# WWII planes that have no surviving examples **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 3, 2013, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737 "2013-04-03T15:46:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/21 "2013-04-04T00:43:35Z")
Interesting question, I did some digging around on a few planes I considered likely candidates and was somewhat surprised how many of them have surviving examples. It seems there are no [He-112s](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinkel_He_112) left, and I haven’t been able to find any references to surviving examples of [Ki-49s](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakajima_Ki-49) or [Ki-67s](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitsubishi_Ki-67). ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/22 "2013-04-04T00:44:17Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > How successful was the komet as an interceptor? It shot down a number of bombers, but it was so fast that it was very difficult for the pilot to fire at his target long enough to do serious damage. IIRC they ended up with a really unusual weapon – a photosensor triggered upward automatically fired rockets when the Komet passed a bomber and into its shadow. Besides being highly explosive at all times (even when the fuel ran out there were still enough vapors on the tanks to blow it apart), there was yet another serious vulnerability. It only had about 5 minutes or so worth of fuel, enough to climb to altitude and make a couple of firing passes. Then its engine cut out and it ended its flight as a glider, coasting down at maybe 150 mph and an absolute sitting duck for nearby Allied fighters. Finally, it had no landing gear. It touched down on a skid with a spring to absorb the shock. Apparently it was not uncommon for the skid to fail to deploy, and landing without it meant a very good chance of a broken back for the pilot. I don’t know how you might judge “effective”, but I would guess it killed far more German pilots than it did Allied bomber crew, even though each bomber had 10 crewmen. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/23 "2013-04-04T03:59:38Z")
> [@Battle\_Pope](#): > > I can’t find any reference to [P-43 Lancer](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_P-43_Lancer) surviors. ☹ I have a magazine somewhere with a shot of the last one before it was scrapped in the late 40s, but there’s talk of one in Australia. ---
**Author:** ![David\_H\_Singanas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ac8455/32.png) [@David\_H\_Singanas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_H_Singanas)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/24 "2013-04-04T05:39:11Z")
There was a post in USENET about a Lancaster bomber parked in a hanger in New Zealand. The post stated the bomber was in mint condition. AFAIK , USENET was purchased by Google Groups and consequently dismantled. ---
**Author:** ![Isilder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@Isilder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isilder)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/25 "2013-04-04T06:54:33Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > , but there’s talk of one in Australia. A p43 in Australia ? I don’t think someone was keeping it thinking it was a Wirraway or something else… No it would be known. If they found something its just a bunch of parts they want to sell quietely, so that they don’t get “must remain in Australia” status.. just in case they happen to tie up with a few other parts to make a somewhat complete p43 ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/26 "2013-04-04T08:01:18Z")
> [@Battle\_Pope](#): > > I can’t find any reference to [P-43 Lancer](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_P-43_Lancer) surviors. ☹ I’d never heard of the Republic P-43 before. Looking at the picture in that Wkipedia link, it clearly shows early hints of Republic’s P-47 Thunderbolt. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/27 "2013-04-04T08:05:02Z")
I was wondering if there are any surviving Junkers Ju-87 Stuka divebombers. [Wikipedia’s page says there are two: one in Chicago and one in London](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Ju_87#Survivors) (of all places!). Wouldn’t it be very cool to see (and hear) one flying? ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 8:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/28 "2013-04-04T08:18:09Z")
> [@Pushkin](#): > > I thought of it too for that reason, not really like much else the RAF flew at the time. > > Surprising to see what did survive the war, like the [ME Komet](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messerschmitt_Me_163), which I thought was surely flammable and unflyable enough to exist only in photos. They had one of those at RAF Colerne in the 1970s, I saw it there. Very strange plane, like an oversized Easter Egg with stubby wings and a smallish fin. That collection was long since broken up (as in, the planes were sent elsewhere), I can’t remember whether Duxford has a Komet now. I do have a real soft spot for the Whirlwind - slightly quirky looks, amazing performance and firepower for a 1930s design. Sadly, only 100-odd were ever made. More power to [whirlwindfighterproject.org](http://whirlwindfighterproject.org) - a faithful reproduction would be a lot better than nothing. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![cckerberos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@cckerberos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cckerberos)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/29 "2013-04-04T10:44:51Z")
There are no intact Mitsubishi G4M (“Betty”) or Nakajima B5N (“Kate”). ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/30 "2013-04-04T16:50:27Z")
