# WTC terrorist Q and hopefully A **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 13, 2002, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727 "2002-08-13T18:06:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Meatros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/1 "2002-08-13T18:06:33Z")
As I’m sure we all have, I’ve heard a lot about the terrorists who hijacked the planes for 9/11. One thing I keep hearing though bothers me. It is that they didn’t learn how to land. This smells of urban legend to me, but I don’t know for certain. So did the terrorists indeed skip on the landing lessons? ---
**Author:** ![jb\_farley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9d8465/32.png) [@jb\_farley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jb_farley)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/2 "2002-08-13T18:12:18Z")
no, that pernicious rumor started up pretty soon after the bombings. in fact, it was started by the FBI. lemme rummage around for a cite. jb ---
**Author:** ![Gjorp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c4cdca/32.png) [@Gjorp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gjorp)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/3 "2002-08-13T18:19:34Z")
I think I heard the ‘no landing’ thing before, but I never took it for fact. I thought it was just a joke. ---
**Author:** ![EmbarrassingDad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/embarrassingdad/32/5441_2.png) [@EmbarrassingDad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EmbarrassingDad)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/4 "2002-08-13T18:24:11Z")
It wasn’t a joke. The terrorists bought time on flight simulators and learned the basics on how to turn the planes, but showed no interest in learning how to land. lemme rumage around for a cite. ---
**Author:** ![Meatros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/5 "2002-08-13T18:24:24Z")
I took it to be a joke too, but some friends of mine believe it for fact. Hence my interest. ---
**Author:** ![Meatros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/6 "2002-08-13T18:30:09Z")
Uh-oh, a competition for cites!! ---
**Author:** ![jb\_farley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9d8465/32.png) [@jb\_farley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jb_farley)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/7 "2002-08-13T18:32:33Z")
dammit. i can’t find what i found before. here’s [something](http://www.startribune.com/stories/1576/913687.html), but not what i had before. damned yahoo news and it’s shitty premium services. jb ---
**Author:** ![partly\_warmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bc8723/32.png) [@partly\_warmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/partly_warmer)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/8 "2002-08-13T18:34:07Z")
Not wanting to learn to land would make sense, however. Landing a plane is more difficult than taking off or normal flight. Even if the terrorists didn’t openly say “skip the part of the class on landing” it seems unavoidable that they paid little or no attention to it. It’s sort of like people saying: “I don’t have any intention of blowing up a bridge, but I was just wondering, what explosive would you use, how much, and where would you put it?” It’s _obviously_ hypothetical, right? All in the pure pursuit of abstract knowledge? ---
**Author:** ![Rhythmdvl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/9 "2002-08-13T18:34:21Z")
_Originally posted by **Meatros** _ > [@](#): > > Uh-oh, a competition for cites!! Dija hear?! Cite-off at the Hot House!!! ---
**Author:** ![Meatros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/10 "2002-08-13T18:57:24Z")
The reason I am curious is because some friends of mine are upset at the people who trained them, saying they should have known to call the FBI. I say even if it was the case, hindsight is 20/20. ---
**Author:** ![jb\_farley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9d8465/32.png) [@jb\_farley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jb_farley)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/11 "2002-08-13T18:58:41Z")
okay, frickin yahoo has decided to suck my choad, so i can’t back up the following contention. take it with a largish grain of salt (about half a lot’s wife) until i can rummage up a cite. not only have (some of) the flight schools denied the “they didn’t want to take off or land”, but they have come forward and stated (some of) the hijackers _specifically_ requested such lessons. fwiw, i know one instructor, who informed the FBI beforehand, _did_ say that two of the hijackers seemed uninterested in taking off and landing (which made him suspicious), but that is a far cry from what most media have been trumpeting since shit went down. jb ---
**Author:** ![EmbarrassingDad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/embarrassingdad/32/5441_2.png) [@EmbarrassingDad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EmbarrassingDad)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/12 "2002-08-13T19:19:28Z")
Sorry folks, I guess I lose the cite-off. (I can’t find a good reliable one). What I’m referring to are interviews with the instructor at the Florida flight school which trained some of the terrorists. I think I saw it on the discovery channel. I did, however, find a cite for **jb\_farley’s** last post: > [@](#): > > But [FBI Director Robert S. Mueller III] told prosecutors yesterday that earlier accounts of Moussaoui’s behavior were wrong. Moussaoui did not tell instructors at the flight school that he wanted to learn only how to steer a plane in midair. Rather, he told his instructors he wanted to learn only how to take off and land, Mueller said. This doesn’t really debunk my claim, however, because this is a different flight school, and different “students”. [http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&node=&contentId=A31590-2001Nov14](http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&node=&contentId=A31590-2001Nov14) ---
