# xtisme, come on down, you muppet! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 7, 2010, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300 "2010-06-07T17:06:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/61 "2010-06-07T19:43:43Z")
[QUOTE=ivan astikov] Throwing around insults and boasts about how foolish you are going to make me look isn’t the ideal method of convincing me of anything, but I might be able to coax a worthwhile cite out of you. [/QUOTE] I don’t need a cite to demonstrate that you look foolish…you are doing all the work for me. As for convincing you, I’d be better able to convince a slug that it’s a puma than convince you of anything. Again, since I realize it takes time and repeated hammering to get through to you, if you wanted a serious discussion of this you wouldn’t have put this thread in the Pit, but instead put it in GD. Putting it in the Pit invites insults and derision (both of which you have amply demonstrated you deserve), not debate. -XT ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/62 "2010-06-07T19:51:39Z")
No, putting it in the Pit means I can respond to you with the same contempt you are giving me, or my opinions. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/63 "2010-06-07T19:57:12Z")
How’s that working out for you so far? -XT ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/64 "2010-06-07T20:14:21Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > How’s that working out for you so far? > > -XT Cut the guy some slack. He may seem a touch off, but we have to give **Ivan** a bit of leeway due to his PTSD. You would have post traumatic stress too if you were anally probed by alien werewolves. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/65 "2010-06-07T20:14:48Z")
Better than your sad attempts at making me look foolish. I’m sure you think you are being very successful with your witty repartee, and cutting comments, but I doubt you are impressing many others. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/66 "2010-06-07T20:16:57Z")
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#): > > Cut the guy some slack. He may seem a touch off, but we have to give **Ivan** a bit of leeway due to his PTSD. You would have post traumatic stress too if you were anally probed by alien werewolves. I was NOT anally-probed by werewolves or anything else… well, at least not willingly! ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/67 "2010-06-07T20:21:28Z")
[QUOTE=A Monkey With a Gun] Cut the guy some slack. He may seem a touch off, but we have to give Ivan a bit of leeway due to his PTSD. You would have post traumatic stress too if you were anally probed by alien werewolves. [/QUOTE] He might actually like that, however… [QUOTE=ivan astikov] Better than your sad attempts at making me look foolish. I’m sure you think you are being very successful with your witty repartee, and cutting comments, but I doubt you are impressing many others. [/QUOTE] My attempts may have been sad, but as I’ve said you are doing the majority of the work…and a better job of making someone look like an idiot I’ve rarely seen! Bravo sir, BRAVO! -XT ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/68 "2010-06-07T20:25:34Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > I was NOT anally-probed by werewolves or anything else… well, at least not willingly! I understand why you would want to repress those memories, but it’s not that healthy. Luckily, I’m a psychologist that specializes in recovered memories. I want you to hold the doll. Are you relaxed? Good. Now, show me where the alien werewolf touched you. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/69 "2010-06-07T20:26:33Z")
Typing it doesn’t make it so, but you are welcome to carry on banging away like some retarded child on your keyboard. At least it keeps you from annoying people IRL. ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/70 "2010-06-07T20:33:58Z")
Trust me. I can do both. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/71 "2010-06-07T20:34:37Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > But you are doing such a wonderful job yourself that my own participation is hardly necessary! > > On that we are strangely in agreement…this should be a lot of fun to watch, anyway! 😛 > > -XT In this case I agree 100% with **xtisme** \*\*ivan \*\* is following the author’s very shallow ideas: [http://www.users.waitrose.com/~magonia/ms40.htm](http://www.users.waitrose.com/~magonia/ms40.htm) > [@](#): > > Where important UFO reports are concerned, Dolan repeatedly rubbishes official explanations. Of course some of these explantions were obviously wrong, but there were some cases which were properly investigated and solved. For example, the radar/visual incident of August 1953 at Rapid City, South Dakota, was investigated by Hynek, who gave a perfectly logical, if not very simple, explanation. Dolan, however, prefers Ruppelt’s failure to explain it and gives no details of Hynek’s analysis. > > ``` > This sort of thing is one of the main failings of the book.The author apparently has no knowledge of, or interest in, scientific and technical matters. He thus evaluates reports on the basis of choosing those he wants to believe as the best ones. He also shows no interest in the sociological and psychological factors which generate many (but not all) UFO reports, and the distortions of perception which can occur when witnesses do not know what they are looking at. He doesn't even mention the psychosocial hypothesis, and gives his readers only two choices as to what UFOs might be--secret military aircraft or extraterrestrial spacecraft. He rejects the first alternative leaving only the second, all other possibilities apparently not being worth discussing. > > Like most ETH supporters, Dolan believes that the US government (and presumably all other governments) are keeping the Truth about UFOs secret. "When UFO skeptics claim that hiding something as significant as alien visitation is impossible, they should study some of the secrets that were kept for many, many years." What he doesn't tell us is that these secrets were about things over which government agencies had control, such as the Manhattan Project which he gives as an example. Whatever UFOs might be, it is generally agreed that the US government, and other governments, have no control over them. They can appear anywhere at any time. How, then, can they be kept secret? This is a question always dodged by the believers. > > This book is yet another example of American ufology stuck firmly in the 1950s, along with the shades of people like Donald Keyhoe and Frank Edwards. > > ``` > > John Harney ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/72 "2010-06-07T20:35:32Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > but I doubt you are impressing many others. I don’t know about many others but he’s won me over. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/73 "2010-06-07T20:43:03Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > In this case I agree 100% with **xtisme** > > \*\*ivan \*\* is following the author’s very shallow ideas: > > [http://www.users.waitrose.com/~magonia/ms40.htm](http://www.users.waitrose.com/~magonia/ms40.htm) There’s a lot of more favourable reviews on the Amazon page dealing with this book. Why would you attach more weight to this opinion, than one of the ones in its favour? ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/74 "2010-06-07T20:44:05Z")
