# Wouldn't the government itself rebel against a second Trump presidency? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [April 6, 2024, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947 "2024-04-06T17:59:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/21 "2024-04-06T18:55:35Z")
The senate didn’t convict him right after his insurrection and influential people like McConnell have since come around to supporting him again. The OP is pure fantasy. ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/22 "2024-04-06T19:05:07Z")
> [@dolphinboy](#): > > You really think that if he gets democratically elected the country is going to rise up and throw him out? No, any resistance before he gets elected would be of the passive sort, perhaps procedural (e.g., having the Vice President refuse to certify the election, as Trump commanded Pence to do, etc.). > [@](#): > > What about all those folks who voted for him? They are going to protect him from anyone who tries to stop him from doing whatever he wants to do. The MAGAheads are going to stop people from striking, passively resisting, resigning, and refusing to follow Trump’s orders? I think you are on the “violent insurrection” template. Yeah, those fools are ready and eager for a hot war–but not any resistance with finesse to it. > [@](#): > > Nobody is going to try and take him down until he creates a dictatorship, and by that point it will be too late to do anything about. You are assuming the very thing I am challenging here (i.e., begging the question). ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/23 "2024-04-06T19:06:24Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > The senate didn’t convict him right after his insurrection and influential people like McConnell have since come around to supporting him again. The OP is pure fantasy. It’s fantasy because MAGAs and coward Republicans will support him? I know they will. It’s everyone else who won’t. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/24 "2024-04-06T19:08:58Z")
Your OP says you think conviction in the senate is possible. It’s not. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/25 "2024-04-06T19:10:09Z")
> [@Aeschines](#): > > Refusal by the Senate to approve _any_ of the criminal’s appointments. No cabinet, no judges–nothing. If we have the Senate, we can and must take this approach. If Trump is elected, it is almost a certainty that Republicans have taken the Senate based on where the vulnerable incumbents are. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/26 "2024-04-06T19:17:26Z")
> [@Aeschines](#): > > But why would people go along? This sentiment is eerily similar to all the 2016-era cope around “the adults in the room will stop him.” A few people mitigated his worst impulses, but we can be sure he won’t be appointing any such “adults” this time around. Will the political opposition rein him in as President? I dunno, did they rein him in after he left office? We got a bit of Jan 6th related theater, but if they haven’t jailed the man 3 years after a failed insurrection, I don’t know why anyone thinks matters will improve when he has full powers of office and no brakes or constraints. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/27 "2024-04-06T19:18:50Z")
> [@Aeschines](#): > > I highly doubt the military is going to fire on the people in all of the seceding blue states. [cough] Kent State. Also, see BLM protests; violent suppression of. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/28 "2024-04-06T19:22:14Z")
> [@Aeschines](#): > > Which is to say, if Trump were to win, one possibility would be a peaceful, nonviolent revolution like the [Maidan Revolution](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolution_of_Dignity) of Ukraine. And the goal would be not just to get Trump out but to completely reform the government and economic system from the ground up. That’s a nice fantasy that is about as likely as soaring swine. > [@Aeschines](#): > > But probably most government workers trend Liberal. Plus all Democrats would be on the side of right. You would be wrong on both counts. There are plenty of government workers who are far “trend[ing] Liberal”, and I can point out plenty of cases where prominent Democrats have acted per formatively and in their own personal interests rather than being “on the side of right”. But hey, keep the dream alive! It beats reality on all days ending in “y”. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/29 "2024-04-06T19:56:28Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > That’s a nice fantasy that is about as likely as soaring swine. Fine. But you are not saying what _you_ think would actually happen. > [@Aeschines](#): > > You would be wrong on both counts. There are plenty of government workers who are far “trend[ing] Liberal”, I said “probably,” but you seem to _know_ that I am wrong, so… cite? > [@](#): > > and I can point out plenty of cases where prominent Democrats have acted per formatively and in their own personal interests rather than being “on the side of right”. Yup. But so what? > [@](#): > > But hey, keep the dream alive! It beats reality on all days ending in “y”. What, exactly, is my “dream”? If Trump were to win again, you think the country would just sit back as though everything were normal and let Trump establish a dictatorship? _Some_ type of shit would go down, right? So then it’s a question of what that shit would be. ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/30 "2024-04-06T19:57:37Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > [cough] Kent State. Also, see BLM protests; violent suppression of. Of course, there could be isolated things like that. But that’s a lot different than the entire military going to war against fellow Americans because Trump says to do so. ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/31 "2024-04-06T20:00:09Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > This sentiment is eerily similar to all the 2016-era cope around “the adults in the room will stop him.” A few people mitigated his worst impulses, but we can be sure he won’t be appointing any such “adults” this time around. I agree that it would be different this time, but I am not talking about nominal Republicans stopping Trump. I am talking about rebellion by those who oppose him. > [@](#): > > Will the political opposition rein him in as President? I dunno, did they rein him in after he left office? We got a bit of Jan 6th related theater, but if they haven’t jailed the man 3 years after a failed insurrection, I don’t know why anyone thinks matters will improve when he has full powers of office and no brakes or constraints. He has been indicted and will stand trial. I am not happy with the pace of things either, but your logic here doesn’t work IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/32 "2024-04-06T20:13:39Z")
Hmm, the person the OP confidently assured us will not get the nomination will immediately after being elected create a dictatorship, but be overthrown by every force in the country that didn’t vote for him. Have I got that right? Libs of TikTok post more rational and less easily refuted proclamations. A Democratic House will wait for Trump to commit actually impeachable crimes before a vote, and it will then go to the Senate to die, since a two-thirds vote is needed. Since half the country had voted for Trump, they will be the ones to revolt. What will the military do? Well, the President normally cannot call the military out against American civilians, but we’re in dictatorship fiction here. The military is rife with neo-Nazis, Christian nationalists, racist white supremacists and others who are far to the right of Trump. Some of them will certainly move to back him because they are that far right and some will back him because he is the legitimate unconvicted president. The same goes for the Senate. Having both the Senate and House be Democratic with a Trump victory strains credulity, but even if this fantasy conveniently posits these wins, they still will want to run the country. Not running the country is a dystopia in and of itself. Same for government workers. Hey mods. Here’s an idea. Create a new forum for fantasy scenarios. They don’t seem to have a place anywhere else. ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/33 "2024-04-06T20:18:07Z")
Guys, if you want to say I’m full of shit without saying what _you_ think would happen, that’s you’re right, though I don’t find it particularly interesting. People here are doing what I am saying is odd, and I’ll say it again: just assuming that the people and government will function per normal if Trump wins and follow along on his “dictatorship journey.” That’s not some sort of null hypothesis that’s automatically true if I am incorrect. There are many different things that could happen. Maybe say what you think will happen? ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/34 "2024-04-06T20:19:53Z")
> [@Aeschines](#): > > _Some_ type of shit would go down, right? So then it’s a question of what that shit would be. This is your assumption. Of course, you’d have thought that there would have been consequences to Trump for spurring on an insurrection and lying about electoral fraud, too, but to date there have been no real consequences for him, nor declining support for Trump or the belief in his ‘stolen election’ nonsense. As for government employees (whom I work with every day) there is a representative spectrum of political beliefs, the most vocal of which are avowed Trump supporters. Your notion that the government or Congress is stacked with people ready to rise up and ‘overthrow’ a Trump presidency, either actively or by resigning _en masse_ to deprive the bureaucracy of functionaries, is not borne of any evidence—certainly nothing that you’ve presented—and no, ‘the military’ is not going to mount a coup, nor is Congress going to vote to impeach and remove on Day 1 even if there were the votes for impeachment in the House and certainly not for conviction in the Senate. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/35 "2024-04-06T20:29:12Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > This is your assumption. If Trump tries to be dictator, I think some shit will go down, yes. I think some shit will go down unless Trump decides to be a “normal” president. I am challenging the assumption that everyone will just follow along. > [@](#): > > Of course, you’d have thought that there would have been consequences to Trump for spurring on an insurrection and lying about electoral fraud, too, but to date there have been no real consequences for him, Being indicted certainly counts for something. At the very least, his legal problems are costing Trump a lot of time and angst. > [@](#): > > nor declining support for Trump or the belief in his ‘stolen election’ nonsense. That remains to be seen in the form of the November election. It certainly has not declined enough for my taste. > [@](#): > > As for government employees (whom I work with every day) there is a representative spectrum of political