# WTF: Woman Says Anti-Abortion Nurse Removed IUD Without Permission, Then Lectured Her **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 19, 2009, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925 "2009-01-19T02:20:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Shirley\_Ujest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shirley\_Ujest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shirley_Ujest)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2009, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/41 "2009-01-19T18:13:15Z")
I would be interested in watching this case on court tv. It isn’t as ‘glamorous’ as a nice quadruple murder case, but it has promise to be a very good watercooler convo for a good long while. I look forward to the updates, discussions and arguments on this case. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Fight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/90ced4/32.png) [@Cat\_Fight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Fight)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2009, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/42 "2009-01-19T19:06:10Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > And, unfortunately, I think she can no longer be disciplined for refusing to replace the IUD. IIRC, one of those last minute things President Scumbush pushed through was some new rule about allowing everyone in the medical industry to refuse to participate in procedures thay have moral objections to. I’m wondering about this, too – whether OBGYNS can ‘accidentally’ remove IUDs from new patients, then be legally excused from replacing them (or recommending someone else who can). ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2009, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/43 "2009-01-19T19:44:30Z")
> [@susan](#): > > **QtM,** it looks like she’s a PA, not an NP (see above). The legal complaint (see post #21) says she is a nurse practitioner. Hope that doesn’t screw up the lawsuit. Also, the activity took place two years ago, but the online complaint copy isn’t dated. It could have been filed within the last few days to beat a statute of limitations. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2009, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/44 "2009-01-19T20:10:26Z")
I asked a member of a licensing board here, who said that it’s pretty common for suits and complaints to mis-designate a degree or license, and didn’t think it would matter as long as the defendant had not misrepresented her own credentials. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2009, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/45 "2009-01-19T20:34:12Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > Sometimes the damn things do pop out with just a very, very light tug on the string. > > Not very often, though. > > And when they do, it generally means they were going to pop out during the next menses anyway. > > I’d not entrust one of my Nurse Practitioners to checking them if she was known tohave a lot of them pop out on her. Some questions: How much pain is involved if the damn thing DOES pop out with a very light tug? Is it customary to give a little tug after trimming the string? Is it customary for NPs/PAs to do such trimming? Would you keep a PA/NP who kept having such problems? I saw a PA for some years, and was quite happy to have him as my primary care provider, but part of the reason I liked him was that he knew exactly what his limits were. He was just dandy at lasering off warts, and lancing and draining boils. He was able to figure out which antibiotic was best for me. He was great at performing a pelvic, both in his manner and in his technical skills. He talked me into going on insulin when oral antidiabetics weren’t enough. And when I had a bloody discharge from my nipple, he took a sample…and told me that I’d probably need to see a specialist, as he wasn’t certified to handle that sort of problem. I think that NPs/PAs can be great assets to a clinic, as a general rule. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2009, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/46 "2009-01-19T21:40:24Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > Some questions: > How much pain is involved if the damn thing DOES pop out with a very light tug? Is it customary to give a little tug after trimming the string? Anywhere from none at all to a lot. I never tugged the string after trimming. > [@](#): > > Is it customary for NPs/PAs to do such trimming? If they’re trained in it, sure. > [@](#): > > Would you keep a PA/NP who kept having such problems? It would depend on the big picture. Not if they were moralizing to the patients. But if IUDs just kept popping out around them, I might just change their duties to not include IUDS. I’ve had PAs & NPs I trusted a _lot_ more than some physicians I know. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2009, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/47 "2009-01-19T22:17:36Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > Anywhere from none at all to a lot. I never tugged the string after trimming. > > If they’re trained in it, sure. > > It would depend on the big picture. Not if they were moralizing to the patients. But if IUDs just kept popping out around them, I might just change their duties to not include IUDS. > > I’ve had PAs & NPs I trusted a _lot_ more than some physicians I know. Out of curiosity, where are you doing these trimmings? I always thought your clientele consisted of men only… And if not, why do your female clients need birth control? Do they have conjugal visits? ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2009, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/48 "2009-01-19T22:32:18Z")
> [@L. G. Butts](#): > > Out of curiosity, where are you doing these trimmings? I always thought your clientele consisted of men only… And if not, why do your female clients need birth control? Do they have conjugal visits? I’ve only been in corrections for less than 7 years. I did 18 years of family medical practice before that, including a lot of routine obstetrics and gynecology, along with a stint working at Planned Parenthood. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2009, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/49 "2009-01-20T02:11:26Z")
