# You are forced to become either Hasidic or Amish. Which do you choose? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 11, 2011, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906 "2011-09-11T02:29:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2011, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/41 "2011-09-11T20:01:33Z")
Amish. I’d rather stay a Christian than become Jewish. Also, I’ve met Amish people and consider them very friendly (a bit odd, but they are good, friendly people). I can’t say that I’ve met many Hasidic people. Also, I have some (non-Jewish) German ancestry and so I’m not hugely far akin from the Amish, though I would have to learn the language. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2011, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/42 "2011-09-11T20:05:03Z")
> [@Tapiotar](#): > > …However, I’d start an underground women’s education circle, and smuggle in my vast library of books on almost all subjects. I don’t think the Amish deny girls an education. They don’t believe in higher education and being a high school dropout is perfectly fine with them, but they _do_ give everyone an education, right? ---
**Author:** ![Tapiotar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3be4f8/32.png) [@Tapiotar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapiotar)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2011, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/43 "2011-09-11T20:30:47Z")
> [@robert\_columbia](#): > > I don’t think the Amish deny girls an education. They don’t believe in higher education and being a high school dropout is perfectly fine with them, but they _do_ give everyone an education, right? A more varied and higher education, then. Way more varied. And subversive. ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2011, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/44 "2011-09-11T20:48:35Z")
Amish; much as I’m knee-deep in Judaic interests, w/ my Menno ideas I’m already halfway to Amish. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2011, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/45 "2011-09-11T21:50:51Z")
I like my modern toys, so I’m going with Hassidic without a second thought. Although **GilaB**'s post makes it a not that much better choice. By the way, a question I always wondered about and that would be relevant in my case : what do you do when you’re an Orthodox Jew and are essentially beardless (like in you’d be able to count the hairs in any beard you’d try to grow)? ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2011, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/46 "2011-09-11T22:00:31Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > Johanna: > > Do you mean snoods? Or turbans? I looked up the word for it: _[tichel](http://www.tznius.com/cgi-bin/tying.pl)_. I specifically like that look. Tichels easily win over bonnets, that’s for sure. The former looks very stylish, while it’s impossible for the latter to be made stylish. @Eve— LOL, that’s an astute detail, and oddly true. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2011, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/47 "2011-09-11T22:25:08Z")
I’m Jewish, but I’d still take the Amish. At least the Amish work for a living. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2011, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/48 "2011-09-11T22:53:01Z")
Way to stereotype, Alessan. ---
**Author:** ![No\_umlaut\_for\_U](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ea5d25/32.png) [@No\_umlaut\_for\_U](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/No_umlaut_for_U)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2011, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/49 "2011-09-11T23:59:11Z")
Amish, by a length. I’m a pacifist. I already know German, and I can sew. (Enjoy it? Not so much.) I learned an uncommon occupation that is very useful and valued in Amish communities. Propane, LNG, or 24 V power (Delco or Windcharger systems) are somewhat accepted technologies. There are cases where children with disabilities are allowed electricity for phototherapy, and motorized wheelchairs. Most modern medicine is OK, although not psychiatry. It seems like the lack of stress might help in that regard. I’d miss novels, radio, the Internet, and not much more. I can’t imagine my lack of deodorant would be noticed among all the cows and horses. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/50 "2011-09-12T00:03:48Z")
Just curious which one is more inbred. Because that would be another deciding factor. ---
**Author:** ![mac\_bolan00](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b3f665/32.png) [@mac\_bolan00](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mac_bolan00)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/51 "2011-09-12T00:28:25Z")
amish. better eating. and i don’t mind manual labor. ---
**Author:** ![Lasciel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e79b87/32.png) [@Lasciel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lasciel)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/52 "2011-09-12T00:31:36Z")
> [@](#): > > Imagine that you MUST choose between living the rest of your life as either a Hasidic Jew or an Amish person. And you truly have to be fully into the religion, following it to the strictest commonly-accepted terms as exists within those respective communities. > > Which do you choose? Per the terms of the OP, I would choose death. As a child-bearing-age female with no intentions to marry in a patriarchal marriage (or to have my current marriage become patriarchal), no intentions to ever bear children, and in possession of an active intellectual life, living in a community like either of those would be slow torture to death anyway. I have depression and social anxiety, and do not deal with stress well. It would cause less anguish to just kill myself outright and be done with it. Honestly. If I could choose one of the _less-restrictive_ representations of those two groups, I would have to do more research, but I’m tending towards Amish. Reasons: Cities are not good for me, even the strict Amish are less hung-up about genders mingling (and mingling with outsiders at all) and Amish are also a lot less sheltered from the world (learning English, actually attending normal schools to 8th grade at least, and they focus more on learning actual trades than on study of their religion. ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/53 "2011-09-12T00:32:07Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > Just curious which one is more inbred. Because that would be another deciding factor. Ooooh, that’s a tough one. In Amish communities there are [problems from consanguinity](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amish#Health), but those issues are being actively addressed by deliberate exogamy. In the Hasidic community, the attitude seems to be more fatalistic and when couples are found to have the genes for certain disorders (Tay-Sachs for example) in common they typically don’t refrain from reproducing. ---
**Author:** ![No\_umlaut\_for\_U](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ea5d25/32.png) [@No\_umlaut\_for\_U](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/No_umlaut_for_U)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/54 "2011-09-12T00:42:36Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > Just curious which one is more inbred. Because that would be another deciding factor. But you’d have shiny fresh DNA. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/55 "2011-09-12T00:48:24Z")
Nawth Chucka: > [@](#): > > In the Hasidic community, the attitude seems to be more fatalistic and when couples are found to have the genes for certain disorders (Tay-Sachs for example) in common they typically don’t refrain from reproducing. Fatalistic? Hardly. The Orthodox Jewish community (including Hasidim) is very active in trying to eradicate hereditary genetic disease from its population. There is an organization called [Dor Yeshorim](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dor_Yeshorim) which encourages genetic testing amongst teenagers before they reach marriagable age, and will, upon request, check if a boy-girl pair are both carriers of one of these diseases, preventing them from being set up before they ever even meet. Granted, options within the realm of Halakha are a bit more restricted once a couple goes ahead and gets married and/or pregnant without having availed themselves of this service. But on a community level, the attitude is pro-active, not fatalistic. ---
**Author:** ![StGermain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stgermain/32/2868_2.png) [@StGermain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StGermain)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/56 "2011-09-12T01:17:56Z")
Amish for me. I already have my 4 horses and pre-Civil War house. I’d miss the internet, but I had a life before it. I can’t sew worth a darn (ha!), but I can do animal husbandry and cooking, and I guess I’d learn to sew. For the record, I don’t think either culture treats women “badly”, both have specific gender-specific roles. You’re just as tied into your cultural role if you’re a man. StG ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/57 "2011-09-12T02:08:20Z")
> [@StGermain](#): > > Amish for me. I already have my 4 horses and pre-Civil War house. I’d miss the internet, but I had a life before it. I can’t sew worth a darn (ha!), but I can do animal husbandry and cooking, and I guess I’d learn to sew. > > For the record, I don’t think either culture treats women “badly”, both have specific gender-specific roles. You’re just as tied into your cultural role if you’re a man. > > StG I think relative to men, women in both cultures have a more proscribed role. They have more limited educational opportunities, no leadership role in the house or in the community, and their worth is more tied in what they do for their husbands and families than what they contribute to society. ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/58 "2011-09-12T02:11:56Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > Nawth Chucka: > > Fatalistic? Hardly. The Orthodox Jewish community (including Hasidim) is very active in trying to eradicate hereditary genetic disease from its population. There is an organization called [Dor Yeshorim](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dor_Yeshorim) which encourages genetic testing amongst teenagers before they reach marriagable age, and will, upon request, check if a boy-girl pair are both carriers of one of these diseases, preventing them from being set up before they ever even meet. > > Granted, options within the realm of Halakha are a bit more restricted once a couple goes ahead and gets married and/or pregnant without having availed themselves of this service. But on a community level, the attitude is pro-active, not fatalistic. I’m thinking of 2 instances, one was people I personally knew and the other was the [couple](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gavriel_Holtzberg)who were killed in the Mumbai attacks of 3 years ago. The couple I know learned he was a Crohn’s and colitis sufferer soon after engagement to a woman who was a known Crohn’s carrier (who’d lost a brother to it already); not only did they get married but have so far had 4 kids, expecting medical science to mitigate what ‘God may allow’. Fatalistic is MY impression of the attitude shown. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/59 "2011-09-12T03:00:17Z")
Yes, I have to admit that’s pretty fatalistic. As I said, I can’t speak for individuals, but on a communal level, the attitude is all about proactive prevention. ---
**Author:** ![Capitaine\_Zombie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e95f7d/32.png) [@Capitaine\_Zombie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capitaine_Zombie)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906/60 "2011-09-12T03:45:46Z")
Amish. you get to bone Kelly Mc Gillis and meet Harrison Ford. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-forced-to-become-either-hasidic-or-amish-which-do-you-choose/595906.md?page=4)