# Yankees overpaying Jeter **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [November 11, 2010, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270 "2010-11-11T02:45:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/81 "2010-11-12T16:43:29Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Did the Yankees make profits in their down years? Do they really have to win to be financially successful, due to advertising and TV revenue? Even if they can be financially successful while losing, it stands to reason they’d make more money when they are winning. People in business rarely think “I’m making money now and I don’t feel like trying to make more.” They haven’t had a string of down years in about two decades, but if they had several years in a row where they finished under .500 or just didn’t come close to the playoffs, it stands to reason they would start losing Yes Network subscriptions, not sell as many of the expensive seats at that stadium, and that luxury box sales might take a hit because they wouldn’t be such a hot ticket. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/82 "2010-11-12T16:46:14Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > You didn’t say which player came from the Pirates. Did you really think I needed to look it up? So he played a couple of games in Pittsburgh, he was a Yankee player and coach for decades. He counts. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/83 "2010-11-12T16:50:50Z")
> [@BlankSlate](#): > > He counts. As a home-grown Yankee? Interesting definition. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/84 "2010-11-12T16:57:06Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > Most Yankee fans are so ignorant of their own tradition that somehow the myth has emerged, with some of you supporting it here, that the Yankees never tried lowballing DiMaggio and the other greats, which they were famous for doing. Nonetheless, it was just business–they certainly underpaid all their star players, both systematically and individually, Dimaggio holding out bitterly, and signing reluctantly for far less than his value, on several occasions, but he still embodies Yankee pride and excellence. They have Jeter by the balls now: a good starting point for negotiations would be “Hey, Derek, you’ve made out like a bandit with your last contract, and your skills are pretty replacable, so how about you give two or three years for free and we’ll call it call it even? We’re not even asking that you pay us anyting for the privelige of wearing the pinstripes, that’s how big-hearted we are.” In other words, the Yankees were jerks for underpaying DiMaggio, but are stupid for potentially overpaying Jeter. The only consistency in your position is that the Yankees are bad guys no matter what they do. I got it. Strictly mercenary considerations should apply to any baseball transaction. No allowance should be made for contributions by a player over the years; that would just be stupid sentimentality. Good job in taking a more mercenary position that Yankees management itself. That’s impressive. Now, personally, I don’t think the Yankees will pay Jeter more than he is worth simply out of altruistic or noble sentiments. As I and others have said, this will be a marketing decision based on business considerations. But these considerations go beyond simply Jeter’s value on the field, to other aspects of having him on the team. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/85 "2010-11-12T17:06:32Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > As a home-grown Yankee? Interesting definition. Lucky for you he didn’t mention Ruth. 😉 Randolph probably shouldn’t be on that list but he spent the vast majority of his career as a Yankee and then spent years as a coach. Is this worth that much of a nitpick? Yankee fans love homegrown talent about as much as any other team. It’s not unique to their fanbase. And Yankees fans have fallen for plenty of non-farmhands anyway. They loved Tino Martinez and Paul O’Neill and David Wells, and they love Nick Swisher. If those guys aren’t as beloved as Jeter and the Hall of Famers, it’s because they aren’t as good and didn’t spend as much time on the team. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/86 "2010-11-12T17:19:08Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Lucky for you he didn’t mention Ruth. 😉 Randolph probably shouldn’t be on that list but he spent the vast majority of his career as a Yankee and then spent years as a coach. Is this worth that much of a nitpick? > > Yankee fans love homegrown talent about as much as any other team. It’s not unique to their fanbase. And Yankees fans have fallen for plenty of non-farmhands anyway. They loved Tino Martinez and Paul O’Neill and David Wells, and they love Nick Swisher. If those guys aren’t as beloved as Jeter and the Hall of Famers, it’s because they aren’t as good and didn’t spend as much time on the team. I was careful not to mention Ruth, but I didn’t think anyone would care about Willie (included as more of a personal favorite, anyway.) It’s true there are a lot of imported players who become fan favorites, but I can’t stand Swisher. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/87 "2010-11-12T19:12:26Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Randolph probably shouldn’t be on that list but he spent the vast majority of his career as a Yankee and then spent years as a coach. Is this worth that much of a nitpick? Among the many things I dislike about Yankee fans, and among the reasons I enjoy pointing out nitpicks that I might let slide with a fan of another team, is their lack of graciousness. I point out an error he made in identifying Randolph as a player “who came up in their system and played their whole careers in the Bronx” and instead of acknowledging his overstatement, he tells me that Randloph counts, and you offer me criticism for “nitpicking” and allow that Randolph “probably” shouldn’t be on that list. Okay, **Marley** , show me a way, however improbable, that you would put Randolph on a list of Yankees “who came up in their system and played their whole careers in the Bronx.” --I’ll wait. And I’ll pay off 10 to 1 if you want to make a bet of it. If it helps I’ll give you a clue–he played all of his minor league baseball in Pittsburgh’s system, and he played for Pittsburgh, the Mets, the Dodgers and the Brewers. Construct those facts so they conform to the description given, please. Graceless, boastful overstaters, impossible to argue with as a reasonable person, or even a reasonable fan, smug, snotty, hostile, supercilious, nasty, defensive, willfully obtuse–yes, I’m remembering what I find unattractive in your average Yankees’ fan. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/88 "2010-11-12T19:14:04Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > Graceless, boastful overstaters, impossible to argue with as a reasonable person, or even a reasonable fan, smug, snotty, hostile, supercilious, nasty, defensive, willfully obtuse–yes, I’m remembering what I find unattractive in your average Yankees’ fan. And the thing I enjoy about Yankee haters is the lack of irony. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/89 "2010-11-12T19:29:22Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > In other words, the Yankees were jerks for underpaying DiMaggio, but are stupid for potentially overpaying Jeter. The only consistency in your position is that the Yankees are bad guys no matter what they do. Not quite. I pointed out that they used to underpay their stars systematically and individually. The “systematically” part was standard practice, and set the market value when the owners held all the cards, so it’s hard to blame to Yankees much here–every team was underpaying every player, which stunk, but hardly the Yankees’ exclusive problem. I fault them more than other teams, though, because they generally were extremely profitable so they could have paid their stars better, but just refused to (as opposed to the St. Louis Browns, who just didn’t have the money). Also they needlessly created rancor with players like Dimaggio and Maris by pinching pennies, and probably did themselves more harm than good. And with Jeter, you’re right I’m citing the opposite problem, needless generosity (if that analyst quoted in the Times is right–you know the one you said was “making shit up”? That guy.) As I’ve explained several times over, **Colibri** , if they’d won the Series just now, I’d really have no complaint about how they choose to spend their money, but when they DON’T win, and shower millions above established market value on a player with dubious remaining skills, I think they’re creating problems for themselves. I couldn’t care less if they’re making things hard for themselves, I probably enjoy it more than anything else, but I do want to point out something I think they’re doing that will hurt them, before it actually hurts them. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/90 "2010-11-12T19:30:36Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > And the thing I enjoy about Yankee haters is the lack of irony. 😃 Forgot “comically ignorant about their own past, and prideful about their often abysmal ignorance.” Sorry–there’s so much ground to cover here. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/91 "2010-11-12T19:53:37Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > As I’ve explained several times over, **Colibri** , if they’d won the Series just now, I’d really have no complaint about how they choose to spend their money, And as I have pointed out, it’s monumentally stupid to make strategic judgments based on based on winning or not winning a couple of games during one particular week. This just indicates you have no understanding of baseball. > [@](#): > > but I do want to point out something I think they’re doing that will hurt them, before it actually hurts them. How generous of you. Nah. Actually, you just want to find some excuse, no matter what, to justify your personal opinion the Yankees suck. > [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > Among the many things I dislike about Yankee fans, and among the reasons I enjoy pointing out nitpicks that I might let slide with a fan of another team, is their lack of graciousness. Like **Marley** , all I can say is that this indicates an utterly non-functional irony meter. ---
