# WTF? Pay Up or We Let Your House Burn Down? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 6, 2010, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210 "2010-10-06T03:08:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 51
**Author:** ![Hal\_Briston](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9a28c/32.png) [@Hal\_Briston](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hal_Briston)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1001 "2011-12-07T17:56:41Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > …a resident can pay $110 per year for as many fires as might happen on their property… "Hello, 911? Yeah, I’m getting ready for bed and there’s a candle on the nightstand. Send a few of your firefighters over to blow it out for me. Yes…_again_! I’m paying for the service, so dammit, I’m gonna _use_ the service!" ---
**Author:** ![Sinaptics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Sinaptics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinaptics)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1002 "2011-12-07T18:04:01Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > It did. People didn’t pay the fee. Why not attach it as a lien if unpaid like other municipal fees? That way, they’ll get interest and late penalties as well. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1003 "2011-12-07T18:15:01Z")
You can’t get blood from a stone. Many if not all of these folks are probably uncollectable. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1004 "2011-12-07T18:22:48Z")
Oh, fer the luv of…“I didn’t think a fire would happen to us.” Jesus Christ, woman, how many people EXPECT a home-destroying fire? I mean, other than people burning down their homes or businesses for insurance money. I vote that the next time this happens in this county, the fired department actually shoves the people back into the burning home. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1005 "2011-12-07T18:23:59Z")
Why would you think that a person who couldn’t or wouldn’t pony up $75 for fire service, would suddenly come up with thousands of dollars for the service after the fact? Especially considering that after they put out a fire, many items are ruined. Water does that. And I can’t imagine you can knock down a portion of a mobile home and salvage it by rebuilding the damaged parts, like you can with some homes. Seems to me that once a tiny fraction of it is gone, you might as well consider it a total loss. ---
**Author:** ![StusBlues](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dc4da7/32.png) [@StusBlues](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StusBlues)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1006 "2011-12-07T19:01:54Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > You can’t get blood from a stone. Many if not all of these folks are probably uncollectable. Bingo. It’s kind of like “I won’t buy health insurance; I’ll just pay my doctor’s bill if I get sick or hurt.” When the catastrophic hits, the hospital has to eat it because they cannot withold livesaving treatment. This RFD has decided they aren’t going to take the chance of eating it. ---
**Author:** ![Sinaptics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Sinaptics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinaptics)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1007 "2011-12-07T19:05:44Z")
> [@StusBlues](#): > > Bingo. It’s kind of like “I won’t buy health insurance; I’ll just pay my doctor’s bill if I get sick or hurt.” When the catastrophic hits, the hospital has to eat it because they cannot withold livesaving treatment. This RFD has decided they aren’t going to take the chance of eating it. But if attached as a lien, aren’t they sure to get paid unless the property just never gets sold? And if that does happen in a small percentage of cases, isn’t that a worthwhile sacrifice to make to save what is probably the cumulative physical holdings of a families entire existence? ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1008 "2011-12-07T19:12:45Z")
I’m getting a headache seeing all these issues stated yet again. Look, I know it’s a long thread. But doesn’t that itself give you (all) a clue that your suggestions might, just might, have been covered before? Please read, or at least skim, the thread. If then there is anything to be said that hasn’t already been repeated endlessly, I promise I’ll be the first to leap in with applause. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1009 "2011-12-07T19:15:10Z")
> [@Sinaptics](#): > > And if that does happen in a small percentage of cases, isn’t that a worthwhile sacrifice to make to save what is probably the cumulative physical holdings of a families entire existence? I draw a different line than you. It is a worthwhile sacrifice to ensure that people are not in danger, which is why the fire department shows up. It is a worthwhile sacrifice to ensure the fire does not spread to other properties, insured or not (which could be seen as an extension of keeping people safe). It is not a worthwhile sacrifice to save the trailer which, as has been pointed out in earlier in this thread, is one of the more dangerous dwellings in which to fight a fire. ---