**Author:** ![EmbarrassingDad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/embarrassingdad/32/5441_2.png) [@EmbarrassingDad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EmbarrassingDad)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/13 "2002-08-13T19:38:01Z")
Before I get nitpickers, I know Moussaoui was not one of the 9/11 hijackers. So it’s not really a good cite anyway. ---
**Author:** ![NurseCarmen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5daacb/32.png) [@NurseCarmen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NurseCarmen)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/14 "2002-08-13T19:43:51Z")
The Minnesota connection certainly had that as the case [http://www.washtimes.com/national/20020517-70217917.htm](http://www.washtimes.com/national/20020517-70217917.htm) “Moussaoui had enrolled in the Pan Am International Flying Academy in Eagan, Minn., and had paid $8,000 to learn how to fly a commercial jetliner but had expressed disinterest in learning to take off and land.” As far as the others, I’m unsure. ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/15 "2002-08-13T19:52:43Z")
> [@](#): > > The terrorists bought time on flight simulators and learned the basics on how to turn the planes, but showed no interest in learning how to land. Yep, I remember hearing it, too–it was a flight _simulator_ teacher who said it, not a “flight school” instructor. > **[Two terrorists were under investigation by FBI](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2001/sep/17/september11.usa7)** > > The manhunt Intelligence services under attack for missing hijackers living in America > [@](#): > > Atta, 33, and Marwan Al-Shehhi, who was on the United Airlines flight that crashed into the south tower, both trained at the Huffman Aviation International Flight School in Venice, Florida, for four months last year. They paid a total of $38,700 (£26,000) for the course, which ended in November. > > A month later, they spent another $1,500 for three hours of flight simulator training at the SimCenter, near Miami. An instructor said they concentrated on turning aircraft, rather than practising the more difficult manoeuvres of take-off and landing, which he thought was unusual. [http://www.sptimes.com/News/100201/Floridian/The\_terrorists\_next\_d.shtml](http://www.sptimes.com/News/100201/Floridian/The_terrorists_next_d.shtml) > [@](#): > > Atta and al-Shehhi earned their pilots’ licenses in late December and left for the Miami area two weeks later, practicing midair turns on a Boeing 727 flight simulator in Opa-Locka. ---
**Author:** ![AZCowboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/97f17d/32.png) [@AZCowboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AZCowboy)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/16 "2002-08-13T19:54:44Z")
It is not urban legend, but much closer to fact. I remember a television interview shortly after 9/11 with the owner of the flight school in Venice, FL, who mentioned that the instructors thought it odd that Atta and Al-Shehhi had little interest in learning to take off or land, and much interest in navigation and level flight (the opposite of a normal student). I have no cite for this TV interview, but this story from the Guardian includes: > [@](#): > > _**[The Guardian Unlimited, 9/17/2001](http://www.guardian.co.uk/wtccrash/story/0,1300,553122,00.html)**_ > A month later, they spent another $1,500 for three hours of flight simulator training at the SimCenter, near Miami. An instructor said they concentrated on turning aircraft, rather than practising the more difficult manoeuvres of take-off and landing, which he thought was unusual. And Zacarias Moussaoi apparently had the same problem, according to this: > [@](#): > > _**[Time Magazine, 7/19/2002](http://www.time.com/time/pow/article/0,8599,322143,00.html)**_ > Moussaoui’s “martyrdom” mission went ahead without him, largely as a result of his own sloppiness. The hapless 34-year-old Frenchman had been arrested by the FBI on immigration charges after carelessly arousing suspicion at a Minnesota flight school. Even in those infinitely more innocent days, a man impatient to learn to operate a Boeing 767 in midair but singularly uninterested in the art of takeoff and landing was not going to pass unnoticed. His more disciplined comrades were careful to avoid triggering alarms, diligently mastering the superfluous skills of takeoff and landing during their time at American flight schools. Moussaoui was a bust. FWIW ---
**Author:** ![cards](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecd19e/32.png) [@cards](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cards)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/17 "2002-08-13T21:18:56Z")
Anything Moussaoui says would have to be highly suspect. He was sloppy in executing his role in the attack, an avowed enemy of the U.S. and now he’s on trial for his life. ---
**Author:** ![Meatros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/18 "2002-08-13T21:31:08Z")
So what I’m getting here is that the flight simulation part had the “uninteresting” comment. For the most part though the actual flight part they had to be instructed on how to land. ---
**Author:** ![partly\_warmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bc8723/32.png) [@partly\_warmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/partly_warmer)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2002, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/19 "2002-08-13T23:32:22Z")
Yeah, some flight instructor had to say “See that down there? That’s the ground! Now, son, you may not be able to tell the difference between good and evil, but it’s very important you recognize what that brown stuff is.” ---
**Author:** ![Meatros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2002, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727/20 "2002-08-14T01:09:00Z")
That had me chuckling partly! [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtc-terrorist-q-and-hopefully-a/123727.md?page=2)