# Wow. Cavs now own NBA's all-time losing streak **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [February 6, 2011, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369 "2011-02-06T05:06:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/21 "2011-02-07T16:16:11Z")
The other sad thing for the Cavs is that this is a pretty weak year for the NBA draft. It would be nice to think help is on the way, but I just don’t think there is a big time NBA game changer in this draft. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/22 "2011-02-07T16:26:20Z")
I’m not sure it’s a weak year, but it’s not a great year to be picking at the top because there isn’t a consensus superstar. Not that the Cavs will be guaranteed the first pick. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/23 "2011-02-07T16:37:25Z")
Yes, there aren’t a lot of happy Cavs fans right now: [A fan base used to misery can't let go of the Cleveland Cavaliers: Terry Pluto - cleveland.com](http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/blog/index.ssf/2011/02/a_fan_base_used_to_misery_cant.html) ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/24 "2011-02-07T16:39:56Z")
I have a hard time feeling all that sorry for Cleveland since their whole elevation to contender status basically rested on a single lucky roll of the random number generator; I feel worse for the Mark Price/Brad Daugherty/Larry Nance team never quite getting over the hump. ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/25 "2011-02-07T16:41:05Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Yes, there aren’t a lot of happy Cavs fans right now: [A fan base used to misery can't let go of the Cleveland Cavaliers: Terry Pluto - cleveland.com](http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/blog/index.ssf/2011/02/a_fan_base_used_to_misery_cant.html) The Decision plunged me firmly into fairweather fan mode. I just couldn’t psyche myself up to watch a faceless, lunch pail, “let’s get it done” type of team after watching the best player in the league. I’ve hardly paid attention to the NBA this season. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/26 "2011-02-07T17:56:14Z")
> [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > Yep, LeBron boned 'em. _shrug_ Looks like Cleveland boned LeBron to me. Cleveland had Bron for 7 years, of which I would say 5 he was the best player in the NBA. In that time, Cleveland utterly failed to put any sort of decent team around him. Even with one star level sidekick (and no, Mo Williams does not count), they probably would have won a title. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/27 "2011-02-07T18:10:23Z")
Screwed themselves out of keeping him, maybe. And I do think it has to be noted that he made their lives a lot harder by refusing to committ to the team in the longer term. Rather than developing a team around him they had to try to meet a deadline. They did that by throwing pieces together on the fly, which didn’t always work and which definitely didn’t work in the playoffs. I’m not saying he was obliged to commit to them, but he could have had a better team if he hadn’t kept them wondering if he was going to bail. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2011, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/28 "2011-02-07T23:06:59Z")
> [@Invisible\_Chimp](#): > > No team wants to lose to this team and be the ones to snap the streak now. The Wizard, who have not won a road game all season, are coming to town on Sunday. One streak or the other will have to end, and it’s always safe to bet against the Wizards. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2011, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/29 "2011-02-08T03:11:50Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Screwed themselves out of keeping him, maybe. And I do think it has to be noted that he made their lives a lot harder by refusing to committ to the team in the longer term. Rather than developing a team around him they had to try to meet a deadline. They did that by throwing pieces together on the fly, which didn’t always work and which definitely didn’t work in the playoffs. I’m not saying he was obliged to commit to them, but he could have had a better team if he hadn’t kept them wondering if he was going to bail. He was there for 7 years. How long of a commitment would the Cavs had needed to not suck so much? ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2011, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/30 "2011-02-08T03:16:49Z")
> [@treis](#): > > He was there for 7 years. How long of a commitment would the Cavs had needed to not suck so much? He could have at least committed to the team during the Boston series last year. That would have been enough for me. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2011, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/31 "2011-02-08T04:26:41Z")
