# Wow, I hate ricers. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 27, 2002, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255 "2002-12-27T23:16:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/101 "2003-01-04T19:43:00Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by E-Sabbath \* > \*\*I’m not too thrilled with the Mini Cooper S. (S. Cooper is the standard. S is the fast one) It’s a wonderful, great car except for two glaring flaws. > > First, the speedo is in the CENTER of the DASH. Idiot. > > Second, it’s a bit too small for me. The trunk with the rear seat down looks about the size of the trunk of my Beetle with the rear seat up. And speaking as someone who moves stuff around a lot, it’s just not big enough. \*\* Nah, I’m talking about the real Mini Cooper. The new one is fair enough, as new cars go, but compared to the true cooper it’s a soulless lump. ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/102 "2003-01-04T20:08:14Z")
I feel the need to mention that where I grew up, ‘ricer’ was an offensive slang term for Asian people. ---
**Author:** ![Blown\_Injected](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@Blown\_Injected](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blown_Injected)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/103 "2003-01-04T22:10:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sam Stone \* > \*\*Show me a Buick Grand National that can run 11 second quarters, and I’ll show you a car that had the Grand National radiator cap jacked up and a new drivetrain put under it. > > No way a Grand National comes even close to those numbers. 14 seconds I’ll believe. 11 seconds takes insane amounts of horsepower and traction. My 400HP+ Camaro could run mid-12’s. 11 seconds is a whole 'nuther league. \*\* Sam, go to the track and look for your self. 11’s is EASY with a 3700# GN without even going in to the motor. Just a bigger turbo $700, bigger injectors $350, and a fuel pump $120. That’s it. Sorry it upsets lots of people because there are lots of people doing it with 15 year old cars with a 1/4 million miles on them. BTW, 3700# takes about 450 HP to hit 11.50 in the 1/4 mile, the formula says 114 MPH is the approximate trap speed. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/104 "2003-01-04T22:16:39Z")
Geez, all this talk about 0-60mph times etc, get yourself a bike, even a poxy Honda CB500 will outdo the most souped up Mustang. …and when you start talking about the R1 or GSXR1000, these thing will get up to 100 and back to 0 from a standing start before most cars will hit 60. Eat mah dust suckers! ---
**Author:** ![Blown\_Injected](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@Blown\_Injected](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blown_Injected)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/105 "2003-01-04T22:23:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Feistymongol \* > \*\*Doesn’t sound like you’ve even seen a Skyline GTR much less witnessed one in a race if you think a measly souped up 400-500 hp mustang can beat one. Yeah right. > > Bigger engine usually means a lot more torque and horse power doesn’t mean squat if that huge v8 weighs 2-3x more than that 4 banger which has precision tuning and lightweight components. T > > Show me one study that says muscle cars are more reliable. Stop talking out your ass. > A small block Chevy can be be modded to run at 500 HP AND 500 ft LB of torque! for less than $1000, and it will do that all day long - ever wonder why ya don’t see those ricer type engines in marine applications? > > You realize that “japs” is an offensive racist slur? Fucking white racist clown. I knew there was something up with your constant denigration of anything “Japanese” or “foreign” in favor of giving sloppy blowjobs to domestic cars. > > Yeah unlike you right? Gee, I guess not everyone can carry a card for the “superior” aryan nation. \*\* Now I’m a fucking Nazi - go fuck yourself. And no I have not seen the special model of car you mentioned. Strange how that car nevers seems to be around when the green flag drops around here - where is it. Bring it on! I’ll take any challange. If that car your talking about has 1000 HP, then I believe it is a totally modified and reworked car - kinda like calling a NASCAR a Ford or a Chevy or… There is no factory showroom car that I know of that has a drive that would take the abuse of 1000HP. Of course the Ford 9" rear - 35 year old technology will come close. And the fastest race cars on the planet are V-8’s that make lots of noise. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/106 "2003-01-04T22:38:09Z")
…er, they’re either V10’s or V12’s actually, depending upon the race series format. ---