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#): > > Trust me. I can do both. I was addressing **xtisme** , but I still believe you. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/75 "2010-06-07T20:46:05Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > There’s a lot of more favourable reviews on the Amazon page dealing with this book. Why would you attach more weight to this opinion, than one of the ones in its favour? Proponents of woo are always more preponderant in Amazon reviews, what you need is deal with the criticisms, Just by the few bits I have read, it is clear that Dolan often makes his connections with innuendo, but no real proof. And Dolan really is going beyond the rabbit hole and into Mad Hatter territory: > **[Richard Dolan's Tinfoil Hat A General Systems Theory of Conspiracy | PDF |...](https://www.scribd.com/doc/25559072/Richard-Dolan-s-Tinfoil-Hat-a-general-systems-theory-of-conspiracy)** > > This document provides a critical review of Richard Dolan's second volume of "UFOs and the National Security State" which covers UFO events from 1973-1991. The reviewer notes that while Dolan cites sources and uses footnotes, some of the UFO cases he... > [@](#): > > All the three-letter agencies are involved: The NSA, The DIA, the NIS, indeed, all the > covert agencies. They use drugs, secret mind control techniques, Mafia connections, drug > smuggling, arms smuggling, and similar tactics to benefit the rich and powerful including > David Rockefeller, the Rothschild bankers of Europe, and other vested private interests. > They do this by using international groups such as the Bilderberger Group, The Trilateral > Commission, and the Council on Foreign Relations to weaken national sovereignty in > favor of a New World Order. In other words, the usual suspects are up to their usual > conspiracies, but this time with a UFO twist that might have started it all. > > As an example, on page 252 Dolan relates a story connecting John Hinckley to the Bush > family. Hinckley, Sr. was a friend of Bush, Sr. Their eldest sons were to have dinner the > night Reagan was shot. Hinckley, Sr. ran World Vision, a CIA connected church (Dolan > says without references of any kind), with ties to Mark Chapman, murderer of John > Lennon, and Jim Jones, the Kool-Aid chaplain. So what is Dolan implying here? He’s > basically leading us to believe that the CIA and specifically George H.W. Bush is > somehow responsible for the death of John Lennon, the attempted assassination of > President Reagan, and the tragedy at Jonestown. His reference? Jim Keith, who related > this idea in Mind Control: World Control, The Encyclopedia of Mind Control. Another of > his titles: Saucers of the Illuminati. Keith himself died after falling off a stage and > breaking his leg at Burning Man and neglecting to get medical attention. He suffered a > blood clot. This, of course, is also a conspiracy. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/76 "2010-06-07T20:56:27Z")
Well, ivan, until now, I was only vaguely aware of you as someone who posted a lot without contributing much of substance to anything I’ve read. This thread has now caused me to put you firmly into my mental “complete nutcase” category. I mean, I don’t expect you to care about my opinion of you at all, but as you keep denying that you’re making yourself seem foolish, I can at least serve as a data point to the contrary. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/77 "2010-06-07T21:02:23Z")
Hmm, for some reason I had ivan astikov listed in my head as being reasonable and astute. Is there some other ivan I’m mixing him up with? I know it’s not the ivn#### guy, since he’s just a dick. But between this thread and his participation in the “is causality bullshit?” thread where he trots out the old “oh scientists are just too closed minded to question their view of the world” bullshit, he’s pretty clearly an idiot. Maybe he’s just cogent on other topics causing me to miscategorize him. I’m kind of jealous of **Xtisme**. I try hard to be a rational, skeptical voice on the boards, especially when it comes to kooky stuff, and yet none of the weak minded credulous are pitting me for it. Surely I deserve it at least as much as him ☹ > [@A Monkey With a Gun](#): > > Dude, that’s because UFO’s are _piloted_ by werewolves. That’s what makes the anal probes so unpleasant. This actually sort of comes close to a true story, which reminded me to make a [thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=12547278) about it. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/78 "2010-06-07T21:02:32Z")
I’m not interested in what you consider to be a post with substance, so toddle along to another thread. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/79 "2010-06-07T21:06:53Z")
Whose opinion do you value, then? Who do you think you’re scoring points with, and making **xtisme** look stupid to? ---
**Author:** ![Giraffe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giraffe/32/129_2.png) [@Giraffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giraffe)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2010, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300/80 "2010-06-07T21:16:17Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Typing it doesn’t make it so, but you are welcome to carry on banging away like some retarded child on your keyboard. At least it keeps you from annoying people IRL. I’d like to nominate this post for most Unintentionally Self-Descriptive Post of all time. I think it’s got a real shot at the title. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/xtisme-come-on-down-you-muppet/542300.md?page=5)