# You Beat your Dogs 2 Months Ago Because You’re Frustrated with Them, so You Adopt Another Dog **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 3, 2010, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041 "2010-08-03T19:39:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/41 "2010-08-04T16:06:49Z")
> [@astro](#): > > "Is punishing a dog physically an\* effective\* way to train it re correcting or reinforcing behavior? It depends on the philosophy of the trainer. Really. Some say physical methods are best - some say otherwise. For instance, the reference that I use for my doggie suggests that if he piddles on something that he’s not supposed to the correct method for disciplining him is to scold him in a loud voice by saying ‘NO’ repeatedly and then lock in him an isolated room with the article he soiled for up to 5 minutes. When my dog was a puppy I did this and it worked well. Ditto when he was misbehaving in other ways - he got a 5 minute timeout. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/42 "2010-08-04T16:09:37Z")
> [@PapSett](#): > > Just keep one thing in mind. It’s a damned good thing that I am in a much better state of mind than I was, because the kind of attack I just suffered is exactly the kind of thing that has pushed suicidal people over the edge, and yes, I have been suicidal. Wow. Did you just use suicide as a threat because you’re unhappy with the way people are responding to you on the internet? Thats, uh, not so good, yaknow? Seriously, take the 5th dog back and spend the $$ you would be spending on extra dog food and vet bills to talk to a professional. ---
**Author:** ![Gustav](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/919ad9/32.png) [@Gustav](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gustav)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/43 "2010-08-04T16:19:42Z")
I don’t understand this at all. You keep dogs for the company, you don’t enjoy dog-keeping or training as a hobby or anything, you just want the companionship. In fact, you’re really stressed out by the amount of work and attention involved in keeping them. What possible benefit could you gain from having 5 dogs that you can’t gain from having 4? I can only think of a hundred downsides. It’s really hard not to see this in terms of compulsive hoarding. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/44 "2010-08-04T16:20:20Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Guys, if I read the original thread correctly, **Papsett** said it happened once, not multiple times as you all seem to want to believe. Well if _I’m_ reading the original thread correctly, “one of the times” she “broke” and beat her dogs means it was more than once. > [@PapSett](#): > > When I said I “beat the holy hell” out of Kharma, it WAS an exaggeration, a HUGE one. Was all that about smacking your dogs because you’d lost your temper an exaggeration too? Even if you version of beating the crap out of, and losing your tempting and smacking are actually something more akin to a stern voice and gentle taps, why are you getting _more_ animals if what you currently have is causing you a great deal of stress and causing you to lose your temper? > [@](#): > > This is just one reason I like dogs a hell of a lot more than I do most of the human race. Yeah, humans don’t have to rely on you, or put up with your anger management problems. ---
**Author:** ![PapSett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ecc23a/32.png) [@PapSett](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PapSett)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/45 "2010-08-04T16:21:18Z")
Um… do you not know how to read either? I said I HAVE BEEN suicidal. Not now. Past that. And yeah, it’s my dogs that got me past it. As I said before, fuck y’all. I’m done here. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/46 "2010-08-04T16:23:28Z")
> [@PapSett](#): > > Is 5 dogs too many? Probably. Come to think of it, some jurisdictions require people with five dogs on the same property to legally declare said property a “kennel”. Might want to check into that if you haven’t already. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/47 "2010-08-04T16:27:32Z")
I want to be cruel, and I feel sorry for your **Pap** , I honestly do. I’m sure you care about your animals, and not to play junior shrink (this is the kind of necessary disclaimer right before you play junior shrink), but it seems like you rely on your animals too much for comfort, or to fill something missing in your life. This is not a good idea for one, but for another, I think you need to seriously reconsider adopting more animals when you, by your own admission, are under an incredible amount of stress, and are losing your temper with your pets. If not jumping on the squee train means I should go fuck myself, then fuck myself I shall. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/48 "2010-08-04T16:32:21Z")
