vector addition then you’re not able to solve. I guess that while I agree with the claim, I regard the use of it as prep for a test to be deceptive, at least potentially. Obviously, a test that included only trivial applications of F=ma would be fine. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2017, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/196 "2017-03-05T20:24:28Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > “Strayed for her lecture to go into politics” Ok if she had just said that she disagreed with Trump I’d be with you but she calls his election a terrorist act and went on to bash him which means she is also bashing any people who voted for him PLUS she pointed out the students who DID vote for him so that to me is going to far. > > And no, she is not a victim. She opened her big fat mouth too much and got slapped down. Boo hoo. > > And she damn well better give the kid an A. > > Because he gave her a top rating just shows the 19 year old has 10 times the amount of class she has. And the Trump snowflake was a brat who opened his big fat mouth and BROKE the university rules and got slapped down for it. Boo Hoo. He should have gotten expelled and I personally hope he gets shunned (if not physically abused by other students) for making damn sure the no recordings policies are now going to be enforced with a vengeance by the faculty. Chances are if the politics were reversed (pro-Trump faculty being recorded by liberal student), you would be championing the professor. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2017, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/197 "2017-03-05T20:27:26Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Oh Please. She’s a sex teacher at a community college backed up by a powerful union. She isnt no Aristotle. She had a captive audience and went on a rant she had no reason to go near. Their was no discussion. No back and forth. She was mad her candidate lost and wanted to get back at the people who voted for Trump by calling them out in class. She had her hands slapped and had to deal with it. > > You know, maybe learning goes both ways? All she had to do was come back to class and apologize which you know, a true professional would have done. But no. She made things worse by acting like she is above all the rules. In a course on human sexuality, the potential effects of an elected officials opinions on subjects like homosexuality, abortion rights, and access to birth control are necessary to understanding the subject manner. ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2017, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/198 "2017-03-06T00:54:33Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Oh Please. She’s a sex teacher at a community college backed up by a powerful union. She isnt no Aristotle. She had a captive audience and went on a rant she had no reason to go near. Their was no discussion. No back and forth. She was mad her candidate lost and wanted to get back at the people who voted for Trump by calling them out in class. They were not a “captive audience,” so that’s a false dilemma - they were free to completely ignore her unless she was going to be assigning and/or testing over the subject. Small talk and asides really to happen in our university classrooms. And sometimes the students editorialize a little too. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2017, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/199 "2017-03-06T02:25:41Z")
> [@Una\_Persson](#): > > They were not a “captive audience,” Goggle “captive audience” and this is the first thing that comes up: captive audience. Listeners or onlookers who have no choice but to attend. For example, It’s a required course and, knowing he has a captive audience, the professor rambles on endlessly. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2017, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503/200 "2017-03-06T23:41:13Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > And the Trump snowflake was a brat who opened his big fat mouth and BROKE the university rules and got slapped down for it. Boo Hoo. He should have gotten expelled and I personally hope he gets shunned (if not physically abused by other students) for making damn sure the no recordings policies are now going to be enforced with a vengeance by the faculty. Chances are if the politics were reversed (pro-Trump faculty being recorded by liberal student), you would be championing the professor. You know nothing about me and I find it interesting you think college professors can do no wrong. She was a crazy lunatic who went on a rant and made false accusations about the election and pointed out the students who had voted for him that they were the new enemies. She went way over the line. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-write-a-letter-of-apology-to-a-professor/780503.md?page=11)