**Author:** ![Blown\_Injected](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@Blown\_Injected](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blown_Injected)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/107 "2003-01-04T22:49:39Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by casdave \* > \*\*…er, they’re either V10’s or V12’s actually, depending upon the race series format. \*\* If that is in reply to my fastest race car comment, all I have to say is TOP FUEL. It is a 500 cu. in. V-8 that makes about 6,000 HP, the cars go about 330 MPH. Any V10 or 12’s doing that? Top Fuel takes power and speed to the extreme limit AFAIK, tell me about something quicker, faster, or more powerful. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/108 "2003-01-04T23:07:14Z")
Racing in a straight line, hah! what a crock! ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/109 "2003-01-04T23:20:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Feistymongol \* > \*\*Maybe that particular stereotype didn’t apply to you but here are the most often seen fanatics of domestic “muscle cars” : > > 1. Patriotic shitheads. Characterized by chanting slogans such as “never forget!” and “let’s roll” while also displaying trendy american flags post 9/11. Except they show utter disrespect towards all other people and cultures of the world. Usually closet racists with agendas. > Reasons for driving muscle cars: It’s part of their agenda and they refuse to patronize those “foreigner japs who take our jobs blah blah blah \_insert random unsubstantiated racial bigotry” > Type of male seen driving: Usually middle aged white male bigot. > > 2. Meatheads. Characterized by their overwhelming desire to drive loud and big cars. Because in their simpleton minds big and loud is good cuz good makes Lothar the neanderthal look cool. > Usually drives the most gaudy piece of shit car as long as it has an engine that wakes up the block with its rumbling. > Reasons for driving muscle cars: It’s loud and big durrr so it be good for lothar. > Type of male seen driving: Meathead idiot. > > 3. College boy. Drives mustangs exclusively and tacks on various parts. It’s basically the domestic vehicle lobby against the “rice rocket” and other import cars. Just as tacky as the idiots who slap on huge wings on the back of honda civics except they do it on mustangs. excessive molding and stupid race slogans adorn their windshields. > Reasons for driving: MUSTANG IS COOL LOOKING AND THAT’S ALL DADDY WOULD BY MY RICH SPOILED ASS. > Type of male seen driving: white male in his early 20s. \*\* Wow!! methinks me hit a nerve!!! LOL,jealous much? Based upon well-documented current psychiatric profiles, your attitude puts you SOLIDLY in the camp of “person who felt themself to be lacking in some area” (i.e., you lack a solid and manly physique), and therefore all (or most) others who HAVE that quality which you lack (or feel you lack), MUST be brought down (using stereotyping as you include in this post), in order for you to feel better about your perceived “lack”. ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/110 "2003-01-04T23:27:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Feistymongol \* > \*\*Maybe that particular stereotype didn’t apply to you but here are the most often seen fanatics of domestic “muscle cars” : > \*\* PS, it didn’t and doesn’t apply to a TON of men I’ve dated and/or currently date (go steady with, cohabitate, whatever you want to call my current relationship with Brilliant Muscle Guy). The man my sister is dating is the same way, BIG, STRONG and WELL-muscled, also college educated, and a “muscle car” fanatic. None of the ones any of my girlfriends or students (from the dance/aerobic classes I teach) date/dated match your sweeping blanket generalizations either. Neither here, NOR in the states. So, I don’t know WHERE you are getting your statistics, but I’ve met VERY few of the type you describe (next to none) and MANY more of the type I describe. What? do you live in the appalachians or something? ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/111 "2003-01-04T23:43:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sam Stone \* > \*\*And if you think the little cars aren’t safe you need to go look at the crash test data. Size isn’t always everything. A WRX has an integral roll frame, a U-shaped protective frame around the cabin, front and side curtain airbags, and a bunch of other safety features. My 1967 Camaro had lap belts, a steel dash, a glove box door of steel that would flop open in an impact and become a knife at kneecap level (same for ignition key). > \*\* * * * It would be nice if you would quote to whom you are replying so we’ll know. However, since I mentioned being terrified while driving my honda, I’m gonna GUESS it’s me. Two examples from MY own life. 1.) Little honda car on it’s way to “the peninsula” (nevermind, it’s in the Kenai area about 150 miles south of anc.), ANYWAY. A lady and her 6 month old baby, who she’d HAD in a car seat in the back, as the carseat manufacturers recommend. At the time, I was working at a “Quick Stop” type store and grocery right across from where "it’ happened. Anyway, she