> [@treis](#): > > He was there for 7 years. How long of a commitment would the Cavs had needed to not suck so much? Suck? They were the worst team in the league when they drafted him and had the best regular season record his last two years there. I’m talking about the specifics of his contract: his last contract with them was for three years when he could have signed for as long as seven.\* So from the time he signed that deal, they had a deadline. They had to win at least one title by that time, or come close, to convince him to stay in Cleveland. If he’d signed a longer deal without the opt out clause, or re-signed with Cleveland before reaching free agency, they could have built their team in a different way and perhaps been more successful, avoiding failed acquisitions like Larry Hughes and Ben Wallace. I’m not saying it was a guarantee, just that it might have worked differently. His strategy might have been the best one for him personally, but it was not the one most conducive to winning in Cleveland. \*Technically it was a four-year extension with an option after year three, but everybody knew from the moment he signed it that he was going to opt out. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2011, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/32 "2011-02-08T04:38:48Z")
The Cavs played a tight game against Dallas tonight, but lost again. The streak is now at 25. Cleveland is at the beginning of a long homestand, which has to help their chances to finally win another game. They have Detroit Wednesday and the Clippers Friday before that Wizards game. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2011, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/33 "2011-02-08T18:22:44Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Suck? They were the worst team in the league when they drafted him and had the best regular season record his last two years there. And now they are back to being the worst team in the league, which underscores my point. They had LeBron for 7 years and didn’t put talent around him. > [@Marley23](#): > > I’m talking about the specifics of his contract: his last contract with them was for three years when he could have signed for as long as seven.\* So from the time he signed that deal, they had a deadline. They had to win at least one title by that time, or come close, to convince him to stay in Cleveland. If he’d signed a longer deal without the opt out clause, or re-signed with Cleveland before reaching free agency, they could have built their team in a different way and perhaps been more successful, avoiding failed acquisitions like Larry Hughes and Ben Wallace. I’m not saying it was a guarantee, just that it might have worked differently. His strategy might have been the best one for him personally, but it was not the one most conducive to winning in Cleveland. I think it’s a very lame excuse. To say that Cleveland could have built a team around Lebron if he guaranteed them 10 years total instead of 7 is a little bit ridiculous. They had an NBA eternity to build a team, but they just didn’t. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2011, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/34 "2011-02-08T18:35:10Z")
> [@treis](#): > > And now they are back to being the worst team in the league, which underscores my point. They had LeBron for 7 years and didn’t put talent around him. Bs, they didn’t become the worst team in the league by losing Lebron. At the start of the season they were hovering near .500 and had a legitimate shot at making the playoffs. They are the worst team in the league NOW, after losing several other key players. It’s like the Lakers losing Kobe Gasol and Odom all at once, they’d be at the bottom of the league too. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2011, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/35 "2011-02-08T18:37:53Z")
The Buccaneers hold the longest losing streak in the four major professional sports at 26. The Cavs are closing in on that. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2011, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/36 "2011-02-08T18:51:30Z")
> [@treis](#): > > I think it’s a very lame excuse. To say that Cleveland could have built a team around Lebron if he guaranteed them 10 years total instead of 7 is a little bit ridiculous. They had an NBA eternity to build a team, but they just didn’t. It’s not that easy to build a team. I disagree with people who said that Cleveland didn’t put enough around him for a title shot. With Lebron, they went to the Finals, then got the best record in the league 2 years in a row. They didn’t win, but many teams are good enough to win but don’t. Sometimes, things just don’t fall your way. Cleveland did as much as they could to help Lebron win but at the end of the day, it’s up to the players. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2011, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/37 "2011-02-08T19:53:03Z")
> [@treis](#): > > And now they are back to being the worst team in the league, which underscores my point. Gee, who would have thought a team that loses the best player in the league would be significantly worse after he leaves? Other than everybody, I mean. This does not prove they failed to put talent around him. They could have done better, yes. I’m just arguing LeBron’s own choices also made it harder for them to surround him with the best players. > [@](#): > > They had LeBron for 7 years and didn’t put talent around him. They definitely could have done a better job. I said plenty of times in the last few years that the team was not winning championships because the pieces did not work together as well as they could have. It’s wrong to say they didn’t put talent around him because the team sucks without him. > [@](#): > > I think it’s a very lame excuse. It’s not an excuse. It’s