# WTF? Otto was just banned by Ed. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 10, 2008, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971 "2008-09-10T18:35:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/101 "2008-09-10T20:32:35Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > I got the impression that **danceswithcats** posted several times because the board’s software was not keeping up with things, not because that in itself was snarky. I’ve found the response time fairly poor this afternoon. I know, I was just making a lame joke. I am prone to those. ---
**Author:** ![Stealth\_Potato](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Stealth\_Potato](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stealth_Potato)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/102 "2008-09-10T20:32:37Z")
> [@fluiddruid](#): > > [Here.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6773058&postcount=25)It is old, and we let him have a few (at least 3 that I could see on a quick pass) warnings since that time without being banned (the moderator consensus was that even final warnings should expire at some point, it’s not fair to summarily ban at any point in the future thereafter). I’m guessing that Ed felt that his past history meant something, and that Otto’s sticking of a toe over the line to see how Ed would react meant that it was time to end his posting privileges. And given this context, I would agree that the moderators have acted properly and exercised tolerance in dealing with a person who may have been something of a problem poster. But that does not excuse this banning. As much as Otto’s big mouth may have merited a ban sooner or later, choosing this relatively benign question as the “final straw” was an inexcusably poor decision. It reflects very poorly on the administration, suggesting that they are more likely to react to their personal irritation or a perceived sting to their ego than an objective and dispassionate evaluation of what’s best for the board. I’ve been around here for a few years now, and I’ve always refrained from getting involved in board politics. Most of the time I’ve felt that complaining about the board’s occasionally unpredictable performance was just a futile and ungrateful exercise, or that the people who were complaining about so-and-so being banned were just being silly. But this one was really a shocking example of rather childish behavior on the part of the board’s administrator, and I felt that I could not let it pass without adding my voice to the throng in demanding some measure of sanity. And count me as one more who is not particularly impressed by **Ed** ’s response. ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/103 "2008-09-10T20:33:31Z")
It might be worth pointing out that this rule promising instant bannings is still only mentioned in a sticky in ATMB. Which would be silly enough were it not that someone had already mentioned that to\*\* Ed.\*\* So, you know, either whoever’s in charge of rule postings is incompetent or they’re hoping people will end up breaking the rule and can be banned. But no matter, we simply have a new rule with immensely arbitrary enforcement possibilities that results in banning, and **Ed’s** pissed off today. No worries. ---
**Author:** ![Caffeine.addict](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f475e1/32.png) [@Caffeine.addict](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caffeine.addict)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/104 "2008-09-10T20:34:14Z")
I think that this is over the top. I don’t have a problem with Ed setting up a forum to plug his book. Its his forum, more power to him, I wish him well. I can see getting frustrated with people questioning everything but Otto’s banning for that comment is completely over the top. It wasn’t that snarky and it is a legitimate question. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/105 "2008-09-10T20:34:25Z")
> [@Darth\_Nader](#): > > Fair enough. I’m going to go ahead and guess that **Otto** would still be around, if not for you having a bad day, **Ed**. > Nice. Wonder if this is the day they decided to remainder The Barn House? I should also note that I have very few warm fuzzies for Ed, especially after this. I mean, I know he’s Cecil and all that crap, but you know what? I haven’t read a Straight Dope column that wasn’t linked as an answer to a thread question in years. I don’t come here for the columns. This site might as well not even HAVE a front page as far as I’m concerned. My bookmark goes straight to the Board front page, and I don’t have a bookmark for [straightdope.com](http://straightdope.com). So, frankly, I liked Ed better when he was using a pseudonym and not coming to the boards… ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/106 "2008-09-10T20:36:30Z")
Maybe he banged his thumb with a hammer. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/107 "2008-09-10T20:37:09Z")
I have stuck with this board through all kinds of crazy crap. I bought the T-shirt and the coffee mug and all the damn books multiple times. I convinced friends and family to sign up here. I paid for other people’s memberships when we went pay. I have supported this godforsaken place any way that I could. But banning posters for essentially no reason because the site owner is apparently having a bad day and feeling pissy is just really too far. I’m out for now. I have to really consider whether the other posters and the discussion here is worth putting up with this kind of childish nonsense. ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/108 "2008-09-10T20:37:15Z")