pulled into our store because the baby was being a totol fussbudget, and switched the baby and carseat to the front. About a mile down the road from us (and on my way HOME, so I SAW the damn thing!!!) a truck pulls out and broadsides her. She, the lady with the honda, was 200% in the RIGHT, she was driving along a HIGHWAY and the guy pulled out from a side road at an estimated 20 some odd mph and NAILED her. She never even saw him. Anyway, the truck TOOK THE ENTIRE FREAKING BACK END OFF The LITTLE HONDA!!! I had WAITED on this lady, I was preggers myself and we’d talked about fussy babies, blah blah blah. When I saw her care in TWO PIECES, I had to pull over. I have NEVER forgotten it. 2.) I was driving My 1969 Riviera (one of the muscle cars supposedly only single digit IQ MEN drive, I’m a college educated, smallish dance instructing WOMAN), ANYWAY, I was stopped at a stop light when this little rice rocket rearends me at I don’t know WHAT speed, enough to total HER car. Damage to the Buick? (they’re really tanks in disguise you know,lol), The chrome “gas door” over the gas tank? Well, you have to sort of “tweak” it sideways a teensy bit now. Oh, and there was yellow paint all over one part of the bumper (but you’d be surprised what coca-cola and crumpled tinfoil will take off of a bumper!!!,lol). I thought of a few more. I had a 1979 Cadillac Eldorado. Red, previously owned by a little old man who’d been in a wreck with something and then was too scared to ever drive it again. PERFECT driving condition, except, the driver’s side looked like it’d been hit by a train. BUT, the door still worked PERFECTLY, was still soundproof from road noise, etc etc. My boyfriend’s brother works for the Department of Corrections and is friends with a lot of cops. They frequently bring in “show and tell” in the form of pics of accidents. The most horrifying and “totalled” ones? The little bitty hondas, subarus, etc. The caddy’s, Buicks, lincolns, Old musclers, etc, not nearly as much damage in their “after” photos. As in front ends or just fenders as opposed to the ENTIRE car, like in my first example. Also Sam, you WILL please note that I DID make CERTAIN to add a disclaimer to my post SAYING “of COURSE I realize that NEWER American cars do not fit the ‘sturdy in accidents’ profile as well” and I made SURE that I was clear that I meant OLDER model cars, and OLDER model musclers. ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2003, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/112 "2003-01-04T23:51:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CanvasShoes \* > > * * * > > l…Anyway, she pulled into our store because the baby was being a totol fussbudget, and switched the baby and carseat to the front. About a mile down the road from us (and on my way HOME, so I SAW the damn thing!!!) a truck pulls out and broadsides her. > > She, the lady with the honda, was 200% in the RIGHT, she was driving along a HIGHWAY and the guy pulled out from a side road at an estimated 20 some odd mph and NAILED her. She never even saw him. > > Anyway, the truck TOOK THE ENTIRE FREAKING BACK END OFF The LITTLE HONDA!!!.. > \*\* Yikes!! PS, sorry I forgot to add, YES, the lady and her baby WERE okay!! They would NOT have been had the baby still been in the back obviously. I did NOT find this out until the next day when the cops came back by for followup statements etc. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/113 "2003-01-05T01:28:37Z")
Yes. It’s called a ‘crumple zone’. In the old days, you see, the car would stay fairly intact and the passenger would take the 50+ mile per hour impact. Nowadays, the car sucks up the damage. Expensive and inconvienent, but it hurts much less at high speeds. As far as the old Cooper… Yes, my dad had one. Great fun… he once went shopping with it, with friends. As in, drove it in the supermarket, up and down the isles, and through the checkout. Still, no rubber on the road. Again, Top Fuel? Straight line racing is… you know, not my thing. That’s an acceleration test, not so _much_ driver skill as stepping on it. And I don’t think you could even vaugely compare what you get in Top Fuel to a street car. ---
**Author:** ![Dev\_Null](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/46a35a/32.png) [@Dev\_Null](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dev_Null)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/114 "2003-01-05T02:05:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sam Stone \* > \*\* > But I like new cars. Look at the WRX - It get 227 HP out of 2 Liters, goes 0-60 in 5.4 seconds, has AWD, handles like a rally car, and costs $24,000. That’s a serious boost in performance and value over similar cars in the 80’s or 90’s. And those old muscle cars like the 1967 Camaro I owned are looking positively archaic. \*\* New cars are great, and I too like what the WRX is all about. Cars have become more powerful, more efficient, and reliable. Nevertheless, that 