> [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > > [@astro](#): > > > > Is harsh physical correction always an ineffective way to train a working animal? > > She doesn’t have a working animal, she has a pet. > > And using a shock collar on a dog when you’re training it in service is not the same as beating on it when you had a bad day at work and you want to take your frustrations out on something smaller than you. Like hell it’s not. My aunt had a rescue dog whose former owner tried to train her with a shock collar. When they first got her, she was extremely timid and terrified of men. (Including my uncle and my cousins) After a while, she managed to over come that and warmed up to everyone, but she still was extremely attached to my aunt, (to the point when my aunt had the flu and had to stay in bed for a week, she wouldn’t leave the bed, even to eat.) They suspect there were other ways she was “trained” as well. My dog has been “hit” exactly once. She started wrestling one of the cats and my mother had to smack her (lightly) on the rump in order to separate them. That was it. (The only real “abuse” she got was when our cat Noel used to beat up on her if she thought Lexie was picking on one of the cats. And yes, we had to separate them, my mother getting badly bitten in the process once.) The way we get her attention is to take a rolled up newspaper and smack it against a HARD SURFACE, or the PALM OF OUR HAND. That gets her attention. I also try growling back at her, and staring her down. **PapSett** , please, if this is how you react when your dog misbehaves, please, please get professional help. That’s not a good way to train an animal – and it’s also a sign that something is wrong. Please. For your own sake, and that of your dogs. ---
**Author:** ![BottledBlondJeanie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/0ea827/32.png) [@BottledBlondJeanie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BottledBlondJeanie)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/49 "2010-08-04T16:39:35Z")
I honestly wonder if **Papsett** would accept any comment on her new adoption, no matter how nice and qualified it was. Be mad, but please do something about your situation other than adopting another animal. ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/50 "2010-08-04T16:43:28Z")
**Papsett** , don’t take what they’re all saying too badly. I know- why don’t you adopt another dog? That should make you feel better. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/51 "2010-08-04T16:47:45Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Like hell it’s not. My aunt had a rescue dog whose former owner tried to train her with a shock collar. When they first got her, she was extremely timid and terrified of men. (Including my uncle and my cousins) After a while, she managed to over come that and warmed up to everyone, but she still was extremely attached to my aunt, (to the point when my aunt had the flu and had to stay in bed for a week, she wouldn’t leave the bed, even to eat.) They suspect there were other ways she was “trained” as well. Erm, this entire paragraph makes me think you don’t know what you’re talking about. Using a shock collar as a training tool may not be my cup of tea, but it’s not abusive. I’ve actually put a shock collar on my arm and felt the zing - it’s not dissimilar to a joy buzzer and for some dogs it really does make the difference between life and death. I former BF’s dad had a Jack Russel that had literally ripped it’s tail to shreds from chasing it. The dog had had surgeries on it’s tail, different therapies, doggie prozac, etc and nothing worked - the vet had recommended putting the dog to sleep due to infection in the tail. Dad got a shock collar, gave the dog a zing _ONCE_ when the tail chasing was starting and that was it. From that day forward no shocks were necessary - the dog got the message and left his tail alone. From your own post you admit you don’t know how your aunt’s animal was treated before it arrived with her - I have no doubt that the collar was not used properly in your aunt’s dog’s case, but that doesn’t mean under the right circumstances they can’t be a valuable tool to help some dogs. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/52 "2010-08-04T16:49:40Z")
> [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > **Papsett** , don’t take what they’re all saying too badly. I know- why don’t you adopt another dog? That should make you feel better. Oh no you didn’t… ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/53 "2010-08-04T16:51:57Z")
> [@PapSett](#): > > Um… do you not know how to read either? I said I HAVE BEEN suicidal. Not now. Past that. And yeah, it’s my dogs that got me past it. But why did you bring up being suicidal at all? You seem to be saying that it’s wrong to criticize (or “attack”) someone because if they’re depressed they might kill themselves. That comes off as emotionally manipulative–i.e, don’t contradict someone because if they kill themselves you could have blood on your hands. I don’t know you personally. But you have said that you’ve been through an extremely stressful time and that your dogs’ behavior contributed to your feeling that way. Four dogs (and some cats?) is a lot for anyone, even someone under the best of situations. Adding another dog to that situation just seems very strange. Can you see why someone might question that behavior? ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/54 "2010-08-04T16:52:36Z")
