# Y'know, the word "conservative" is also demonizable **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [February 2, 2014, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365 "2014-02-02T18:51:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omg_a_Black_Conservative)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/21 "2014-02-05T16:10:24Z")
> [@lightnin'](#): > > this. Unlike conservatives, liberals don’t have a major network devoted entirely to demonizing the other side. > > I’m sure someone will immediately pop in and claim that all media outlets other than fox are biased towards liberals, to which i say bullshit. If you get far enough to the right, everything left isn’t biased- it’s merely everything to the left of you. msnbc? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/22 "2014-02-05T16:39:06Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > msnbc? Not quite comparable; Fox is all **about** demonization. ---
**Author:** ![Spiff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiff/32/9852_2.png) [@Spiff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiff)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/23 "2014-02-05T18:01:36Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > msnbc? Right on cue … ---
**Author:** ![Karrius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71c47a/32.png) [@Karrius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Karrius)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2014, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/24 "2014-02-05T18:30:19Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > msnbc? Do you remember that time MSNBC openly defended hate groups that call for the murder of others? Wait, no, sorry, that was Fox. My bad. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/25 "2014-02-06T03:09:54Z")
> [@Lightnin](#): > > This. Unlike conservatives, liberals don’t have a major network devoted entirely to demonizing the other side. The word “liberal” was demonized in the 70s and the 80s long, long before Fox News came around. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/26 "2014-02-06T03:21:58Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > But, if it did work, what would be the point anyway? The point would be to provide a margin of victory in elections to make it easier to enact progressive (or liberal if you prefer that term) legislation. To me the conservatives have a really appealing narrative about politics, which more or less goes as thus: “There are hard working, honest, talented, self disciplined real americans who can run their own lives efficiently and then there are lazy, irresponsible, fake americans who need someone else to solve their problems for them. The US is a zero sum game, and the government wants to increase the taxes on and decrease the standard of living of the real americans to lower the taxes of and increase the standard of living of the fake americans because they can’t run their own lives.” Fake and real in this context is largely a proxy for white, christian, hetero. If you read conservative opinion, that narrative comes up a lot. And it works. People love having their egos stroked (you are a real american, and unlike those fake americans you are smart enough to run your own life w/o someone else looking over your shoulder). The liberals need their own narrative. Too bad nobody cares what I think, because I’m awesome at this stuff. A good progressive narrative is: “Civilization is a perpetual attempt to make the social, legal, economic and political system as fair, inclusive, humane, safe and just as possible, or at the very least more of these things than it was before you got here. The more people who are included, and the more we value their contributions, the more we will advance as a society since we will have more talent to pull from. Some people want to make our society (the economic, political, legal, social systems) more inclusive, just and fair to improve quality of life and increase the talent pool, and some want to keep these systems as exclusive, unfair, unsafe, oppressive and unjust as they can because they have no respect for others who are not like them, or because they are oligarchs who are getting rich on the injustice (or apologists for the oligarchs)” Pretty much everything progressives believe in and that conservatives oppose fits within that narrative. And by ‘believe in’, I’m talking about historical progressive achievements as well as contemporary. Minimum wage laws, abolishing child labor, environmental protections, social security, medicare, medicaid, universal education, animal rights, human rights as part of foreign policy, women’s suffrage, anti-racism efforts, voting rights act, LGBT rights, law enforcement and prison reform, abolition of slavery, letting women make their own medical decisions (aka abortion), FDA inspections of food and medicine, etc. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/27 "2014-02-06T03:22:29Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > The word “liberal” was demonized in the 70s and the 80s long, long before Fox News came around. The '70s? Yes, come to think of it, it actually **does** go back that far. [And a bit farther.](http://www.cowboylyrics.com/lyrics/ochs-phil/love-me-im-a-liberal-11453.html)😉 ---