227 HP (and similar high-output, low displacement motors) seem to generate that big power at RPM’s that aren’t really that useful. I just don’t like turning 5000 RPMs while merging in traffic. That’s why engines like Chevy’s vernerable 350 are so wonderful: They generate peak torque and power in a useful range. Now, with fuel injection and computer control, they rival the efficiency of many V-6 vehicles. Indeed, my Impala SS got better mileage than my minivan does. I think the reason that the ricers are ridiculous is that so many of the modifications are worthless: poor lowering jobs make the ride quality and handling suffer, and many engine mods ruin the useful low end of the motor. It’s like you are taking an otherwise useful vehicle and ruining it. For the same amount of money spent, you could have a high performance, emissions legal Camaro that will run circles around the Honda, and have enough money left over for gas for few years. But, in the end, spice of life, variety, and all that. –Dev ---
**Author:** ![Theios](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e8c25b/32.png) [@Theios](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Theios)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/115 "2003-01-05T02:20:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by enipla \* > \*\*My fav is the low rider pickup truck. What a waste. I even saw a low-rider CJ-7 once. In the mountains. \*\* Wait a minute… Wait one freakin’ minute here! How did this not get commented on? You saw a lowered Jeep CJ-7? And you let the driver get away with his life? Who the fuck lowers a Jeep CJ? How was this allowed to happen?! As a regeistered JeepChick, I’m legally required to smack the shit out of the owner of a lowered Jeep. Also, although I’m not required to, I’m encourged to buy/take/steal the poor thing from him so I can take it home and rehabilitate it. A lowered CJ… What in the hell is the world coming to now a days! Won’t someone think of the childeren!? ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/116 "2003-01-05T02:27:02Z")
I just saw a tricked out 240SX with a Type-R badge on it. :rolleyes: When are these clowns gonna learn? ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/117 "2003-01-05T03:40:01Z")
> [@](#): > > New cars are great, and I too like what the WRX is all about. Cars have become more powerful, more efficient, and reliable. Nevertheless, that 227 HP (and similar high-output, low displacement motors) seem to generate that big power at RPM’s that aren’t really that useful. I just don’t like turning 5000 RPMs while merging in traffic. That’s why engines like Chevy’s vernerable 350 are so wonderful: They generate peak torque and power in a useful range. Now, with fuel injection and computer control, they rival the efficiency of many V-6 vehicles. Indeed, my Impala SS got better mileage than my minivan does. I’m not here to denigrate American cars. I just love the sound of a big-block Chevy V-8 or a well tuned small block. They are great engines. My Camaro had a 327 that was 365HP when stock (from a ‘Vette’), and was considerably massaged from there. Every time I started that car was just a thrill. I loved it. I finally got a chance to test-drive a WRX today. What a fantastic car, and that power curve is a lot flatter than you’d think. I think the car makes plenty of HP and torgue down low - basically you just need to spool up the Turbo. But your point about wild small engines is dead on. I just read a review of the WRX STI, which is the ultra-high performance version with about 285HP (some say more). But it is apparently worse than a stock WRX in regular driving, because its torque and power curves look like Pike’s peak. The reviewer actually said that he got beat off the lights by a stock Honda civic, and by the time he got the RPM up to the point where the power really came on, he had to brake for the next light anyway. But that AWD with limited slip differentials front and back is just awesome. It is designed to put 60% of the power to the rear wheels and 40% to the front in normal operation, which is the way I like it. And if any wheels start to slip, power is automatically routed to the ones with traction. The thing just feels like it’s on rails, all the time. I took it onto a snowy road and did a panic stop - It stopped almost like it was on dry pavement. 