a point that his deadline was counterproductive. It discouraged them from developing guys around them and encouraged them to try to put a team together with big trades and free agents instead. I’m saying this got them more talent that didn’t cohere. Boston and LA are winning with stable cores of players. Cleveland first complemented LeBron with Larry Hughes, then traded Hughes to get Szczerbiak and Ben Wallace, then traded Wallace to get Shaq, and they signed Mo Williams and sorta-traded Ilgauskas for Jamison. Granted it’s easy to say ‘stability is good’ when the team is already good, the trick is getting there. But if they hadn’t been trying to meet his deadline perhaps they could have built a more cohesive team. And it might have been easier to sign a top free agent, too. The guys who wanted big money and long contracts didn’t want to sign in Cleveland and risk being stuck there after LeBron left. > [@](#): > > To say that Cleveland could have built a team around Lebron if he guaranteed them 10 years total instead of 7 is a little bit ridiculous. He didn’t guarantee them seven years. He signed a four-year rookie contract after they drafted him - there wasn’t much choice about that - and then signed a three-year extension. All I’m saying is they might have approached things differently and made made some different moves if they knew he would be there for seven years (or five, or six) instead of knowing they were going to have to convince him to stick around after three. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/38 "2011-02-09T00:37:40Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Bs, they didn’t become the worst team in the league by losing Lebron. At the start of the season they were hovering near .500 and had a legitimate shot at making the playoffs. They are the worst team in the league NOW, after losing several other key players. It’s like the Lakers losing Kobe Gasol and Odom all at once, they’d be at the bottom of the league too. It’s not quite the same because there is no one on the Cavs nearly as good as Gasol or Odom. Which is kind of the point. If the Lakers lose Kobe, they are still good. So are most other contending teams. The wheels didn’t fall off in Dallas when Dirk went down, for example. You can point at injuries, but that is a red herring. They were 8-23 with everyone healthy. And no, Z and Shaq aren’t going to make a difference either. The reality of the situation is that if you brought back everyone from last year, except for LeBron, and had everyone healthy, they are still the worse team in the league. No other star in the NBA had as bad of a supporting cast as LeBron. > [@Marley23](#): > > Gee, who would have thought a team that loses the best player in the league would be significantly worse after he leaves? Other than everybody, I mean. This does not prove they failed to put talent around him. They could have done better, yes. I’m just arguing LeBron’s own choices also made it harder for them to surround him with the best players. You’re arguing against a strawman, and not what I said. If a team loses their star, of course they are going to be worse. But teams like Dallas, LA, Chicago, Boston, San Antonio, and Atlanta are still going to be playoff teams if they lose their best player. They aren’t going to be bottom feeders. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/39 "2011-02-09T00:38:02Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Gee, who would have thought a team that loses the best player in the league would be significantly worse after he leaves? Other than everybody, I mean. Check out Bill Simmons on the [Patrick Ewing Effect](http://proxy.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?id=1193711). ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2011, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369/40 "2011-02-09T00:56:54Z")
> [@treis](#): > > If a team loses their star, of course they are going to be worse. But teams like Dallas, LA, Chicago, Boston, San Antonio, and Atlanta are still going to be playoff teams if they lose their best player. They aren’t going to be bottom feeders. For the most part, those are more balanced teams than the Cavs were (Dallas went 2-7 without Nowitzki this year, so they should not be on that list), and some of them are just better teams. No argument that they were never balanced in LeBron’s time there. In particular he never had a legit second scoring threat. The supporting cast Cleveland put around LeBron was never good enough, I agree. I’m just saying that the Cavs’ results this season don’t speak to the quality of the team they had the last two years. And I’ll point out again that most of those teams have been stable for several seasons and the Cavs never were. The Spurs’ big three guys have played together since 2002, the Celtics assembled the core of their team in 2007, Lakers have had Gasol, Odom and Bryant since February 2008. Chicago is a younger team and I don’t think Atlanta is really good enough to be in that conversation. > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Check out Bill Simmons on the [Patrick Ewing Effect](http://proxy.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?id=1193711). I’m familiar. No great surprise it didn’t happen to Cleveland, though. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-cavs-now-own-nbas-all-time-losing-streak/570369.md?page=3)