# Yes, it's time for another round of "Who's the dick?" **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 11, 2016, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896 "2016-04-11T17:10:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2016, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/141 "2016-04-14T22:03:45Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > “Just like cars do.” So, it would be entirely appropriate for a bicyclist to stop (not park) his bicycle in a car travel lane while waiting for someone? And car drivers should be ready for this, deal with it, find a way to go around? If there’s no curb or elsewhere for them to stop and pick someone up, yes. Usually, they have the option to use a sidewalk or shoulder. All I’m asking is that automobile drivers get the same opportunity. Have you seriously never had to stop for – or move around to avoid – a pedestrian, cyclist, stalled car, etc? Yes. Cars do this all the time. It’s no big deal. We’re not talking about highway traffic here, just your average, plodding, stop and go city commuting. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2016, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/142 "2016-04-14T22:13:29Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > “Just like cars do.” So, it would be entirely appropriate for a bicyclist to stop (not park) his bicycle in a car travel lane while waiting for someone? And car drivers should be ready for this, deal with it, find a way to go around? I have had to stop behind a gaggle of cyclists at a red signal when they were going ahead and I want to turn right. Mildly annoying. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/143 "2016-04-15T00:59:46Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > I have had to stop behind a gaggle of cyclists at a red signal when they were going ahead and I want to turn right. Mildly annoying. Wouldn’t the same be true for a car going straight when you want to turn right? Not sure why bikes would be singled out here. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/144 "2016-04-15T02:51:03Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > Or go around, yeah. It’s a city street, not a highway. Cars get blocked by things in the city all the time. They slow down, or they stop, or they go around. It isn’t that hard. Done it a lot have you? Going around the occasional car isn’t a huge deal, but as I noted a regular cyclist will often encounter several cars parked in the bike lane on a single block. This is a problem, especially a cyclist. Let’s say you drive down a 2 lane (2 lanes going your direction that is) street, and the right lane is blocked by some other stopped vehicle. You switch to the left lane and nobody really minds (assuming you don’t cut anyone off). Its not a big deal as you are probably going as fast as the cars in the lane next to you. You can even stay in the left lane and no-one will question your right to drive there. Now as a cyclist that option really isn’t there, especially if there is a bike lane. The cyclist probably isn’t going as fast as the cars, and has to cut them off, maybe slow them down, or get boxed in because a driver sees the blockage and does the worst thing possible without malice - hover behind or next to the cyclist such that they don’t really have room to pull into the car lane to bypass the stopped vehicle. Once in the car lane the expectation of drivers is that the cyclist will immediately return to it - even if another vehicle is blocking the bike lane 70 feet down the street. And yes, they will honk at you and yell for you to get back in the bike lane, no matter what the blockage is. > [@](#): > > The analogy to interstate highways in the bike world are paved bike trails, like rails to trails. They usually run through the woods. Ride there if you want to go 45mph and never stop for anything until you get to where you’re going. See, here’s the problem. Highways tend to go places. Important locations of business and commerce. Rails to trails? Not so much. They can be fun to ride on, but it is rare that one goes someplace useful. In addition, rails to trails paths are not for the exclusive use of cyclists. The two just do not compare. > [@](#): > > In the city, you have to be aware of your surroundings, maneuver around obstacles, and slow down in heavy traffic and for people parking or pulling over. Just like cars do. Welcome to the city commuter club. I get plenty of slowdowns in my commutes and I can shrug it off when it is legitimate delay, but most people parking in bike lanes are just selfishly using it as free parking, and that is selfishness that can lead to endangering the cyclist. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/145 "2016-04-15T15:46:36Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Awful idea, illegal in most places, very dangerous to everyone involved, and physically impossible in places without a curb cut. So let’s just pretend you never suggested this one, OK? > [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > MASSIVE projection here. > > Also riding on sidewalks is stupid and dangerous. Do not suggest that. It is absolutely not dangerous if you go slow enough or, even better, walk the damn bike, and if you only use it when the regular lane is blocked. The OP parked in the bike lane, any biker should know to slow down, go on the sidewalk, and use it to get back onto the bike lane. I am NOT advocating full time use of the sidewalk at normal biking speeds and I’m certainly not saying to do that where it is illegal. But temporary parking in a bike lane is not a big offense, just go around it. I also noticed nobody looked at the pictures I linked and had an idea of how a driver’s supposed to get to where they’re going without crossing the bike lane. It happens, its unavoidable, and in many situations, its not illegal. You bikers have to share your lane just as cars have to share theirs ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/146 "2016-04-15T16:15:15Z")
> [@YogSothoth](#): > > You bikers have to share your lane just as cars have to share theirs Most places, it is illegal for a car to park in a bike lane while it is not illegal for a bike to be in a car lane. You car drivers should stay where you are legal. And quit being dicks. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/147 "2016-04-15T16:35:39Z")
> [@YogSothoth](#): > > It is absolutely not dangerous if you go slow enough or, even better, walk the damn bike, and if you only use it when the regular lane is blocked. There’s no reason a biker should have to dismount and walk on the sidewalk during a commute. Besides still be incredibly dangerous to ride “slow enough” on the sidewalk, getting out of the road and back onto the road are dangerous activities. Often, bike lanes are obstructed every block, it’s not an occasional thing. But mainly, if I’m riding to work I am trying to get there safely, quickly, and efficiently. I have no desire to spend extra time dismounting and getting on the sidewalk than drivers have patience for waiting an extra light cycle because pedestrians are crossing against a light. Bike lanes are there for a reason - they work if they are maintained and kept clear. If the bike lanes aren’t clear then I’m taking up a full travel lane (as permitted by law) because it’s safest and the most efficient use of time. The cars behind me will just have to drive slow enough. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/148 "2016-04-15T17:30:23Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Wouldn’t the same be true for a car going straight when you want to turn right? Not sure why bikes would be singled out here. Not singled out. I answered the question. Mind you, if the bikers are really considerate, they could let me by, while the car cant, but I dont get angry if they dont. If the cyclist in the OP has simply said “Dude, bike lane is for bikes, please be more considerate next time, eh?” I’d have voted for the Op as the “Biggus Dickus”. But " _biker stops next to my window and starts screaming at me to get out of the bike lane"_. Road rage is always wrong. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/149 "2016-04-15T17:32:48Z")
> [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > Going around the occasional car isn’t a huge deal, but as I noted a regular cyclist will often encounter several cars parked in the bike lane on a single block. This is a problem, especially a cyclist. > . In the three large metropolitan areas I have seen Bike lanes in use in CA, I have not noticed this. I am sure it happens once in w great while. Of course, maybe CA is different. Maybe that’s why over half the cyclists use the sidewalk rather than the bike lanes. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/150 "2016-04-15T17:34:09Z")
> [@wguy123](#): > > Most places, it is illegal for a car to park in a bike lane while it is not illegal for a bike to be in a car lane. > > You car drivers should stay where you are legal. And quit being dicks. Most places, it is illegal for a bike to ride in on the sidewalk … You cyclists should stay where you are legal. And quit being dicks. ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/151 "2016-04-15T17:47:24Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Most places, it is illegal for a bike to ride in on the sidewalk … > > You cyclists should stay where you are legal. And quit being dicks. And that is exactly why I don’t ride on sidewalks. Did you see me advocate for that in the same way I see lots of people advocating for blocking the bicycle lane in this thread? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/152 "2016-04-15T18:32:44Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > In the three large metropolitan areas I have seen Bike lanes in use in CA, I have not noticed this. I am sure it happens once in w great while. That you would notice such blockages means little to me. Meanwhile on the first page (or second, can’t be bothered to check) I linked to several images of bike lanes being blocked by multiple vehicles. This is unfortunately a common thing in our biggest bike lanes in Philadelphia. > [@](#): > > Of course, maybe CA is different. Maybe that’s why over half the cyclists use the sidewalk rather than the bike lanes. In Philadelphia, very few people ride on the sidewalk, at least when a bike lane is available. You are an incredible anti-bike bigot so I doubt your observation figures, but a lack of bike lanes will lead to sidewalk riding. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/153 "2016-04-15T18:32:51Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > If the cyclist in the OP has simply said “Dude, bike lane is for bikes, please be more considerate next time, eh?” I’d have voted for the Op as the “Biggus Dickus”. But " _biker stops next to my window and starts screaming at me to get out of the bike lane"_. Road rage is always wrong. And no one in this thread has said otherwise (unless I missed it). All the bikers have said that they understand the frustration, but his reaction was wrong. > [@DrDeth](#): > > Most places, it is illegal for a bike to ride in on the sidewalk … > > You cyclists should stay where you are legal. And quit being dicks. I can’t speak for what goes on out there but it doesn’t happen in Boston where I commute. Let’s not worry about the idiot bikers who are riding on the sidewalk, they’re not the ones who have to deal with the cars parked in the bike lane. You know, where bikes are legally supposed to be but can’t because of illegally parked cars. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/154 "2016-04-15T18:37:06Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > And no one in this thread has said otherwise (unless I missed it). All the bikers have said that they understand the frustration, but his reaction was wrong. The closest we’ve come to that is one person advocated taking the bikes onto the sidewalks when the bike lane is blocked. In other words cyclists should suck it up, then do something illegal rather than complain about the poor, poor, put upon drivers who had to park illegally in the bike lanes. Other than that, no one has advocated sidewalk cycling. Even in the history of the SDMB I’ve only seen one or two and they were freaking idiots, not representative of the cyclists here, but DrDeth has a serious mad-on against cyclists. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/155 "2016-04-15T19:20:35Z")
> [@wguy123](#): > > Most places, it is illegal for a car to park in a bike lane while it is not illegal for a bike to be in a car lane. > > You car drivers should stay where you are legal. And quit being dicks. Look at the pictures I linked, how is a car supposed to get to the street without crossing the bike lane? Until you answer that, I’m going to assume its legal for cars to temporarily cross into a bike lane. Again, the OP wasn’t parking there for the night, this was a temporary pickup. There’s nothing wrong with that. > [@Telemark](#): > > There’s no reason a biker should have to dismount and walk on the sidewalk during a commute. Besides still be incredibly dangerous to ride “slow enough” on the sidewalk, getting out of the road and back onto the road are dangerous activities. Often, bike lanes are obstructed every block, it’s not an occasional thing. And I’m sure drivers are equally frustrated that they can’t even do the speed limit on some streets if there are a lot of bikers or pedestrians on it. But they slow down because they have to and because they should. Bikers can learn from that. Its not ideal that a car temporarily parks across your lane, but if it happens, just get off the bike, walk it over the sidewalk, and move on. > [@Telemark](#): > > But mainly, if I’m riding to work I am trying to get there safely, quickly, and efficiently. I have no desire to spend extra time dismounting and getting on the sidewalk than drivers have patience for waiting an extra light cycle because pedestrians are crossing against a light. Bike lanes are there for a reason - they work if they are maintained and kept clear. All of this can be said for streets as well. I’m sure drivers don’t like to be stuck behind a slow biker, or slam the brakes because someone’s crossing the street, but they have to and should. I think bikers should expect the same, they can wish their lane was clear for them, but understand that sometimes cars or people will cross it, or stay in it temporarily, and bikers should just adjust > [@Telemark](#): > > If the bike lanes aren’t clear then I’m taking up a full travel lane (as permitted by law) because it’s safest and the most efficient use of time. The cars behind me will just have to drive slow enough. Nobody’s saying you can’t, but the debate seems to be whether you should be a dick about it. If a bike or pedestrian crosses into the street, I’m not going to yell at them out of window. I accept that sometimes that will happen and move on. So too should the biker in the OP’s post just accept that many cities do not have abundant drop off/pick up areas for the expansion of taxi-like Uber cars. Until they do, we all have to share the road. Its unreasonable for the biker to get mad because the city didn’t design its streets with Uber in mind ---
**Author:** ![Asimovian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asimovian/32/172_2.png) [@Asimovian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asimovian)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/156 "2016-04-15T19:21:47Z")
> [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > ou are an incredible anti-bike bigot so I doubt your observation figures, but a lack of bike lanes will lead to sidewalk riding. Please leave the personal insults out of this thread and forum. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/157 "2016-04-15T19:30:14Z")