4-wheel ABS, with separate sensors for each wheel. Then I did a fast start, and the thing just leapt away. Later, I drove our windstar over that road to see what it was like. Every time I tapped the gas the traction control kicked in and killed the power. But still… the WRX in Canada is $36,500 delivered. That’s a lot of money for what is essentially a subcompact sedan. I couldn’t help but think what I could do with any number of old cars and $30,000 to play with for building the drivetrain and suspension out. If we didn’t have snow and ice here half the time, I think the WRX would be too much money unless you’re rallying. You’ll never get full use out of the AWD system. I’d probably be looking at a Mustang Cobra, or maybe a new G35 coupe or something like that. Or maybe even a clean old '69 Z-28 or a '67 Vette. Those are my favorite cars. But that AWD in the winter makes driving to work FUN, instead of a chore. I’m sold on it. I wish I could find a good used AWD platform to build a sports car on, but the only ones I know of are Subaru and Audi, and I can’t find any good used ones within 500 miles of here. > [@](#): > > I think the reason that the ricers are ridiculous is that so many of the modifications are worthless: poor lowering jobs make the ride quality and handling suffer, and many engine mods ruin the useful low end of the motor. It’s like you are taking an otherwise useful vehicle and ruining it. For the same amount of money spent, you could have a high performance, emissions legal Camaro that will run circles around the Honda, and have enough money left over for gas for few years. One of the engineers I work with has a lowered Nissan mini-pickup truck. The thing can barely clear the speed bumps in our parking garage. It looks like a go-kart. And I guess that’s exactly the point. He LIKES being down low. And he likes the challenge of engineering a low vehicle with good suspension and handling. He likes having a vehicle like nothing else on the road. And lowering the Cg, if done right, gives you advantages in cornering. I certainly can’t criticize his choice. It’s certainly every bit as ‘valid’ as driving a crazy 400+ HP Camaro around on the street sucking gas like mad just so you can take it out to the track once every couple of months to see how small the little numbers are on the timeclock. None of us can defend this stuff. You think it’s silly to build a motor with a peaky torque curve - I could say it’s silly to build up a motor AT ALL. A stock one gets you around just fine. But I won’t say that, because I realize that we all do it for our own reasons. Some like to work on engines, some like the sound, some like the responsiveness, and some idiots like to race them on the street. > [@](#): > > But, in the end, spice of life, variety, and all that. Exactly. Just the fact that they are car lovers means the ‘ricers’ should have more in common with the rest of us than does the average person on the street. Why not just accept that they enjoy their cars in a different fashion, and forget about it. I think the answer is because, as this thread has shown, some people use these stupid ‘car wars’ as an excuse for racism, while others use them to try to feel superiority over other people. ---
**Author:** ![Blown\_Injected](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@Blown\_Injected](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blown_Injected)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/118 "2003-01-05T04:06:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by casdave \* > \*\*Racing in a straight line, hah! what a crock! \*\* Still the most powerful, and fastest racing there is AND done on the smallest track! You were about to say something about a faster more powerful car? - Yeah I thought so Even the roundie round type race is all about the drag race to the next turn. If your going slow enough to turn, your not going fast enough to be racing! ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/119 "2003-01-05T04:15:15Z")
Yes. The smallest track. That’s the point I disagree with. I understand your point, but… It’s not all about the drag race to the next turn. The corners, the entrances and exits, that’s where it’s not flat out. That’s where the driver can define his line and make his choice. Where you pass. Where you block and win. It’s you and your car against the road… and the other drivers. If you can’t turn, you’re not in control of your car. If all four wheels are sideways, if you’re drifting at over a hundred miles an hour and there’s someone on your tail and you know that in three two one now you catch hold and launch and leave him with nowhere to go but behind you… Then you’re racing. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2003, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/120 "2003-01-05T04:28:48Z")
You want to see REAL racing? I would argue that the Europeans have the Americans beat all hollow. We send our fast cars around an oval track. They send theirs across freaking Africa. They race theirs on public roads, in conditions the rest of the public drives in. They race them up mountains, through forests at night, and over deserts. Asian and European cars dominate these races. Small wonder that they are also making the very best cars for the public today. In terms of ride quality, sportiness, and build quality, non-American cars are eating the U.S’s lunch. Ford’s sales dropped 17% last year. Nissan is up by more than that. Subaru’s Impreza line went up 43% with the WRX. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255.md?page=7)