[Tin Foil Hat on] I posted the OP a little bit more than an hour ago, when everything was timing out. My guess is that all the brouhaha made for a peak in traffic, which was why performance was so poor (And all Mountain and Pacific time Dopers returning from lunch). Anyway. I’m thinking Ed’s skin is so thin, because he doesn’t want someone rocking the boat. The new owners have probably paid a couple o’ thousand bucks for a new server, they have been promised ad and subscription revenue (with a promise of more money from ads than from subscription). Jerry has been spending almost two weeks (including labor day weekend [double overtime?]) one something he usually spends ½ an hour a week maintaining. All this is spending money, while there still (probably) hasn’t been a greater influx of revenue. So all in all, Ed is nervous that he’s got a sack of money from Creative Loafing, the whole place is on the verge of rioting, and no money’s coming in. I think he just wants everyone to STFU and stop posting, while Jerry fixes everything, so he can point to this shiny new investment and justify the cost. Of course, it was extremely ill advised of him to start his own vanity forum at the same time as The Big Upgrade. Had he postponed it for a month, it wouldn’t have bothered as many people. As it is, it looks as if the upgrade was made to enable the Barn Owl and further Ed’s own needs. Personally, I don’t have an issue with his vanity forum. It’s not a topic that interests me (living in a rented apartment) and since the Dope can easily be described as his creation, he can do what he wants. However, I don’t think TBO is his agenda here. It’s about making the new owners happy. And the current atmosphere is not a happy one. Spurious (Sp?) bannings is, however, not the way to reach calmer waters. If Ed had spent more time here, he’d know that. Dopers are prickly, argumentative and - in most cases - absolutely certain they’re in the right. [/tin foil hat] the previous rant was in no way coherent. I’m no fan of **Otto**. He comes across as whiney, hating the fact that he’s gay, and abbrasive. On the whole, though, I think he’s a net contributor to CS, where I read and post the most. ---
**Author:** ![mske](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ccd318/32.png) [@mske](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mske)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/109 "2008-09-10T20:39:36Z")
C’mon Ed – just shut the board down. Whip out that big dick of yours and show us all who is boss. Bunch of words on your screen from a small sample of the world’s population has you stressed out? Wimp. Quoted from **Ed Zotti** in the ATMB Thread: > [@](#): > > If you find them rude, you’re welcome to find another board where the staff is more to your liking. So clearly since you are not up to the task and find it to be more trouble than it is worth - turn the lights off on the SDMB for good and be done with it. I know you secretly want to, but tell yourself that the members here _need_ you to keep it going. Don’t believe it - I think you will be surprised how easily everyone would quickly evaluate the relative non-importance of this place and find other places to congregate and interact on the web. > [@](#): > > I don’t wish to hear any further comments just now about SDMB administration. Geez. Sorry that your attempts to whore your book are being derailed slightly by human beings and their failings, not slaves to your wishes. Why the hell do you need a web presence anyway for the Reader, a free community newspaper? > [@](#): > > Today is not the day to be pushing your luck. Ooooooooo… ---
**Author:** ![NineToTheSky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5a626/32.png) [@NineToTheSky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NineToTheSky)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/110 "2008-09-10T20:39:40Z")
You know, Ed, how I see it it is this. In my experience, when people at work have hissy fits, aren’t willing to communicate civily and as a boss throw their weight around aggressively, it usually means that either they’re completely out of their depth, or really don’t like the job they’re doing. And, usually, in those situations, it’s best for the person concerned just to get out quickly and find something else to do. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/111 "2008-09-10T20:39:43Z")
So as I see it, when outside the Pit, one should only answer ‘yes’, ‘no’, or ‘I don’t know’, or risk being banned for some imagined slight. Since when can someone read inflection or intent into the written word? Or is Ed Zotti (aka Cecil) so all-knowing that he can even divine what someone is thinking? This banning is bullshit alright, but worse than that, it’s petty and sets a tone that most are not going to tolerate. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/112 "2008-09-10T20:40:10Z")
> [@pravnik](#): > > Maybe he banged his thumb with a hammer. Or something else. ---
**Author:** ![THespos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8c91f0/32.png) [@THespos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/THespos)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/113 "2008-09-10T20:40:17Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > I don’t think paying $15 entitles us to abuse anyone, but how about some fucking respect? How many other sites do you pay to use. As for myself, this is the only site I pay for, and the mods here are, let’s say, more unpredictable than any other message board I’m on. Shit, I just paid something like $200 for a pay-to-post site to get access to potential nannies. I have an online Wall Street Journal subscription. I probably give out $10 worth of Facebook gifts a week. I’m involved in at least three other pay-to-play online communities. All of them charge more than this one, and I think the mods and admins here are better than the mods and admins on many other pay-to-play websites. My company is heavily involved in the online community space, and I’ve even considered asking some of the mods and admins here if they’d consider coming to New York on a stipend and teaching some of my entry-level people how to moderate an online community. This place is an absolute model on how moderated online communities should function, in my book. I’m interested to hear what boards you’re on - of comparable size and scale - where the mods and admins are more predictable. Really, there’s one simple rule here: Don’t be a jerk. If it were my board, there would have been a mass banning a while back, and I would have tossed everybody who personally attacked Jerry. There’s no excuse for that. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/114 "2008-09-10T20:41:02Z")
> [@Charlie\_Tan](#): > > I’m no fan of **Otto**. He comes across as whiney, **hating the fact that he’s gay** I have to correct this. I’ve never seen **Otto** bemoan his orientation. He’s always come across to me as being quite at peace with it, and with gay culture in general, as we’ve exchanged gay cultural references in more than one thread. On that one point, you’re mistaken. I have to give you abrasive…he wasn’t exactly Astroglide, not to belabor an analogy. But he was an entertaining poster and is, overall, a good guy. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/115 "2008-09-10T20:41:53Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > We aren’t the customers, the ad buyers are the customers. We are the public. That’s actually a really good point. We’re no longer the customers here any more than we’re the customers of NBC. In fact, it was mentioned at one point that they were only leaving the “Subscriber” option on the table, letting us avoid seeing ads, because they were afraid of the hue and cry if they didn’t. They would rather we NOT subscribe, because they’ll get more in ad revenue from the accumulation of our ad views than we’d pay in a year. So, odd as it sounds, I’m thinking of subscribing when mine runs out again. That’ll show 'em! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/116 "2008-09-10T20:42:13Z")
> [@THespos](#): > > 1. People who, out of sense of smug self-satisfaction, can’t wait for something to go wrong with the board so they can be the first to post a snarky, insulting thread on it and score favor with their own egos. You forgot number 3’s chubby, awkward sister, the person who can’t wait to see a thread where people are venting about something that is pretty clearly fucked up, so that they can go ahead and be contrary for the sake of being contrary. Pretending that this thread is full of a bunch of whiners and complainers when it is pretty clear that most people in this thread are not the resident whiners. Come on, there are posters in this thread that have posted less than 100 times in 5 years. But I notice that you state at the end of you post that you don’t say that you condone the banning. So, that’s cool. ---
**Author:** ![Uvula\_Donor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e19adc/32.png) [@Uvula\_Donor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uvula_Donor)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/117 "2008-09-10T20:42:47Z")
> [@THespos](#): > > If it were my board, there would have been a mass banning a while back, and I would have tossed everybody who personally attacked Jerry. There’s no excuse for that. Hey, maybe you and Zots can get together for a snuggle, suck each others’ dick, and chat up what fucking princes you both are. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/118 "2008-09-10T20:44:31Z")
> [@THespos](#): > > Really, there’s one simple rule here: Don’t be a jerk. If it were my board, there would have been a mass banning a while back, and I would have tossed everybody who personally attacked Jerry. There’s no excuse for that. Well, if the rule is “don’t be a jerk”, somebody broke the hell out of today, alls I’m sayin’. I agree that it’s tacky to attack Jerry personally. I think it’s silly to whine about board performance when they’re clearly not finished doing whatever they’re doing. But this shit? And the rudeness I’ve seen in the past from certain moderators? (Okay, a certain moderator.) ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/119 "2008-09-10T20:45:48Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > Did you notice who did the actual banning, **mika**? It was **Ed Zotti** himself. He’s the guy who _hires_ the moderators. Out of minor curiosity, how much of the day-to-day operation of the board has Ed (until recently) involved himself in? A moderator who’d dealt regularly with Otto and others might more easily be able to shrug off this fairly trivial “snark” (which I’m apparently not alone in thinking is the major draw of this place and the Straight Dope column itself). I don’t even like Otto, myself, but this looks rather like an absentee landlord who suddenly shows up and impulsively issues a decree without consulting any of the employees who’ve been managing the property for years without (too many) problems. That there is no “Otto has been banned” thread in ATMB explaining the decision makes it look all the more capricious and irregular, since posters with far shorter histories routinely get them. No offense, fluiddruid, but digging up a three year-old “final warning” looks like you’re trying to rationalize Ed’s decision, rather than support it. ---
**Author:** ![Telperien](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/65b543/32.png) [@Telperien](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telperien)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971/120 "2008-09-10T20:46:04Z")
This is definitely unexpected to me as well. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-otto-was-just-banned-by-ed/462971.md?page=7)