> [@susan](#): > > I asked a member of a licensing board here, who said that it’s pretty common for suits and complaints to mis-designate a degree or license, and didn’t think it would matter as long as the defendant had not misrepresented her own credentials. Wow, that’s crazy. Don’t they know how important it is to get these facts straight so random people on the internet can look up their work history? ---
**Author:** ![lel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8797f3/32.png) [@lel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lel)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2009, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/50 "2009-01-20T02:35:13Z")
It’s easy enough to figure out that if you get into women’s health, it’s quite likely you’ll be dispensing birth control. There are a number of medical specialties that would not involve dispensing birth control, right? ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2009, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/51 "2009-01-20T02:42:06Z")
> [@lel](#): > > It’s easy enough to figure out that if you get into women’s health, it’s quite likely you’ll be dispensing birth control. There are a number of medical specialties that would not involve dispensing birth control, right? Proctology would be one. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2009, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/52 "2009-01-20T03:28:06Z")
I really don’t know what to say–there are so many levels of wrong here (on the part of the accused–if she has done all that she is accused of). IMO, health care works best when the agenda is the care of the patient. Seems obvious and almost silly, but there it is… ---
**Author:** ![Cyberhwk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7993a0/32.png) [@Cyberhwk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyberhwk)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2009, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/53 "2009-01-20T06:30:06Z")
> [@](#): > > 'Everyone in the office always laughs and tells me I pull these out on purpose because I am against them, Oh yeah. Fucking HILARIOUS. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/54 "2009-01-21T03:23:29Z")
> [@Cyberhwk](#): > > Oh yeah. Fucking HILARIOUS. :rolleyes: Again, the only evidence of this statement is the plaintiff’s complaint. We don’t have the nurse on video saying it, or submitting it via a response to filings. We only have the plaintiff’s CLAIM that she said this. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/55 "2009-01-21T07:01:37Z")
I would be interested in finding another source for the claims, too. So far, there’s ONE version of the events that I can find. I do find a lot of blogs and MBs that comment on that one story, but I do want to hear the other side. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/56 "2009-01-21T07:10:12Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > I would be interested in finding another source for the claims, too. So far, there’s ONE version of the events that I can find. I do find a lot of blogs and MBs that comment on that one story, but I do want to hear the other side. When it comes to court, I imagine the clinic’s records would reflect whether there were an inordinate number of incidences like the plaintiff’s. Would the plaintiff’s attorney be able to access those records? Would he be able to get the names of other patients who had the same experience with this nurse, and subpeona them? ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/57 "2009-01-21T15:22:56Z")
If it is accurate that she’s been joking with staff about this, it would not be necessary to breach patients’ privacy. If it needed to be shown that she had a higher-than-average number of these events, records could be examined without subpoenaing the patients. ---
**Author:** ![NurseCarmen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5daacb/32.png) [@NurseCarmen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NurseCarmen)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/58 "2009-01-21T15:45:55Z")
Damn. I wish a were a woman with an IUD, a mini tape recorder, and a damn good lawyer. ---
**Author:** ![AngryIrishLass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bbce88/32.png) [@AngryIrishLass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AngryIrishLass)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/59 "2009-01-21T16:40:10Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Note: pdf file. [Here is the actual complaint](http://www.courthousenews.com/2009/01/14/IUD.pdf). > > Interesting that this was alleged to take place almost exactly 2 years ago. So she certainly could be sanctioned for refusing to replace the IUD. FWIW, this is a draft of the Complaint prior to filing. If it were a copy of the actual filed Complaint there would be the filing information across the top, including the assignment of a document number. Unless you are _pro se_, all federal court filings in NM must be done online as PDF documents. I can’t pull up the docket without the cause number as it does not allow name searches. I’m curious why there isn’t a medical malpractice claim and instead a straight constitutional claim, battery, and negligent retention. I wonder if filing it as such was a way to get around NM’s required use of the the medical legal panel and/or malpractice caps. According to the [2008 list of PAs](http://www.nmmb.state.nm.us/pdffiles/2008Roster.pdf) Ms. Olono’s working at the state pen. (pg. 166) and her license is still [active](http://www.docboard.org/nm/) just search her last name. ---
**Author:** ![Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bc8723/32.png) [@Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fish)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925/60 "2009-01-21T16:52:37Z")
> [@Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](#): > > Deprive her of her job on the say-so of someone off the street? It seems to work when the anti-abortion people pull a sting on Planned Parenthood. It works like this: Lie, bullshit, make up some impossible story, and see how the nurse reacts. Spread around the carefully edited video. Nurse fired because, get this, _had_ the story not been bullshit, the nurse _would_ have broken the law. I see little difference. I completely agree that we as a society are too quick to say “he should lose his job!” whenever anybody makes any error at all. But how many of us post from work? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wtf-woman-says-anti-abortion-nurse-removed-iud-without-permission-then-lectured-her/481925.md?page=4)