**Author:** ![typoink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@typoink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/typoink)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/28 "2014-02-06T04:21:29Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Pretty much everything progressives believe in and that conservatives oppose fits within that narrative. And by ‘believe in’, I’m talking about historical progressive achievements as well as contemporary. And, unfortunately, it’s kinda boring and a bit wishy-washy. It’s a good attempt, but making progressivism sound interesting and sexy really is a challenge. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/29 "2014-02-06T05:33:20Z")
> [@typoink](#): > > And, unfortunately, it’s kinda boring and a bit wishy-washy. It’s a good attempt, but making progressivism sound interesting and sexy really is a challenge. "A class war . . . is an ugly thing. **“And it’s about time we had one!”** ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 6:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/30 "2014-02-06T06:19:34Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > See post #15. I would disagree. I feel television and radio (and print) are still the dominant fora for generating public opinion. A lot more people may communicate via the internet but the opinions they’re passing on originated in the more traditional media. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/31 "2014-02-06T18:54:13Z")
I already use “conservative” as an insult in my personal life ---
**Author:** ![detop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bcef8e/32.png) [@detop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/detop)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/32 "2014-02-06T21:15:21Z")
Personnally, I prefer to refer to them as “vermin”. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2014, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/33 "2014-02-06T23:16:42Z")
> [@typoink](#): > > And, unfortunately, it’s kinda boring and a bit wishy-washy. It’s a good attempt, but making progressivism sound interesting and sexy really is a challenge. I think its a good moral framework to have. People can relate to the desire for equality and justice, and a disdain for an insular hierarchy. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/34 "2014-02-07T02:04:49Z")
Republican is certainly a bad word these days. Conservative not so much, mainly because Democrats rush to portray themselves as conservative come election time. If both parties see value in being conservative, then the public will obviously think conservative is awesome, especially the Democratic version of it. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/35 "2014-02-07T03:09:39Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Republican is certainly a bad word these days. Conservative not so much, mainly because Democrats rush to portray themselves as conservative come election time. > > If both parties see value in being conservative, then the public will obviously think conservative is awesome, especially the Democratic version of it. That is exactly what we need to **change.** ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/36 "2014-02-07T04:15:34Z")
Yeah, in polls about 40% call themselves conservative, another 40% moderate/independent and about 20% liberal. I’m sure demonization of the term (as well as the 60s/70s) had something to do with that. It seems conservatives are doing the job themselves of destroying their brand. People just need to latch onto that and make it worse. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/37 "2014-02-07T04:32:27Z")
Republicans are destroying their brand. Conservatism is doing fine. When conservatives say that Republicans fail because they are not conservative enough, Democrats unintentionally back them up by claiming that what Democrats are doing is actually conservative. So basically it becomes an argument over what conservatism is and who is doing it better. I think BrainGlutton is right that a better long term strategy would be to demonize the conservative label. Liberalism wasn’t discredited overnight, it took decades. But do Democrats play the long game, or do they just want to win the next election? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/38 "2014-02-07T05:11:59Z")
Since the Republicans are doing neither, what’s to stop the Dems from doing both? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/39 "2014-02-07T05:58:33Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Republicans are destroying their brand. Conservatism is doing fine. When conservatives say that Republicans fail because they are not conservative enough, Democrats unintentionally back them up by claiming that what Democrats are doing is actually conservative. So basically it becomes an argument over what conservatism is and who is doing it better. > > I think BrainGlutton is right that a better long term strategy would be to demonize the conservative label. Liberalism wasn’t discredited overnight, it took decades. But do Democrats play the long game, or do they just want to win the next election? In the long game the GOP dies out anyway. Demographics, not only ethnic but generational. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365/40 "2014-02-07T06:07:49Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Since the Republicans are doing neither, what’s to stop the Dems from doing both? Republicans aren’t doing squat, but conservatives have long been burnishing the conservative brand successfully even as Republicans have fallen out of favor. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yknow-the-word-conservative-is-also-demonizable/680365.md?page=3)