# Yet another unjustified tasering by idiot cop **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 2, 2010, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359 "2010-09-02T07:33:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2010, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/181 "2010-09-04T23:43:14Z")
> [@x-ray\_vision](#): > > > [@robby](#): > > > > She reiterated that anybody can refuse medical treatment, but they cannot refuse a mental health evaluation and/or commitment if they express a desire to hurt themselves or others, or show any indication that this might be the case. > > There are other circumstances too, such as not being in the right frame of mind. I’ve witnessed ER doctors forcing medical treatment on patients involved in vehicular trauma because they were shaken up and couldn’t recite the alphabet in reverse. Same would go for patients with dementia and others that aren’t competent enough to make decisions for themselves. [sidenote]Recite the alphabet in reverse?[/sidenote] I can’t do that stone cold sober out of the shower in the morning. Is that really expected? ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2010, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/182 "2010-09-05T00:54:53Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > [sidenote]Recite the alphabet in reverse?[/sidenote] I can’t do that stone cold sober out of the shower in the morning. Is that really expected? Not in full, but at least be able to make it to v or u or so. One time in particular I recall a doc asking that question I suspected he was trying to get his way and not allow the patient to refuse medical attention. More common questions are “what year is it?” and “who’s the President?” ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2010, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/183 "2010-09-05T04:02:55Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > > [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > > > I’ll even go so far, **Bricker** , as to say that after viewing the additional footage, I agree that these officers had probable cause. I don’t even need to wait for the court ruling after seeing that. > > > [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > > > Again, the one on the ground seemed gratuitous to me, but after watching the full video, I have a nearly impossible time trying to claim that the police were as negligent as I first believed them to have been. > > First, thanks very much for the concession. That’s a rare, rare thing around here, and I really appreciate it. > > I’ve been burned far too often with short video clips (Shirley Sherrod, anyone?) whose longer versions reveal a different story to take that first version for granted. So good on you for watching the complete version with an open mind. > > I still question the officers’ use of their judgment, and think they might well have done things better… but, yeah, they were unquestionably inside the “legal” box. Your welcome. I don’t mind being wrong, and I don’t mind changing my mind when new evidence warrants it. There’s no shame in that, to me. If I thought there were, I’d be afraid to ever open my mouth, as I’m wrong frequently enough (for my tastes, anyway :p). ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2010, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/184 "2010-09-05T16:12:47Z")
Mr. **Bricker** , the court thanks you for your full and vigorous defense of your clients, and appreciates the _pro bono_ work you have done. Our system of justice requires that ALL accused are allowed to defend themselves against charges to the best of their ability. Of course, even a vigorous defense is not a guarantee of success, particularly when the facts are so plain as they are in this case. This court finds the defendants guilty as charged. ---
**Author:** ![Robb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a183cd/32.png) [@Robb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robb)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2010, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/185 "2010-09-05T17:53:43Z")
[QUOTE=Euphonious Polemic] Our system of justice requires that ALL accused are allowed to defend themselves against charges to the best of their ability. [/QUOTE] When did the court of public opinion become a system of justice? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2010, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/186 "2010-09-05T18:00:50Z")
In **Bricker** ’s mind. That’s all he understands. That’s why **EP** addressed him that way. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2010, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/187 "2010-09-06T02:34:28Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Not necessarily preferential treatment, more a recognition that cops are allowed to use force under circumstances that a regular citizen would not. I suspect you are factually wrong. Policemen (in the US) do not have any more power to shoot someone or to arrest someone than any ordinary citizen has. If I am mistaken, I would appreciate being corrected. ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2010, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/188 "2010-09-06T03:15:09Z")