No Polish [PZL.37 Łoś](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PZL.37_%C5%81o%C5%9B) or, as far as I can tell [PZL.23 Karaś](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PZL.23_Kara%C5%9B). The Italian [Reggiane Re.2005 Sagittario](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reggiane_Re.2005) also appears not to have any survivors and a few of the other Italian fighters may be lost as well ( though it is hard to find on a quick search ). At least a few [Veltros](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macchi_C.205) survive though, which is pretty cool. No [MiG-1](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikoyan-Gurevich_MiG-1) appears to have made it, but it was a limited production run. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/31 "2013-04-04T17:30:19Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > It shot down a number of bombers, but it was so fast that it was very difficult for the pilot to fire at his target long enough to do serious damage. IIRC they ended up with a really unusual weapon – a photosensor triggered upward automatically fired rockets when the Komet passed a bomber and into its shadow. > > Besides being highly explosive at all times (even when the fuel ran out there were still enough vapors on the tanks to blow it apart), there was yet another serious vulnerability. It only had about 5 minutes or so worth of fuel, enough to climb to altitude and make a couple of firing passes. Then its engine cut out and it ended its flight as a glider, coasting down at maybe 150 mph and an absolute sitting duck for nearby Allied fighters. > > Finally, it had no landing gear. It touched down on a skid with a spring to absorb the shock. Apparently it was not uncommon for the skid to fail to deploy, and landing without it meant a very good chance of a broken back for the pilot. > > I don’t know how you might judge “effective”, but I would guess it killed far more German pilots than it did Allied bomber crew, even though each bomber had 10 crewmen. There is a surviving Komet in the USAA 8th Airforce Museum, in South Carolina. I saw a film of one taking off-the plane blew up about 30 seconds after takeoff. Musta have been hard to generate enthusiasm among the pilots. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/32 "2013-04-04T17:43:21Z")
> [@cckerberos](#): > > There are no intact Mitsubishi G4M (“Betty”) or Nakajima B5N (“Kate”). The wiki page on the Betty is confusing - it says there are no Betty’s left in flying condition or ‘intact’ - but it also says a wrecked one is complete and on display at the Planes of Fame Museum. The picture at the museum’s site (in a diorama as a wrecked aircraft) [is tiny and only shows a part of the plane (search for ‘Mitsubishi’ on the linked page)](http://planesoffame.org/index.php?page=static-flying). I wonder if it is “complete” as the wiki page claims. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/33 "2013-04-04T17:49:38Z")
It says “unrestored” and the thumbnail looks like it was hauled out a lagoon somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Poysyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Poysyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Poysyn)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/34 "2013-04-04T18:15:55Z")
Shameless hijack and brag - I got to board one of the only surviving (still flying) Lancaster Bombers (The Mynarski one) a few years ago. It was VERY cool 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![GargoyleWB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gargoylewb/32/199_2.png) [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/35 "2013-04-04T18:55:23Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > The Italian [Reggiane Re.2005 Sagittario](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reggiane_Re.2005) also appears not to have any survivors and a few of the other Italian fighters may be lost as well ( though it is hard to find on a quick search ). At least a few [Veltros](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macchi_C.205) survive though, which is pretty cool. I saw one of these in the industry museum in Milan. It is a breathtakingly gorgeous plane in person. The museum as a whole is also excellent. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/36 "2013-04-04T20:29:53Z")
Does this [count](http://www.daveswarbirds.com/usplanes/photos/flapjack2.jpg) ? The flying pancake. (Never made production.) Edit bb code. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/37 "2013-04-04T20:35:38Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Does this [count](http://www.daveswarbirds.com/usplanes/photos/flapjack2.jpg) ? > The flying pancake. (Never made production.) > > Edit bb code. Nice thought – I saw a _Wings_ episode about that plane. But no, it doesn’t count because it never saw combat. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/38 "2013-04-04T20:37:17Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > A handful of DC-2’s got drafted into the US military, but none are left, of any pedigree. The sole DC-1 didn’t last even that long. [Eight](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_DC-2) DC-2s, 4% of the 200 built, still survive. This actually is an exceptional survival rate for a 1930s aircraft of any kind - whether or not they served in WW2. This is because wartime advances in technology obsoleted basically all existing aircraft bigger than Piper Cubs. (The sole exception was the DC-2’s bigger, stronger brother the DC-3.) One DC-2, a former US Navy R2D that is now the KLM _Uiver,_ still flies, another was flown in 2007, and another has been in restoration to airworthiness of years. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/39 "2013-04-04T20:42:55Z")
_For_ years, that is… ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2013, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737/40 "2013-04-04T23:30:49Z")
> [@GargoyleWB](#): > > I saw one of these in the industry museum in Milan. It is a breathtakingly gorgeous plane in person. The museum as a whole is also excellent. Looks like at least [one](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f6/FIAT_G-55_Centauro_%281%29.jpg) [Fiat G-55 Centauro](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_G.55) has survived as well. The Italians may not have been world-beaters in WW II, but they certainly made good-looking fighter planes. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-planes-that-have-no-surviving-examples/654737.md?page=3)