# WTF is wrong with the moronic bush supporting republicans? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 26, 2004, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477 "2004-03-26T01:31:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/41 "2004-03-26T05:56:53Z")
5 hours and you pick that drivel to reply to? ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/42 "2004-03-26T06:00:35Z")
> [@Quint Essence](#): > > Cowardice and the support for Bush go hand in hand. Nothing but a bunch of whining pussies afraid of the boogeyman. So afraid in fact that they are willing to overlook the lies, deceptions and illegal activities of a corrupt and ineffective president. > You guys shame your whole country. > Seriously. Bush has accomplished something no president before him has. He has managed to make a good portion of this country ASHAMED to call themselves american. > You morons who willingly support this asshole just embarrass us more. Once again… WHAT Lies, corruption, illegal activities, and deceipt??? Again, you may, or may not have valid complaints, but how are the others in this thread to know what they are, if you don’t state them and provide back up documentation for them?? Some facts and proof to back up your accusations, whatever it is that you’re accussing him/them of, would be nice. ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/43 "2004-03-26T06:04:04Z")
> [@The Skipper](#): > > Look, although I agree with you. Thank you, but I must be honest and say that I don’t agree with much of what \*you’\*ve posted in this thread. > [@](#): > > Losing a son, 18 yrs old, has to be devastating emotionally. I can’t even imagine it. Can’t we be a little more compassionate? Frankly, I don’t get the feeling s/he was saddened by it. The impression I get, from the easy way s/he slides it into a rambling, generalized political rant is that it’s “another reason to hate Bush.” And I find \*that \* wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/44 "2004-03-26T06:13:52Z")
> [@](#): > > Seriously. Bush has accomplished something no president before him has. He has managed to make a good portion of this country ASHAMED to call themselves american. Christ, you _must_ either be about 15 or unbelievably unobservant, or the fact of hysterical chicken-little morons climbing out of the woodwork shouting “this is the worst president in history!” about **every single president we elect** would be very, very old hat. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/45 "2004-03-26T06:14:33Z")
> [@Quint Essence](#): > > Bush has accomplished something no president before him has. He has managed to make a good portion of this country ASHAMED to call themselves american. Ummmm…no. That would have been Clinton. Besides, there isn’t anything else to vote for. The Democrats, and what passes for their platform, is a joke. Gods know i am very unhappy with Bush, but it’s not like the Democrats are pushing a viable option. ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 6:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/46 "2004-03-26T06:19:28Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Ummmm…no. That would have been Clinton. > > Besides, there isn’t anything else to vote for. The Democrats, and what passes for their platform, is a joke. Gods know i am very unhappy with Bush, but it’s not like the Democrats are pushing a viable option. And this is the bottom line, when it comes right down to it, we don’t vote because we think that any one candidate is so great, but because he’s the least of the evils from which we’re forced to choose. ---
**Author:** ![Quint\_Essence](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/54ee81/32.png) [@Quint\_Essence](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quint_Essence)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/47 "2004-03-26T06:47:18Z")
well let’s see. He lied when he said Iraq was a threat. He lied about their possession of WMD He lied about supporting our troops (then cutting benefits and hazard pay among other things not to mention failing to equip them properly in the first place.) He lied about the long term costs of his tax cuts. He lied and kept others from revealing a 100 billion dollar difference in his new medicare plan. He lied about virtually every reason for going to war. calling Saddam Hussein a threat to both ourselves and his neighbors as well as lying about the weapons themselves and about Iraqi capabilities such as their “drone” planes and their ability to project biological and chemical munitions to the United States. He lied about Syrian involvement. He lied about Iranian involvement well I could go on and on but maybe we should try a new tact. Can YOU name anything (program, initiative, war, etc.) that he did NOT offer untruths and misleading rhetoric to support? Anything? ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 7:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/48 "2004-03-26T07:13:40Z")