beliefs, the most vocal of which are avowed Trump supporters. I recognize the data point, thanks. > [@](#): > > Your notion that the government or Congress is stacked with people ready to rise up and ‘overthrow’ a Trump presidency, either actively or by resigning _en masse_ to deprive the bureaucracy of functionaries, is not borne of any evidence—certainly nothing that you’ve presented— Even if it were just 20% of government workers that were inclined to support such resistance, they certainly could, and it would have an effect. No, I am not saying that I have performed a study that proves this is likely. > [@](#): > > and no, ‘the military’ is not going to mount a coup, I made no speculation that they would. I have suggested they would not be inclined to follow Trump’s illegal orders. > [@](#): > > nor is Congress going to vote to impeach and remove on Day 1 even if there were the votes for impeachment in the House and certainly not for conviction in the Senate. There seems to be an assumption that Trump could only be impeached for _new_ bad/stupid/evil things he did while in office. I don’t see any reason that has to be the case. In any event, the moment Trump made any illegal move to be a dictator, then he could be impeached, and I am certain he would if we held the house. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/36 "2024-04-06T20:34:00Z")
Please stop breaking up posts into sentence fragments. It makes it incoherent to read, difficult to respond to, and removes context of complete statements. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/37 "2024-04-06T20:34:13Z")
Pretend the utterly impossible, that Trump is impeached and convicted. All that means is his VP will become president. The VP pick will certainly be a crazy-right Trump toady. What happens then? Another impeachment and conviction? A military coup? A million mom march on Washington, this time with guns? What will the right be doing during all this? Why wouldn’t they, actual legitimate winners rather than sore losers worse than Gore, be righteously striking back at every illegal, immoral, and fattening move by the left? No. This oppressively wish-fulfillment scenario is not interesting. It buries any nugget of interesting real-world speculation. That’s the reason nobody is willing to play in your sandbox and is angry at you for calling us out on the subject. ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/38 "2024-04-06T20:35:06Z")
Thanks for your advice. ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/39 "2024-04-06T20:38:09Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Pretend the utterly impossible, that Trump is impeached and convicted. All that means is his VP will become president. The VP pick will certainly be a crazy-right Trump toady. What happens then? Another impeachment and conviction? A military coup? A million mom march on Washington, this time with guns? What will the right be doing during all this? Why wouldn’t they, actual legitimate winners rather than sore losers worse than Gore, be righteously striking back at every illegal, immoral, and fattening move by the left? These are all actually good questions. I agree that our country is not really set up to handle any difficult scenarios right now. It’s a tinderbox, IMO. > [@](#): > > No. This oppressively wish-fulfillment scenario is not interesting. It buries any nugget of interesting real-world speculation. That’s the reason nobody is willing to play in your sandbox and is angry at you for calling us out on the subject. I discovered today that I have an amazing ability: to reach through the Information Superhighway and twist people’s arms and make them participate in my thread. Ah hah hah hah! ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947/40 "2024-04-06T20:43:47Z")
> [@Chad\_Sudan](#): > > How many US lawmakers and government officials were “profiles in courage” in Trump’s first term? Well, people didnt know then how bad he was, and pretty much then all of the Democratic lawmakers. > [@dolphinboy](#): > > . Trump would order the military to lockdown congress and imprison them. The military would refuse such an illegal order. > [@Moriarty](#): > > ETA: If donald wins, he’s likely got a republican controlled Congress too. Not so much, currently the issue is Indys and youth staying home or voting 3rd party due to the “Biden is too old” lie, which is even spread here (and often) on the SDMB. One great side effect of trumps grift in taking over the RNC to pay his legal bills, is that the RNC will no longer have the $$ to spend on smaller purple House races. Thus I predict the Dems will take the House- and keep the Senate. Not by a lot, but enough. > [@dolphinboy](#): > > In order to impeach and convict a president you have to have grounds for impeachment. Getting elected is not grounds for impeachment, no matter who it is. But 88 felony indictments is proper reason. Not to mention the GOP did start Impeachment charges against Biden based upon a nothingburger- only losing most of their majority stopped them. > [@dolphinboy](#): > > The US Military is loyal to the Commander in Chief, Oath of Enlistment - Army Values _I, \_\_\_\_\_, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed …_ > [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > Kent State. Also, see BLM protests; violent suppression of. National Guard. Where did the US military get involved in the BLM protests? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wouldnt-the-government-itself-rebel-against-a-second-trump-presidency/999947.md?page=3)