> [@PapSett](#): > > I was not going to respond to this but I will add one reply. Most of you all don’t deserve that much. You’re right- people who are afraid animals are being abused are totally below you, the one who is collecting dogs and beating them (oh, I apologize: tapping them on the butt gently three times as delicately as possible- amazing how that story changed). You keep touting your dog training prowess and if that’s not bullshit, then surely you can see why your dogs are acting up. C’mon. Seriously. They are under exercised because- as you even admit- you aren’t able to give them the time (busy work schedule) and adequate physical exertion that they require (your illness cuts into your ability to walk them). Back yard play time != focused exercise. If nothing else, why don’t you board your 5 dogs during the day while you’re at work with someone who can play with them and work them out as they need to be? Or hire a dog walker to come by twice a day and walk them, since you aren’t able? If you insist on having a menagerie, then treat them right. > [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > > [@PapSett](#): > > > > Just keep one thing in mind. It’s a damned good thing that I am in a much better state of mind than I was, because the kind of attack I just suffered is exactly the kind of thing that has pushed suicidal people over the edge, and yes, I have been suicidal. > > Wow. Did you just use suicide as a threat because you’re unhappy with the way people are responding to you on the internet? > > Thats, uh, not so good, yaknow? Seriously, take the 5th dog back and spend the $$ you would be spending on extra dog food and vet bills to talk to a professional. This. :rolleyes: > [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > **Papsett** , don’t take what they’re all saying too badly. I know- why don’t you adopt another dog? That should make you feel better. Oh, you. :p:D ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/55 "2010-08-04T16:55:42Z")
> [@PapSett](#): > > But now I am able to just say fuck y’all. Back atcha. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/56 "2010-08-04T17:00:18Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > But why did you bring up being suicidal at all? You seem to be saying that it’s wrong to criticize (or “attack”) someone because if they’re depressed they might kill themselves. That comes off as emotionally manipulative–i.e, don’t contradict someone because if they kill themselves you could have blood on your hands. This type of threat is also one of the hallmarks of someone with Borderline Personality Disorder, as is animal hoarding. Yes, I did just go there. No, I’m not qualified to diagnose people on the internet or anywhere else. Yes, I do think that **PapSett** would benefit from some very serious therapy which would potentially improve her relationships with other people as well as her dogs. No, I don’t think she’s a horrible person. Yes, I do think daily outings with a dog walker would go a long way to making her doggies a bit easier to handle. ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/57 "2010-08-04T17:02:25Z")
> [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > This type of threat is also one of the hallmarks of someone with Borderline Personality Disorder, as is animal hoarding. Yes, I did just go there. Oh man, this thread is about to get amazing. ---
**Author:** ![CrazyCatLady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@CrazyCatLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CrazyCatLady)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/58 "2010-08-04T17:06:41Z")
> [@astro](#): > > My question is - "Is punishing a dog physically an\* effective\* way to train it re correcting or reinforcing behavior? . Depends on the dog, just like whether or not spanking is effective depends on the kid. It would be total overkill with our Shepherd, because she’s the sort of dog that falls to the ground in a penitent heap if you say her name in a dismayed tone of voice. Our lab mix, otoh, is a lot more guilt-resistant and dominant and has gotten a fair few swats on the ass and/or head over the years. And yeah, I once gave her a much more thorough spanking than what PapSett gave her dog–I was trying to clean eye boogers off her face and she lifted a lip at me. We got it straight right then and there that acting as though biting me was an option was _not_ going to end well for her…and it’s never been an issue in the nearly 9 years since then. ---
**Author:** ![Sleeps\_With\_Butterflies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@Sleeps\_With\_Butterflies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sleeps_With_Butterflies)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/59 "2010-08-04T17:10:32Z")
> [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > This type of threat is also one of the hallmarks of someone with Borderline Personality Disorder, as is animal hoarding. Yes, I did just go there. No, I’m not qualified to diagnose people on the internet or anywhere else. Lucky for us you’re here doing it anyway. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2010, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041/60 "2010-08-04T17:16:36Z")
> [@CrazyCatLady](#): > > > [@astro](#): > > > > My question is - "Is punishing a dog physically an\* effective\* way to train it re correcting or reinforcing behavior? . > > Depends on the dog, just like whether or not spanking is effective depends on the kid. It would be total overkill with our Shepherd, because she’s the sort of dog that falls to the ground in a penitent heap if you say her name in a dismayed tone of voice. Our lab mix, otoh, is a lot more guilt-resistant and dominant and has gotten a fair few swats on the ass and/or head over the years. And yeah, I once gave her a much more thorough spanking than what PapSett gave her dog–I was trying to clean eye boogers off her face and she lifted a lip at me. We got it straight right then and there that acting as though biting me was an option was _not_ going to end well for her…and it’s never been an issue in the nearly 9 years since then. Thanks for the clear answer. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-beat-your-dogs-2-months-ago-because-you-re-frustrated-with-them-so-you-adopt-another-dog/549041.md?page=4)