Let’s see: **The Skipper** **American Maid** **Quint Essence** Looks like 2 liberal asshats and one conservative asshat. I guess they’re right… this _is_ a left leaning board. (Oh, and **The Skipper** , two quick comments: (1) You believe that Al Franken doesn’t believe Al Qaede even EXISTS? Cite? (2) Yes, Clinton got a blow job. But that didn’t tie up the country for two years. The hysterical investigation and impeachment trial related to that blowjob is what tied up the country. Granted, it was incredibly stupid for him to do it, and even stupider to weasel around dishonestly about it, but to blame him exclusively for teh morass that resulted is idiotic) ---
**Author:** ![John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/2bfe46/32.png) [@John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Carter_of_Mars)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 7:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/49 "2004-03-26T07:15:29Z")
> [@Bob!](#): > > You know, people like **Quint Essence** make it difficult for those of us on the fence to _not_ vote for Bush, come November. One one hand, yes, Bush sucks. But on the other hand, we have two bad candidates, and electing Bush will piss off all sorts of people I find so incredibly annoying. Decisions, decisions! I know where you’re comin’ from there, **Bob.** Every one of these over the top OP’s drives me a little closer to voting for Bush. **AmericanMaid** : I’m very sorry for your friend’s loss, but: A Humvee is not suited to carrying the type of armour that would be required to protect against an RPG. Tank type vehicles can and do carry such protection. Remember, the Hummer is a replacement for the old Army Jeep. It’s designed for transportation, not combat. I don’t think there’s any way to have transportation vehicles designed for full combat activity. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/50 "2004-03-26T07:23:24Z")
> [@](#): > > I don’t think there’s any way to have transportation vehicles designed for full combat activity. Well, certainly not be armored and have all the capabilities Humvee’s have…reconnaissance, fast patrols, etc. There are APC’s which are armored and are essentially for transport, but they don’t have nearly the range of capabilities of a Humvee. ---
**Author:** ![Baraqiyal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@Baraqiyal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baraqiyal)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/51 "2004-03-26T07:59:36Z")
> [@Quint Essence](#): > > Personally the stupidity I see on a daily basis coming from this administration is ridiculous and embarrassing to every THINKING american and if BUSh wasnt directly involved in the 9-11 tragedy, it is only because Rumsfeld and cheney deemed him too stupid to be informed. Is this part a joke? ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 8:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/52 "2004-03-26T08:06:00Z")
> [@The Skipper](#): > > I’d say those that get their information from Jon Stewart are the dumb ones. Says the guy who thinks Fox News, Bill O’Reilly, Mike Savage, and Sean Hannity are the only news sources worth believing. :rolleyes: What’s next, an objective report on the benefits of racial segregation from Strom Thurmond? ---
**Author:** ![pilot141](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e0b2c6/32.png) [@pilot141](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pilot141)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 8:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/53 "2004-03-26T08:49:24Z")
Christ, doesn’t anyone else realize what a stupid argument this is? If Bush was involved in the discussion of how to place armor on HMMWVs then I’ll be disappointed, much like I’d be disappointed if Clinton was involved in what navigation systems should be on the CT-43 VIP aircraft that flew Commerce Secretary Ron Brown into a mountain. Yes, people died in both cases, but should the President really be responsible? If you say yes then you know nothing about leadership. It’s called delegation, and choosing the right person for the job. Move on people, and get some rational discussion please. ---
**Author:** ![Cerri](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3bc359/32.png) [@Cerri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cerri)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/54 "2004-03-26T12:20:34Z")
> [@](#): > > This is the problem with women analyzing military matters. They’ve no clue. … ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/55 "2004-03-26T12:39:27Z")
