# You are not freaking E.E. Cummings. English usage exists for a REASON, damn it! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 16, 2008, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899 "2008-09-16T21:17:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/41 "2008-09-17T07:35:53Z")
I warmly support the OP’s position … except regarding ellipses. My impression is that the poster that **Skald** refers to is actually male pretending to be female. I think this poster believes that forgoing capitals, using odd spacing, and otherwise employing a faux-e.e.-cummings approach will make readers more likely to believe the poster is female. I can’t prove it. But my spidey sense tells me it is so. ---
**Author:** ![Euthanasiast](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Euthanasiast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euthanasiast)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 8:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/42 "2008-09-17T08:07:39Z")
> [@LurkMeister](#): > > I’ve always felt that it was better to be pissed off than to be pissed on. Some people look better wet. ---
**Author:** ![bufftabby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@bufftabby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bufftabby)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/43 "2008-09-17T17:33:27Z")
> [@Euthanasiast](#): > > Some people look better wet. [Kent Brockman]We’ll _all_ be taking golden showers tonight![/kb] ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/44 "2008-09-17T17:59:40Z")
> [@Hal\_Briston](#): > > I agree on all counts, except for the ellipses…you’ll never get me to abandon my precious tri-dots… Ditto. I am an ellipsist as well. They just looks so much more elegant than an em-dash … and funner to type too. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/45 "2008-09-17T18:22:59Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > God you must really hate my user name. I’m not sure why I avoided spaces or capitalization, I had been lurking long enough to know the (rather lax) limits of user names on this site. I make up for it by using impeccable\* English everywhere, including text messages. Please spare me from your purges of those who oppose you, almight Skald! > > \*I fully expect Gaudere to strike my post at any time Actually I like your user name. I’ve considered stealing for it myself, but I’d have to kill too many people for it to be worthwhile. ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/46 "2008-09-17T18:36:03Z")
> [@Q.E.D](#): > > Five years ago? Jeezus, let it go already. Wait, Miller changed his name? ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2008, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/47 "2008-09-18T15:08:31Z")
Are they essays or conversations. ? ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2008, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/48 "2008-09-18T16:13:45Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Nope. > > [consensus > General agreement, characterized by the absence of sustained opposition to substantial issues by any important part of the concerned interests and by a process that involves seeking to take into account the views of all parties concerned and to reconcile any conflicting arguments > NOTE Consensus need not imply unanimity](http://www.bsi-global.com/en/Standards-and-Publications/About-standards/Glossary/) I would argue that people say “general consensus” to be explicit about what constitutes “any important part of the concerned interests” in your definition. If someone says to me “the consensus was x,” without explicit context, I’m wondering who consented to x, and how explicitly. If they say “the general consensus was x,” I know that they mean “nobody detectably disagreed.” I think of it as less formal and more…general. Sailboat ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2008, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/49 "2008-09-18T16:24:53Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Somewhat less sadly, I point out that such luminaries as Anaamika & Aunt Beast are now guests. Since I somehow got dragged into this, I’ll say I automatically lose respect for anyone who doesn’t at least try. Yeah, I write casually and to my audience, but I still capitalize and make with the periods. Just because the Hindi language doesn’t use capitals doesn’t mean I should carry it over to English. What a strange thought. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2008, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/50 "2008-09-18T16:32:56Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Since I somehow got dragged into this, I’ll say I automatically lose respect for anyone who doesn’t at least try. Yeah, I write casually and to my audience, but I still capitalize and make with the periods. Just because the Hindi language doesn’t use capitals doesn’t mean I should carry it over to English. What a strange thought. I mentioned you and AB because you’re both prolific posters who are now guests, and with free posting it’s no longer easy to tell who’s a newbie and who isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2008, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/51 "2008-09-18T18:32:30Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Sadly, I must point out that the phrase “general consensus” is redundant. It’s as bad as “consensus of opinion.” So as an _added bonus_, you’ve given us _your personal opinion_? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![djf750](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ea666f/32.png) [@djf750](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/djf750)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2008, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/52 "2008-09-18T19:09:03Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > And that reason is to help the writer communicate his or her thesis. > > thread currently running in Great Debates has aroused this bit of ire. I’m reluctant to link to it, because it is not my intent to start a pile-on on the OP, and the OP is hardly the only person on the 'net who is guilty of these behaviors: > > \*abandoning capitals > \*hitting the enter key randomly rather than at the end of paragraphs > \*making not the slightest effort to compose entire sentences > \*using ellipses not to indicate excisions in quotations, but instead strewing them about as randomly as the enter key > > To everybody who does this: STOP! You don’t impress anyone with your typographic creativity. You make your text harder to read and harder to understand, and you annoy people who might be on your side. In short–stop being stupid. look at your second paragraph. “thread currently…” what the fuck? shouldn’t it be “The” thread…? worry about your own writing, barney fife, there are no rules about grammar and punctuation (or spelling). deal with it you sensitive flower ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2008, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/53 "2008-09-18T22:48:52Z")
iT c0ulD b33 wUrz ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2008, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/54 "2008-09-18T23:34:50Z")
> [@djf750](#): > > worry about your own writing, barney fife, there are no rules about grammar and punctuation (or spelling). There are no rules now? Sw33+!1! nw Comn catn N! claRiyt B3 wl sooo mpr0v3 mchly ! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![djf750](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ea666f/32.png) [@djf750](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/djf750)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2008, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/55 "2008-09-19T00:30:29Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > There are no rules now? Sw33+!1! nw Comn catn N! claRiyt B3 wl sooo mpr0v3 mchly > > ! > > 😃 exactly! ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2008, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/56 "2008-09-19T02:53:11Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > My rule is that, if someone writes me without capitals and little concern for grammar, I write them back without capitals and little concern for grammar. It’s all about knowing your audience. I generally don’t write them back at all. Unless I know them and their extenuating circumstances. But generally, I have found people who have that little concern for their own writing don’t have much worthwhile to say. ---
**Author:** ![Mellivora\_capensis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mellivora\_capensis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mellivora_capensis)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2008, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/57 "2008-09-19T08:50:56Z")
> [@teela\_brown](#): > > if a post contains more than one of the errors listed in your op, i lose interest and stop reading. Life’s too short to read bad writing. TWDR :d ---
**Author:** ![Mellivora\_capensis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mellivora\_capensis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mellivora_capensis)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2008, 9:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/58 "2008-09-19T09:03:54Z")
Apologies for the double post, but there’s a glitch somewhere. I didn’t alter **teela’s** post, I swear. I quoted and posted, and it appeared without caps. ?? ---
**Author:** ![djf750](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ea666f/32.png) [@djf750](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/djf750)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2008, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/59 "2008-09-19T14:43:21Z")
> [@Mellivora\_capensis](#): > > TWDR > > :d yes, life IS too short to read your crappy writing. are you too lazy to write “LIFE IS too short” instead of “LIFE’S” too short. you fucking barney fife, anal retentive, elitist pseudo intellectuals should focus more on what people are attempting to convey instead of looking down your noses at them. Especially when you are making errors in your own writing. that is for teela and all you morons who agree with him (her) who usually have no original thoughts so you nitpick. nitpick on a fucking internet message board. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2008, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899/60 "2008-09-19T15:18:30Z")
> [@djf750](#): > > look at your second paragraph. “thread currently…” > > what the fuck? shouldn’t it be “The” thread…? > > worry about your own writing, barney fife, there are no rules about grammar and punctuation (or spelling). > > deal with it you sensitive flower Oh, that’s just poor editing. My poor post-editing skills are legendary. Epic, even. An entire fit of the Poetica Edda is dedicated to them. (During a time-travel accident \*\*Fabulous Creature \*\*was doubtlessly responsible for, Weyland the Smith was spent several months posting on the Dope; he left enraged at yours truly.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-are-not-freaking-e-e-cummings-english-usage-exists-for-a-reason-damn-it/463899.md?page=4)