# WWII soldiers on remote isles not knowing war was over **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 15, 2003, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193 "2003-12-15T21:19:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2003, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/1 "2003-12-15T21:19:57Z")
Did any Japanese or American combatants, after World War II, remain unaware of the war’s end for any appreciable length of time? The only way I can imagine it happening would be if the troops or units involved somehow lost all radio contact. Even then, in normal circumstances, I assume that someone would realize that the missing troops were missing, and they would eventually be found, though here too there could be problems. If the missing man has to leave his last known position for whatever reason, then he’d be hard to find. And then, people do make mistakes and papers get lost or misfiled. It seems that if you had a perfect coincidence of unlikely events, then a “lost” soldier or platoon could remain “lost”. So what’s the straight dope? Are there any documented stories of this happening? ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2003, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/2 "2003-12-15T21:45:48Z")
There are a good number of documented cases of [Japanese holdouts and stragglers](http://www.wanpela.com/holdouts/index.html), including [Sgt. Shoichi Yokoi](http://ns.gov.gu/scrollapplet/sergeant.html), discovered Jan 24, 1972 on Guam and [Lt. Hiroo Onoda](http://www.wfu.edu/users/bernjd1/asia-pacific/index.html), who finally surrendered on March 9, 1974 after being discovered in the Philippines. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Batman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/22d042/32.png) [@The\_Batman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Batman)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2003, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/3 "2003-12-15T22:21:41Z")
Damn slow message boards!I was about to post my reply and link when they froze up and now Terminus beat me to Lt. Hiroo Onoda! ---
**Author:** ![The\_Batman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/22d042/32.png) [@The\_Batman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Batman)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2003, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/4 "2003-12-15T22:22:54Z")
Oh well, [http://history1900s.about.com/library/weekly/aa120700a.htm](http://history1900s.about.com/library/weekly/aa120700a.htm) ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2003, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/5 "2003-12-16T00:46:16Z")
In both cases, they knew the war was over, but were afraid to surrender because they thought they’d be tortured or killed. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2003, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/6 "2003-12-16T01:11:41Z")
This [chronology of holdouts](http://www.wanpela.com/holdouts/list.html), part of the site given by **Terminus Est** , shows that as late as 1948, entire units of Japanese soldiers had not yet surrendered. ---
**Author:** ![Ringo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/779978/32.png) [@Ringo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ringo)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2003, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/7 "2003-12-16T01:43:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RealityChuck \* > \*\*In both cases, they knew the war was over, but were afraid to surrender because they thought they’d be tortured or killed. \*\* I don’t have a cite, as this is something remembered from reading a memoir of either Yokoi or Onada many years ago. He said that in 1957 he had seen two younger men he took by appearance to be Japanese enter a bar. He followed them in and approached them. They spoke Japanese, and in response to his inquiry about the progress of the war, told him the front was at the Mississippi Line. Take with two grains of salt; don’t call me in the morning. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2003, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/8 "2003-12-16T05:43:35Z")
— In both cases, they knew the war was over, but were afraid to surrender because they thought they’d be tortured or killed. That unsubstantiated characterization is at odds with my reading of the following Onoda link originally posted by **Terminus Est** : [http://www.wfu.edu/users/bernjd1/asia-pacific/index.html](http://www.wfu.edu/users/bernjd1/asia-pacific/index.html) The link indicates that Onoda took his final orders to heart and refused to surrender pending updated orders from a superior. Onoda was also somewhat deluded during the 1960s, according to the website. ---
**Author:** ![David\_Simmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9de053/32.png) [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2003, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/9 "2003-12-16T06:46:27Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Spectre of Pithecanthropus \* > \*\* > Even then, in normal circumstances, I assume that someone would realize that the missing troops were missing, and they would eventually be found, though here too there could be problems_\* Your faith in military record keeping is touching. Army headquarters in the US had no idea where I was for about 3 months in late 1944-early 1945. And we were winning, not fighting a losing war on remote islands in the middle of nowhere. If the guys were missing they would be listed as just that - missing. ---
**Author:** ![Billdo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/billdo/32/315_2.png) [@Billdo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Billdo)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2003, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/10 "2003-12-16T12:31:51Z")
Here’s Cecil’s [take on the matter](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/000310.html). Does anyone know if there were any reports American holdouts? ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2003, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/11 "2003-12-16T12:37:20Z")
**David** , do you mind saying where you were? ---
**Author:** ![jsleek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/8dc957/32.png) [@jsleek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsleek)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2003, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/12 "2003-12-16T14:41:12Z")
According to those cites, these guy conducted raids for years. That means they killed a bunch of people for no reason at all. ---
**Author:** ![David\_Simmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9de053/32.png) [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2003, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/13 "2003-12-16T14:59:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Zoe \* > \*\ ***David** , do you mind saying where you were? \*\* See [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=229606) ---
**Author:** ![Meurglys](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/258eb7/32.png) [@Meurglys](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meurglys)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2003, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/14 "2003-12-16T15:10:16Z")
Apparently the Japanese government are still looking! This is from about a month ago: [http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/11/19/1069027193372.html](http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/11/19/1069027193372.html) And I read an article recently (sorry, can’t remember where) about some Estonian (I think - certainly one of the Baltic States) soldiers retreating to hideouts in the forests when the Soviet forces attacked in WW2, some of whom stayed hidden for years - into the 1950s. The article interviewed one or two of the survivors about how they managed to avoid the searching troops and got food, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Doomtrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Doomtrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doomtrain)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2003, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wwii-soldiers-on-remote-isles-not-knowing-war-was-over/219193/15 "2003-12-16T16:55:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jsleek \* > \*\*According to those cites, these guy conducted raids for years. That means they killed a bunch of people for no reason at all. \*\* If a History Channel documentary I watched on the Japanese ones can be trusted, you’re correct. He even said–the soldier–that every now and then, they’d raid the village and burn some buildings down to keep the populace terrified.