The Skipper made some very valid points. Too bad he had to post some _really_ stupid ones. > [@The Skipper](#): > > Proffer your evidence of no Saddam/9-11 connection. Did Saddam hand the keys over to Osama? Who knows. But they are all in bed together. Wasn’t Abu Nidal just caught there? (Achille Laura) Even so, we wiped out a sizeable next of terrorist scumbags and their camps up north (Ansar Alsawat or some such spelling). Saddam was providing a Motel 6 for these brutal, cold-blooded murderers. Come off it. Even the government has said they do not support this. You are being more Bushista than Bush himself which is a clear sign of fanaticism. > [@](#): > > The kid suicide bomber that got cold feet today in Israel is a classic example of what we are dealing with. He was COERCED into doing this. What type of merciless, cold-blooded, pathologically insane person could do this to children? He was definitely coerced but there are troubling signs which indicate it may have been staged by the Israelis. It does not change the nature of the conflict. The Israelis are not all good and the Palestinians are not all bad. > [@](#): > > This is the problem with women analyzing military matters. They’ve no clue. I think you are an asshole. > [@](#): > > But you are playing right into the terrorists hands just like Spain has done. Yep, I definitely think you are an asshole. Very much an asshole. ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/56 "2004-03-26T13:50:21Z")
> [@AmericanMaid](#): > > HiS HUMVEE WASN’T FUCKING ARMORED! NONE OF THE HUMVEES OVER THERE ARE! \* How dare this president send our sons and daughters to a war without sufficient equipment! He’s just sending some great kids to the slaughter. Get Jenna in uniform and ship her out just wait and see how armored the humvees will be. Asshole… The standard version of the HUMVEE uses aluminium, fibreglass, or kevlar door panels from what I’ve researched. This is for the sake of mobility and speed, which are kind of essential to the purpose of the HUMVEE. The decision not to put armored doors on them was NOT that of Bush, nor may it even be wise to do so. Every bit of weight you add on to a vehicle is going to decrease manuverability and quickness. I’m sorry, but these are basic facts of physics and military design, and in any event even if you question the balance between armor/weight on the HUMVEE, **this is not fucking Bush’s fault!** The Boston Globe has an interesting article on this. Here are some quotes: > [@](#): > > Military planners thought tanks or armored personnel carriers would be used for combat patrols. But there are not enough to go around in Iraq, where American troops drive more than 10,000 Humvees, according to the Army. > > Last spring, the Army sent more than 500 “up-armored” Humvees made by Armor Holdings Inc.'s O’Gara-Hess & Eisenhardt unit in Fairfield, Ohio. These vehicles add about 3,800 pounds of bulletproof windshields and steel plating to the 6,000-pound Humvee made by AM General LLC of South Bend, Ind. Other Humvees are reinforced with lighter, add-on steel armor kits. Increasing the weight of a vehicle from 6,000 pounds to 9,800 pounds is a pretty serious business. Without a corresponding engine upgrade, I can’t see how these things would behave that well relative to the lighter, quicker ones. > [@](#): > > The protection became more valuable last summer, as the guerrilla warfare began. Patrols faced more attacks and land mines, making reinforced vehicles critical. Given that the main purpose of a land mine is to explode _under_ a vehicle or person, I’m trying to see how much of the armor is going to be that effective anyhow, but I’m not a military designer. Nonetheless, I do know that it does take a serious amount of armor to adequately defend against land mines - possibly more than a HUMVEE engine can really move effectively. > [@](#): > > How they would get more, quickly, was unclear, since the Pentagon’s original 2005 budget request included 818 up-armored Humvees. An unarmored Humvee costs about $75,000, while an armored one costs about twice as much. Of the total number of Humvees in Iraq, just over 2,000 are fully armored, according to an Army tally, about half of what it says it needs. But who is responsible? Bush? Has _any_ sitting president gone line item by line item through any 10,000 page appropriations bill to micromanage things of this small of cost? Would it even be in legislation, or just under general military funding? > [@](#): > > Designers at Foster-Miller, a closely held engineering company, proposed a quick fix: use armor panels made from ceramic and Kevlar that could be attached to Humvee doors with Velcro. The idea is less unusual than it sounds. Since the early 1990s, the company has used fabric strips made or designed by Velcro USA Inc. of Manchester, N.H., to attach similar panels inside the cockpits of military transport planes. > > While the Army tested Foster-Miller’s product last fall, the service still has not ordered any. Other companies that proposed similar add-on armor kits complained Army officials were not interested. “Army Officials” weren’t interested. Does that mean Bush, directly? > [@](#): > > The Army acknowledges it has been slow to fortify its Humvees, but says it is moving as fast as it can. Acting Secretary of the Army Les Brownlee told a Senate Armed Services Committee last week that when US troops first arrived in Iraq last spring, “there wasn’t a feeling that all Humvees should be up-armored,” **partly because the extra weight slowed them.