**Author:** ![VarlosZ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d78d45/32.png) [@VarlosZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VarlosZ)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/92 "2010-11-12T19:58:37Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > **I point out an error he made** in identifying Randolph as a player “who came up in their system and played their whole careers in the Bronx” and instead of acknowledging his overstatement… That’s a very self-serving description of what happened. You make it sound as if you merely said, “Actually, Randolph came up with the Pirates and played 30 games with them before going the Yankees.” In actual fact, you alluded to the mistake with an air of detached condescension (“If you’re interested, one of those players…”), and then connected \*\*Blank \*\*and Yankees fans in general to the phrase “spouting ignorance.” This is needlessly abrasive, and surely you must realize that your post pretty much ensured that \*\*Blank \*\*wouldn’t be merely “acknowledging his overstatement.” Furthermore, while of course it’s fine to mention that Randolph came up with a team other than the Yankees, it’s still something of a (potentially benign) nitpick. Instead of engaging his point, you corrected one of his \*seven \*examples, and then insulted him. Besides, in context (i.e., as compared with the Yankees’ usual array of high-priced mercenary talent), Willie Randolph fits in very nicely with the other players mentioned, even if he’s not quite a match for the specific tag that was on that list. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/93 "2010-11-12T19:59:03Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > And as I have pointed out, it’s monumentally stupid to make strategic judgments based on based on winning or not winning a couple of games during one particular week. This just indicates you have no understanding of baseball. > > How generous of you. > > Nah. Actually, you just want to find some excuse, no matter what, to justify your personal opinion the Yankees suck. > > Like **Marley** , all I can say is that this indicates an utterly non-functional irony meter. Hmmm, I keep pointing out my issues with Yankees’ fans generally, and you and **Marley** keep pointing out things you don’t like about me, personally. You know, “stupid,” “no understanding,” etc. Anyone know a good Mod I could report these things to? ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/94 "2010-11-12T20:00:29Z")
how much could not signing Jeter really cost the Yankees? Of course that is based on a lot of factors, such as what could they have paid him for and refused, who replaces him, how successful they are without him and I would guess how successful Jeter is somewhere else. I see so much about how the Yankees have to sign Jeter because of how beloved he is, and while he ccertianly is beloved like few other Yankees, I stil think the team would survive letting him go, especially if they were successful. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/95 "2010-11-12T20:03:11Z")
> [@VarlosZ](#): > > and then insulted him. I should think you ought to report that “insult” to some Mod–I suggest that you and \*\*Colibri \*\*and **Marley** should be able to find something I wrote that insulted him, if I give you all a few hours. Maybe you can get it so that a faintly condescending tone is a mortal insult. Good luck with that. ---
**Author:** ![VarlosZ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d78d45/32.png) [@VarlosZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VarlosZ)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/96 "2010-11-12T20:16:22Z")
“Fat people are disgusting … Hey! How come all these fat people _I just said that to_ are taking shots at me _personally_?! That’s totally different from _my_ behavior!” Anyway, supposing for a second that I hadn’t included the sentence fragment you addressed, would you have any response to my last post? Do you agree that I might have something of a point about being needlessly abrasive, initiating hostilities, etc.? ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/97 "2010-11-12T20:17:33Z")
Pit me, wouldja? We’re trying to talk baseball here. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/98 "2010-11-12T20:18:33Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Did the Yankees make profits in their down years? Do they really have to win to be financially successful, due to advertising and TV revenue? The Yankees made money but the amount of money they made was dramatically less, to say the least. In the early 90s they were drawing about half the fans they do now, at lower prices. They had years in the bottom half of the league in attendance. They made a profit, but success has brought them VASTLY higher profits. The difference in tickets and concessions alone would approach $100 million per year - and they make far more money from TV rights. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/99 "2010-11-12T22:17:26Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > Pit me, wouldja? We’re trying to talk baseball here. Hey, I’m a Red Sox fan and I think you’re being unnecessarily abrasive to Yankees fans here. Some people are talking baseball, it’s not clear what your agenda is. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270/100 "2010-11-12T22:20:41Z")
**PRR** , most Yankee fans grew up in the tri-state area and became fans of one or both of the New York teams. We’re really not unlike any other fans, except we are, admittedly, kind of spoiled. It’s not our fault, we don’t own the franchise. It’s not our money either, so why should we care if management overpays for veteran players? I like Jeter. I think he’s going to have a much better offensive season in 2011. What’s your beef, anyway? ETA: a lot of fans act like assholes at Yankee stadium. Same with fans from Boston, Philly, Chicago etc. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yankees-overpaying-jeter/560270.md?page=6)