**Author:** ![Sinaptics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Sinaptics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinaptics)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1010 "2011-12-07T19:21:16Z")
> [@CannyDan](#): > > I’m getting a headache seeing all these issues stated yet again. Look, I know it’s a long thread. But doesn’t that itself give you (all) a clue that your suggestions might, just might, have been covered before? > > Please read, or at least skim, the thread. If then there is anything to be said that hasn’t already been repeated endlessly, I promise I’ll be the first to leap in with applause. I followed the thread at the for a while the first time around. You can’t honestly expect me to go back and read 20 pages of discussion, especially in a zombie thread. Not sure if you’re replying to me or not. But this is the first time lien was mentioned in this thread. So if you are referring to me, how about you save your snark for when it’s warranted. If you weren’t referring to me, mea culpa. ---
**Author:** ![Sinaptics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Sinaptics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinaptics)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1011 "2011-12-07T19:22:21Z")
> [@D\_Odds](#): > > I draw a different line than you. It is a worthwhile sacrifice to ensure that people are not in danger, which is why the fire department shows up. It is a worthwhile sacrifice to ensure the fire does not spread to other properties, insured or not (which could be seen as an extension of keeping people safe). It is not a worthwhile sacrifice to save the trailer which, as has been pointed out in earlier in this thread, is one of the more dangerous dwellings in which to fight a fire. I’ll agree that a trailer probably isn’t worth saving, but the discussion is more about the practice of letting residential properties burn, and not specifically trailers. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1012 "2011-12-07T19:25:12Z")
> [@Sinaptics](#): > > And if that does happen in a small percentage of cases, isn’t that a worthwhile sacrifice to make to save what is probably the cumulative physical holdings of a families entire existence? Are your family’s belongings worth spending $75 for fire coverage? If you don’t think so, why would you expect strangers in another town to? ---
**Author:** ![Giraffe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giraffe/32/129_2.png) [@Giraffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giraffe)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1013 "2011-12-07T19:25:13Z")
> [@CannyDan](#): > > I’m getting a headache seeing all these issues stated yet again. Look, I know it’s a long thread. But doesn’t that itself give you (all) a clue that your suggestions might, just might, have been covered before? > > Please read, or at least skim, the thread. If then there is anything to be said that hasn’t already been repeated endlessly, I promise I’ll be the first to leap in with applause. Even if they don’t feel like reading the whole thread, they could just start on page ten. Not only is that where **Shot From Guns** and I started mocking **gonzomax** for the next several pages (which was super fun, I had totally forgotten about that), but your previous [public service message to the dumbasses-come-lately](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=13034999&postcount=500) about reading the damn thread before posting included a handy summary: > [@CannyDan](#): > > All right, ten pages in, five hundred posts, a quick synopsis for all those too fucking lazy to read the fucking thread: > > Party of the first part Cranick knows all about the Subscription Service by which a neighboring City offers pre-paid fire protection in certain unincorporated areas of his County. He knows all about it because he has had a previous fire at his home, for which he did not have the aforesaid subscription fire service. The fire brigade, upon his entreaty, put the fire out and told him to pay his subscription on time in the future. That was three years ago. > > Since then several other fires have occurred in his neighborhood. It was all the talk among the neighbors, and covered by all the local media. (As if they had anything else to do.) People without the Subscription did not receive fire suppression. > > The City sends annual invoices to people in the Subscription Area by US Mail, and follows those up with telephone calls. People who want to opt in make their payment. Those who do not pay have refused the offer of an optional contract. They are not entitled to the benefits those who accept the contract will receive. > > There is no provision for providing people with a service they have refused, and then billing them (or otherwise collecting from them) after they find a sudden need for the service. Just as Comcast can’t hook you up to cable, including expensive porn, over your objection or while you’re out of town and then collect from you for services you never ordered. Not even if you later experience an “emergency need” for porn. > > The only way Cranick could have been unaware of the system in place, or the routine payment requests, would be if he was deaf, blind, and confined to some small and windowless box inside his shitty double-wide. You know, like the place he kept his dogs and cats. > > In fact he himself acknowledged that he knew, saying that he thought the fire brigade would come and help his sorry, craven, selfish, manipulative, worthless, goddamn kitten killing puppy raping ass _anyway_. And being a sorry, craven, selfish, manipulative, worthless, animal abusing bastard, he had second thoughts about that admission, and so later told Olberman that he “forgot”. > > Now, how about all you johnny-come-lately assholes actually read the fucking thread before offering your stupid comments, kaythnxbye. I think when you tell people to read the goddamn thread on page 30, you should try to work in quote from both your page 10 and page 20 messages. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Sinaptics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Sinaptics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinaptics)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1014 "2011-12-07T19:32:12Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Are your family’s belongings worth spending $75 for fire coverage? If you don’t think so, why would you expect strangers in another town to? You’re right. They were asses for not paying the fee. I simply think that a sufficiently punitive solution could be found that doesn’t involve the firefighters watching someone’s house burn down while they stand by with the means to help. ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1015 "2011-12-07T19:32:17Z")
> [@Sinaptics](#): > > I followed the thread at the for a while the first time around. You can’t honestly expect me to go back and read 20 pages of discussion, especially in a zombie thread. > > Not sure if you’re replying to me or not. But this is the first time lien was mentioned in this thread. So if you are referring to me, how about you save your snark for when it’s warranted. If you weren’t referring to me, mea culpa. I wasn’t referring to you specifically, and no offense was intended to you or to anyone. That’s why I said “(all)” in my post. I know it’s a bear of a thread, but I read every single post along the way. To the best of my recollection, liens were offered before. So was the problematic issue of the, shall we say, eventual nature of the collectability of a lien. As was the issue of avoiding enforcement of a lien by making the property a gift to a relative or heir, thus postponing collection even further. ETA on preview – thanks, **Giraffe**! I should do that. ---
**Author:** ![Giraffe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giraffe/32/129_2.png) [@Giraffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giraffe)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1016 "2011-12-07T19:51:07Z")
> [@Sinaptics](#): > > You’re right. They were asses for not paying the fee. I simply think that a sufficiently punitive solution could be found that doesn’t involve the firefighters watching someone’s house burn down while they stand by with the means to help. Incorrect. Children who refuse to pay taxes or fees to support a social safety net should not benefit from said safety net in any way. It is a wonderful thing when their house burns down. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1017 "2011-12-07T20:14:23Z")
> [@Giraffe](#): > > Incorrect. Children who refuse to pay taxes or fees to support a social safety net should not benefit from said safety net in any way. It is a wonderful thing when their house burns down. It came up in the GD thread that they were [not allowed](http://www.kfvs12.com/story/16201834/home-burns-while-firefighters-watch) to pay. > [@](#): > > Homeowners in rural parts of Obion County have the choice of paying a $75 fire protection fee, but this homeowner in particular didn’t pay the fee because she’s not even eligible for it. ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1018 "2011-12-07T20:15:17Z")
> [@Sinaptics](#): > > You’re right. They were asses for not paying the fee. I simply think that a sufficiently punitive solution could be found that doesn’t involve the firefighters watching someone’s house burn down while they stand by with the means to help. I could say that when the same house caught fire three years previously and was extinguished for free, apparently no lesson was learned at all; and this time a sufficiently punitive solution to that intransigence was found – the house burned down. But that would imply I believe this situation to be an opportunity for an educational moment. I do not. As I said before, this wasn’t a lesson. It was a consequence. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1019 "2011-12-07T20:19:06Z")
> [@CannyDan](#): > > I could say that when the same house caught fire three years previously and was extinguished for free, apparently no lesson was learned at all; and this time a sufficiently punitive solution to that intransigence was found – the house burned down. Again, that was a different guy, that Cranick fellow. This latest incident is someone else. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2011, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210/1020 "2011-12-07T20:28:36Z")
> [@CannyDan](#): > > I’m getting a headache seeing all these issues stated yet again. Look, I know it’s a long thread. But doesn’t that itself give you (all) a clue that your suggestions might, just might, have been covered before? I’m in total agreement. I’m just surprised no one mentioned that if they had just paid the $75 then their house would not have burned down or that since the FD was already there why not just put the fire out anyways? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210.md?page=50) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-pay-up-or-we-let-your-house-burn-down/556210.md?page=52)