> [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > The closest we’ve come to that is one person advocated taking the bikes onto the sidewalks when the bike lane is blocked. Sorry, but my comment was about banging on the illegally parked driver’s window and yelling at them. I don’t think anyone here defended that action. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/158 "2016-04-15T19:43:35Z")
> [@YogSothoth](#): > > Look at the pictures I linked, how is a car supposed to get to the street without crossing the bike lane? Until you answer that, I’m going to assume its legal for cars to temporarily cross into a bike lane. Again, the OP wasn’t parking there for the night, this was a temporary pickup. There’s nothing wrong with that. Actually, it is illegal. The ways the laws (at least the ones I’ve seen) are written, you can cross a bike lane at intersections, to get to driveways or legal parking spots. It’s not legal to stop in a bike lane for a temporary pickup. Some of those laws have been posted here in this thread. So, you’re wrong about what’s legal. Temporarily stopping in a bike lane to pick up a passenger is not legal; crossing a bike lane to access the street, at an intersection, to get to a driveway, or to get to a legal parking spot is just fine. > [@YogSothoth](#): > > And I’m sure drivers are equally frustrated that they can’t even do the speed limit on some streets if there are a lot of bikers or pedestrians on it. But they slow down because they have to and because they should. Bikers can learn from that. Its not ideal that a car temporarily parks across your lane, but if it happens, just get off the bike, walk it over the sidewalk, and move on. No. The proper response here according to the traffic codes is for the bike to take up a regular driving lane. The end result is that cars end up being slowed down more. And if the bike lane is constantly blocked it’s much safer to just take the travel lane full time rather than go back and forth around the parked cars. That’s particularly unsafe. Dismounting and walking on the sidewalk is not realistic, reasonable, or practical, so I’m just going to ignore that idea. > [@YogSothoth](#): > > Nobody’s saying you can’t, but the debate seems to be whether you should be a dick about it. If a bike or pedestrian crosses into the street, I’m not going to yell at them out of window. I accept that sometimes that will happen and move on. So too should the biker in the OP’s post just accept that many cities do not have abundant drop off/pick up areas for the expansion of taxi-like Uber cars. Until they do, we all have to share the road. Its unreasonable for the biker to get mad because the city didn’t design its streets with Uber in mind No one here is saying to be a dick about it either. I don’t think anyone is defending the biker who yelled at the OP. But I completely disagree with your assertion that Taxis and Ubers should just get to ignore the law and block the bike lanes, even for just a few minutes. They should find a legal and safe place to pick up their passengers. Yes, it’s a bit of a PITA for the drivers but it’s not an impossible task. ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/159 "2016-04-15T20:05:37Z")
> [@YogSothoth](#): > > Look at the pictures I linked, how is a car supposed to get to the street without crossing the bike lane? Until you answer that, I’m going to assume its legal for cars to temporarily cross into a bike lane. Again, the OP wasn’t parking there for the night, this was a temporary pickup. There’s nothing wrong with that. It is legal to cross a bike lane or a crosswalk to cross a street or turn or get to a legal parking spot. That is not what we are talking about. It is illegal to park in a bike lane or a crosswalk. OP was parking in a bike lane. I don’t care if it was “just for three minutes”. There is a lot wrong with parking in a bike lane or a crosswalk. Find a legal place to park. And if you have to legally cross a bike lane to do that, I’m OK with it. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2016, 9:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896/160 "2016-04-16T09:39:53Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > You’d feel the same way if you were driving a car, and the OP was stopped and blocking your travel lane? Or if you were walking and the OP was parked across the sidewalk? Um, yes. It happens all the time. The car will pull over as far as they can, but that’s only so far. You either drive around them if it’s clear or you wait. Sure, on the Interstate they’ll have shoulders wide enough that this isn’t a problem, but most other rodes have maybe 2 feet off the lane. You can’t pull over very far. Heck, a lot of time, the reason the person is stopped is the police. The fact that so many of you are freaking out over a normal part of driving is weird. If they didn’t want it, then don’t make the bike lane the furthest on the right, where you are supposed to pull over. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yes-its-time-for-another-round-of-whos-the-dick/751896.md?page=9)