# Wow, I hate ricers. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 27, 2002, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255 "2002-12-27T23:16:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 3\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Tristan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tristan/32/18058_2.png) [@Tristan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tristan)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/161 "2003-01-10T07:01:27Z")
**B&I** - If I had the car that could stand with yours, I would post my timeslips. I don’t. I wish I did. I’ll just agree with you. Ricers are annoying, and quite possibly dangerous. Thankfully, real import tuning enthusiasts are not like that. The trick seems to be making old dogs learn new tricks. This may be impossible, in some cases. You keep talking about 1000 hp cars. Funny, I don’t see many of those in the domestic arena either. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 9:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/162 "2003-01-10T09:06:33Z")
Subaru just announced the American-spec 2004 STi. I think it’s safe to say this is, without a doubt, the baddest sedan ever sold in the United States: > [@](#): > > Powered by a turbocharged and intercooled 2.5-liter DOHC boxer engine producing 300 horsepower, the STi moves 300 foot-pounds of torque to all four wheels through a six-speed stick. The four-cylinder engine is based on a specially reinforced “semi-closed deck” engine block with forged aluminum alloy pistons, forged high-carbon steel connecting rods and sodium-filled exhaust valves. This power plant uses Subaru AVCS (Active Valve Control System) variable valve timing technology to improve the engine’s volumetric efficiency throughout the rev band. That’s conservative. Subaru has been running this same engine at well over 400HP in rally events. But even stock, this is 300hp and 300 ft-lbs of torque in a 3000 lb car, and AWD that puts that power right onto the pavement at all times. That last, by the way, makes all the difference in the world. The reason a stock WRX can do 5.4 seconds 0-60 is because it launches fast. A car like a GNX that can do 14 seconds on the track will have a harder time doing that in typical road conditions. It’ll be too hot, or too cold, or the surface will be rough and dirty, and the tires will on average be half worn out. And it takes a good driver to get good times out of a car that is traction limited. In a WRX, you just rev up to 4000-5000, and drop the clutch. The car just GOES. Neck-snapping acceleration. If you’re good with a clutch, you won’t hurt the tranny, although the clutch might not thank you. Do it wrong, and you can wreck your transmission in a dozen or so launches. That’s why you probably see WRX’s running a little slower than they can - the drivers are either afraid to drive them hard, or intentionally back off to go easy on the car. But I’m guessing that 300HP Sti will be running low 13 second quarters, and probably has a 0-60 time of 4.6-4.7. That’s fast. It may be the fastest sedan ever sold, other than some exotic European hardware. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255/163 "2003-01-10T14:57:21Z")
Now, to be honest, B&I has a point. It is a _lot_ easier to work on a RWD american sedan. For one thing, there’s a lot more space to work in. The entire drivetrain is open and exposed, there’s plenty of elbow room under the hood. It takes _hours_ to yank a subcompact engine, and it’s a bear to get a good handle on the transmission, with everything tucked into a small space. Plus, there’s more space to cut things away. Want really fat tires?Cut out the rear quarterpanel. Not to mention the natural settling advantage of how a RWD squats when launched. FWD has a problem there. So, anyone hear about the new SCCA rally series this year? Subaru versus some Lancer Evos Mitsu brought over. Should be real good. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wow-i-hate-ricers/145255.md?page=8)