** By June, the Army saw that its Humvees needed more protection from the flood of land mines. > > “We realize that all soldiers were being exposed to these kinds of attacks and that convoys, in particular, were exposed,” Brownlee said. “That’s when we began to ramp up to provide those as soon as we could.” (emphasis added) Armoring the HUMVEES was a trade-off. In the initial parts of a desert war, you need light, fast, troop transports. You also need armored personnel carriers and tanks too. You need a range of vehicles to suit the needs and get the job done. Reaching for straws like this to show how Bush is history’s greatest monster is not intellectually honest. It’s partisan slurs meant to inflame an ignorant populace, that I would think would have been decried or at least questioned by intelligent persons on “both sides” of the election, but oh well…and it happens way too often here in this forum and on this Board, and I’m tired of it, even though I do dislike and distrust Bush. ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/57 "2004-03-26T13:56:29Z")
> [@The Skipper](#): > > This is the problem with women analyzing military matters. They’ve no clue. Hey, you misogynistic little bedwetting piece of shit, do you want to take this woman on “over analyzing military matters”? Just come on down and pick your topic. Or maybe you want to withdraw that dumbass phrase up there? :mad: ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/58 "2004-03-26T13:58:59Z")
> [@Quint Essence](#): > > Cowardice and the support for Bush go hand in hand. Nothing but a bunch of whining pussies afraid of the boogeyman. So afraid in fact that they are willing to overlook the lies, deceptions and illegal activities of a corrupt and ineffective president. > You guys shame your whole country. > Seriously. Bush has accomplished something no president before him has. He has managed to make a good portion of this country ASHAMED to call themselves american. > You morons who willingly support this asshole just embarrass us more. “Bitter”, party of one, your table is ready! I hate George Bush and what he stands for as much as any other red-blooded American, but Dude, find your “return” key. My attention span can’t take the stream of conscious writing… ---
**Author:** ![AmericanMaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@AmericanMaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AmericanMaid)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/59 "2004-03-26T14:29:44Z")
> [@The Skipper](#): > > I’d say those that get their information from Jon Stewart are the dumb ones… > > Hey, don’t mean to burst your bubble but you lefty’s (Michael Morer, Al Franken, Barbara Streisand, Janine Garafalo, Susan Sarandon and her nutcase husband, et al) don’t even believe Al Queda exists… > > In a sense I understand your frustration. But you are playing right into the terrorists hands just like Spain has done. You wait and see. Nothing will change. **Skipper** , if you re-read my original post, I said I had just seen Jon Stewart’s stand up routine and passed along a funny line. I actually get my news from CNN, the BBC and NPR thank you very much. Where do you get yours from? I believe Al Qaeda exists (psst, you spell it this way. No “u”). I have read many articles about their beliefs and history. Plus, I awake and conscious on 9/11. Do you have a cite that Michael Moore and Co. don’t believe in Al Qaeda? From what I’ve read, they do believe. I do admit that I didn’t like Bush before my co-worker lost her son but her loss fueled my dislike even more. She is still a Bush supporter and Republican. We have very good talks about issues. I think my frustration and this being the Pit made me foam at the mouth a bit. ☹ However, I firmly believe Spain did not play into terrorist’s hands. They voted out a government that didn’t take 90% of the population’s views into consideration. That’s not kow-towing to terrorists. It’s democracy. You know, that thing we’re trying to set up in Iraq? 😉 I asked my co-worker about the Humvee issue due to all the data and assertions that have been given in this topic. She says that armoring Humvees does weigh it down a lot. So much so that they cannot be air dropped. The way she explained it, in traditional war there’s tanks in the front and support vehicles behind. That’s the war the U.S. military equipped for in Iraq. But since it’s guerilla warfare over there, that isn’t how fighting exists. There’s no neat lines advancing. Also, she told me that she knows for a fact that the ceramic plates on armored Humvees can hold back an RPG attack. **Skipper** , if you apologize for that women crack, there’s no hard feelings. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2004, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477/60 "2004-03-26T16:01:56Z")
\< adds Quint Essence to the list of liberals too fucking stupid to tell the difference between a rant and a greate debate\> Why don’t **you** people start these threads in the pit where they belong? For god’s sake… but hey, I do have a new idea for a Great Debate " Why are so many liberal too fucking stupid to tell the dif…" 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-is-wrong-with-the-moronic-bush-supporting-republicans/236477.md?page=4)