> [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](#): > > > [@Shodan](#): > > > > Not necessarily preferential treatment, more a recognition that cops are allowed to use force under circumstances that a regular citizen would not. > > I suspect you are factually wrong. Policemen (in the US) do not have any more power to shoot someone or to arrest someone than any ordinary citizen has. If I am mistaken, I would appreciate being corrected. Different states have different laws as far as making citizen’s arrests go, but you realize you can’t go around making arrests for simple misdemeanors and you can’t use force if someone laughs at you and walks away because you told them you were making a citizen’s arrest because they’re drunk in public or some similar minor offense, right? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2010, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/189 "2010-09-06T17:52:38Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Mr. **Bricker** , the court thanks you for your full and vigorous defense of your clients, and appreciates the _pro bono_ work you have done. Our system of justice requires that ALL accused are allowed to defend themselves against charges to the best of their ability. > > Of course, even a vigorous defense is not a guarantee of success, particularly when the facts are so plain as they are in this case. > > This court finds the defendants guilty as charged. Good luck imposing any sanction, judge. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2010, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/190 "2010-09-06T19:13:41Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Good luck imposing any sanction, judge. We’re currently working on how to do that through the internet. However, your cheque will be in the mail shortly. ---
**Author:** ![drachillix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/48db29/32.png) [@drachillix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drachillix)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2010, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/191 "2010-09-06T19:26:51Z")
> [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](#): > > I suspect you are factually wrong. Policemen (in the US) do not have any more power to shoot someone or to arrest someone than any ordinary citizen has. If I am mistaken, I would appreciate being corrected. Police officers have broader discretion in the use of lethal force to defend others than average citizens do as well as use of lethal force in obtaining arrest of a person who represents a serious threat to others if allowed to escape. State laws of course vary in exact application. The average citizen does not get to shoot a fleeing suspect, it is difficult to claim self defense when the guy is running away, under some circumstances, a police officer can. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2010, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/192 "2010-09-06T21:10:04Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Good luck imposing any sanction, judge. This being the court of public opinion, the sanctions are being imposed already. Perhaps you didn’t notice? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2010, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/193 "2010-09-06T23:55:46Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > > [@Bricker](#): > > > > Good luck imposing any sanction, judge. > > We’re currently working on how to do that through the internet. However, your cheque will be in the mail shortly. Yes, I’m sure the scary internet, with it’s jump-to-conclusions mob, will be all over this. Until the next recreational outr… oooohhh, shiny! ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/194 "2010-09-07T02:02:16Z")
These generally boil down to what side people identify with. I see a man in his house who has no intention of killing himself. He resents the police walking into his home and telling him they have to take him away. It is not a vacation trip. It is a trip that might get him labelled as dangerous or mentally deficient. That is not a good thing to have on your record, especially nowadays when records travel everywhere instantly. His whole life is about to change. He sees no reason for it. The cop says he has no choice except to take him away. Is that true? Cops have discretion. When they pull someone over they can give a ticket for how fast he was going, cut the speed down a bit or even let them off with a warning. I think he has choices. I disagree that they cop has his hand forced. However if you believe he has no choice, them much of it follows. But when he stood up, I think he was just cooperating. He was not attacking the cop. Once he gets tased the cop says "quit resisting’. Easy to say, but hard to do with a zillion volts of electricity running through your body. ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/195 "2010-09-07T03:53:18Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > “Tackle”? Two men. Each man grabs an arm, and they frog-march him to the car. No-one gets hurt. > > They may have to exert a bit of physical effort, though, which may be too much for these two pussies. You’ve seen too many TV shows. I’ve done a number of arrests, usually with a partner, if they don’t mind the above will work. If they really don’t want to be handcuffed it’s a brutal and often bloody fight. A Taser is much less brutal than fighting someone into handcuffs. I wish I had one, less people would have been hurt. I’ve done even more restraints on mental patients (including sucidal ones)…probably 100 or more. They are generally worse in some ways, but at least on a psych floor they rarely had a weapon. It was harder because we couldn’t use any kind of weapon or pain motivation. For a mental patient we were supposed to have at least four people if at all possible TO PREVENT INJURY to the patient. Often we had 6 or more. Now this wasn’t because it took that many to restrain them, I could (and had to more than once) restrain most of the patients on my own. But the chances of injury increased dramaticaly. As for investigating. I don’t know about the department in question, but the trend now in training police (my sister among other things teaches at a police accadamy and I volunteer to be an arrest subject) to reduce liability is to eliminate as many judgment calls as possible on things like this. In other words, if the person says anything about suicide…the oficer is not qualified to say if it’s a joke so they take them to a hospital. If there are signs of domestic violence take the non injured party to jail, etc. Cops are not there to be shrinks. ---
**Author:** ![drachillix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/48db29/32.png) [@drachillix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drachillix)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/196 "2010-09-07T05:42:09Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Once he gets tased the cop says "quit resisting’. Easy to say, but hard to do with a zillion volts of electricity running through your body. If you watch carefully, he is still fighting between applications. No clicks = no electricity. In my book fighting with a cop = you probably do need a psych evaluation. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/197 "2010-09-07T17:54:08Z")
> [@drachillix](#): > > > [@gonzomax](#): > > > > Once he gets tased the cop says "quit resisting’. Easy to say, but hard to do with a zillion volts of electricity running through your body. > > If you watch carefully, he is still fighting between applications. No clicks = no electricity. In my book fighting with a cop = you probably do need a psych evaluation. He fought with the cop? When? Where? He stood up and got electrocuted. If he were going along peacefully with the cop, he would still have to stand up, which is what the cop was telling him to do. Did you honestly see a threat to he cop? All he had was training, health, size age, mace, nightstick, tasers and guns on his side. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/198 "2010-09-07T18:57:20Z")
> [@bdgr](#): > > > [@Alessan](#): > > > > “Tackle”? Two men. Each man grabs an arm, and they frog-march him to the car. No-one gets hurt. > > > > They may have to exert a bit of physical effort, though, which may be too much for these two pussies. > > You’ve seen too many TV shows. I’ve done a number of arrests, usually with a partner, if they don’t mind the above will work. If they really don’t want to be handcuffed it’s a brutal and often bloody fight. Which is why you grab the perp by the lapels and scream “hands behind your back, scumbag, or I’m gonna _rip 'em outta their sockets_!” And then your partner says “hey, easy, **bdgr**! I’ll handle this one.” And he leans in and whispers to the perp that he’d better do what you say, because you’re a loose cannon that’s gonna go off at any minute. And then the perp says “OK, OK, I’ll go… just keep that crazy cop away from me!” Of course, this approach only works if you work with a partner and the suspect has lapels. —_ **Vinyl Turnip** , who’s seen just the right number of TV shows_ ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/199 "2010-09-07T21:39:25Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > > [@bdgr](#): > > > > You’ve seen too many TV shows. I’ve done a number of arrests, usually with a partner, if they don’t mind the above will work. If they really don’t want to be handcuffed it’s a brutal and often bloody fight. > > Which is why you grab the perp by the lapels and scream “hands behind your back, scumbag, or I’m gonna _rip 'em outta their sockets_!” And then your partner says “hey, easy, **bdgr**! I’ll handle this one.” And he leans in and whispers to the perp that he’d better do what you say, because you’re a loose cannon that’s gonna go off at any minute. And then the perp says “OK, OK, I’ll go… just keep that crazy cop away from me!” Of course, this approach only works if you work with a partner and the suspect has lapels. > > —_ **Vinyl Turnip** , who’s seen just the right number of TV shows_ Damnit, they should have taught us that one. ---
**Author:** ![Honesty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f04885/32.png) [@Honesty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honesty)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359/200 "2010-09-08T00:25:31Z")
> [@drachillix](#): > > If you watch carefully, he is still fighting between applications. No clicks = no electricity. In my book fighting with a cop = you probably do need a psych evaluation. Where is he resisting after he was tasered? When you give a person a painful stimulus, the response is to move away from the painful stimulus. Here’s a [cartoon](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2f/Anatomy_and_physiology_of_animals_A_reflex_arc.jpg) demonstrating the effect. It’s not like the leads from a taser leave puncture wounds or anything. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yet-another-unjustified-tasering-by-idiot-cop/552359.md?page=11)