Alka Seltzer, don’t bother. He’s obviously got an axe to grind. Maybe he got a sludged-up 1.8T 10 years ago and hasn’t forgiven VAG since.
But it’s okay, his arguments have that “extremist nut” vibe to them, so his credibility is seriously undermined.
If VW were doing so terribly in the US, they wouldn’t have just opened a brand new plant in Tennessee. And Audi wouldn’t have introduced–and subsequently been unable to keep up with the demand for–the Q5, because the crossover SUV market is really only a big deal in North America. I’m not saying they don’t sell them worldwide; but that model wouldn’t have even been conceived had it not been for the US market.
Again, I’m not saying Audi/VW are perfect…not even close. Because, of course, to have such an extreme viewpoint would be quite foolish. They’re European, so when shit breaks it’s expensive. And I think that’s what turns people off more than the simple incidence of shit breaking. That incidence isn’t significantly different than that of most other makes. And if you believe that it is, you’re going to have to find some firm data. JD Power surveys and Consumer Reports articles are not statistics, either.
Crossovers only a big deal in the US? Only conceived for the US market? The Q5 is one of the worst selling cars in the segment. Audi sells 2-3x as many Q5s in China, a much smaller market for luxury cars, as they do in the US.
Well you’ve certainly done a great job proving me wrong with the great firm data you’ve brought along so far forum poster aerodave. Of course Consumer Reports and JD Powers are no match for your comprehensive “I owned a bunch of VWs and some of them didn’t break” study.
OP, don’t listen to jz78817, buy the Passat like I told you to. aerodave knows what’s up.
I know that not all Volkswagens are bad. But I do know that the Jettas have been historically crappy cars. Then more recently I have seen the new Beetles making a lot of “most unreliable vehicle” lists. So I guess that’s two of their models to avoid.
But even more recent I’ve seen the Passats making those same lists.
I couldn’t cite these lists since they are usually linked articles from yahoo or msn news but I usually make a mental note of repeat offender vehicles.
On the other hand all I’ve ever read about Rabbits and Gulfs has been good.
My roommate finally got rid of his (2004? 2006?) Golf last month. Lots of transmission/clutch problems, the back hatch rusted out, electrical problems, and probably more stuff I didn’t even know about.
Since your argument seems to boil down to “VWs suck because Americans don’t like them”, it doesn’t really need to be proven wrong. Why don’t you suggest that the OP buy a Lincoln Town Car?
The “feel” of the engine you’re referring to is probably low-end torque, which is one thing diesels do very well. You won’t get the same sort of low end grunt from any current hybrid or any conventional small gasoline-powered inline four, I’m afraid.
the automotive media drives brand-new press cars which have been gone over with a fine-tooth comb. yes, they’ve been well reviewed in most aspects that car mags look at (handling, fit/finish) but very few if any concern themselves with long-term durability.
Americans do like them, judging by their sales. But IMO that seems more due to the fact that VW is the cheapest way to get the “cachet” of a German car. They’re either unaware of the reputation or are willing to accept high cost of ownership in order to have that badge.
You seem to have nixed (or at least are bored by) the Corolla and Accord, but both will hit 35mph highway pretty handily. My 2000 Corolla has 140K miles and still hit 40mpg on a purely highway trip this past Spring. It’s normally low-mid 30’s for mixed city/highway driving. How much excitement do you need on a commute? I haven’t driven a Prius yet. What makes it more interesting than a Corolla or Accord?
Most serious car mags over here (UK) also have long-term tests where they runs cars over tens of thousands of miles. They also publish customer surveys and information from warranty firms. These don’t provide comprehensive statistics on breakdowns, but I’ve read quite a few over the years and there is a clear trend. In terms of reliability, the Japanese cars come top, then there is a gap to everything else. The German cars come next, followed by the US brands (Ford and Vauxhall), with the French and Italian cars at the bottom. This matches my anecdotal experience, I’ve never seen a broken down Japanese car at the side of the road. For every manufacturer, some models are more problematic than others, which mixes things up a bit when looking at individual models.
Personally, I wouldn’t recommend a VW or Audi, as I think they are over-priced for what they are. But statements like “all their cars are junk” and “They fail consistently in market like the US where people actually want reliable, well built cars and can get them.” are tripe.
Since you don’t want to read the thread, why don’t you stop posting? “VWs are great because their sales are up and they haven’t gone bankrupt yet” is the argument aerodave brought up in post #16. I was simply responding to it because it just so happens to be both absurd in reasoning and factually wrong.
If you think Americans like Audi that is your opinion. Audi sales are about on par with Acura, Infiniti, or Lincoln, except Audi has a much larger model lineup with many more body styles. Buick sells 2x as many cars as Audi with a lineup that consists of 4 vehicles total, including the Lucerne. MBZ and Cadillac each sell around 2-3x, BMW and Lexus have individual models (3 series, RX) that alone outsell or equal the entire Audi lineup.
I would. I already said the OP should buy the Passat. Why not? He’ll learn one way or the other. V:oV
Just to play dueling anecdotes, my neighbor’s Passat wagon literally died on the freeway with her in it ;). That thing had so many different problems they had to pay three deductibles ( one for each separate problem that needed to be addressed - they have some weird extended warranty ). It’s had mechanical and electrical problems up the ass. Their previous vehicle, a bug, had some issues as well, mostly having to deal with the convertible roof. They won’t ever buy another VW.
Not that the above proves anything either, of course. Every manufacturer turns out an individual failed car from time to time. I think they just really lucked out in a bad way with that piece of junk and they are considering going to the Better Business Bureau to investigate seeing if it would qualify as a lemon that they could get redress for. But since they were just detailing their woes to me last night over dinner I couldn’t resist posting a counter-example after reading this thread.
I actually like some of the VW’s aesthetically, but parts and labor do make the German and Swedish cars seem less attractive from where I sit.
Snark aside, the Passat already sold; looking at VWs, I’d be much more inclined to the Jetta at any rate. The Passat was just an option of convenience, and in impeccable shape. It’s the one I’ve had a chance to test drive, and was impressed with the comfort of the car and the finish of the interior.
Excitement’s not much of a factor, but I just wasn’t as comfy in the Civic I’ve driven. Comfort IS a factor when I spend almost two hours behind the wheel daily. Corolla or Accord might be better; I should probably keep my eye out. I have a gut preference for the interior trim on VW, but I know I shouldn’t behold myself to that.
As for the Prius, an appreciation for the tech and the extra mileage boost make it attractive. I’m concerned about maintainance costs, though, since I haven’t heard much solid info about long-term lifespan (at the price range I’m looking, a Prius would be coming with 120k+).
I think some people may have misunderstood the point of my own anecdote. I wasn’t trying to persuade anyone that VAG cars are great…or even that they’re worth buying at all. I just wanted to refute the assertion that “literally everything” made by Audi and VW is poorly built junk. I saw a ludicrous, unsupported statement that no one had bothered calling out yet. I met my goal, without the OP buying a Passat.