# You Decide You Have to Leave Your Country. Where Do You Go and Why? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 31, 2025, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395 "2025-03-31T12:46:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/1 "2025-03-31T12:46:17Z")
Title says it all. Let’s not make this another Trump thread. Just assume, for some reason, you decide to GTFO. Where are you now, and what’s your choice? Assume that you have some mechanism to be let in. I’m a US citizen, living in the US. I’ve traveled pretty extensively, and for me it’s Germany. I like Germany a lot, and the general sense of how things are supposed to work appeals to me. I couldn’t live in a place that didn’t take “getting things done” seriously, and I couldn’t live in a place where you either wait six weeks to get your phone turned on, or you have to pay a bribe to get it done (I know nobody uses landlines anymore, but it’s just an example of what I’m talking about). I also couldn’t live in a place with utter disregard for traffic laws. Inspired by an aside in the thread > [@Yale professor who studies fascism fleeing US to work in Canada](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yale-professor-who-studies-fascism-fleeing-us-to-work-in-canada/1016299): > > Jason Stanley, who says grandmother fled Berlin with his father in 1939, says US may become ‘fascist dictatorship’ Jason Stanley, who wrote the 2018 book How Fascism Works: The Politics of Us and Them, has accepted a position at the University of Toronto’s Munk School of Global Affairs and Public Policy. Stanley [told the Daily Nous](https://dailynous.com/2025/03/25/stanley-from-yale-to-toronto/), a philosophy profession website, that he made the decision “to raise my kids in a country that is not tilting towards a fascist dictatorship”. He said in an in… ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/2 "2025-03-31T12:49:31Z")
I’m going to leave this open, but from pretty recently: [Americans living in the U.S.: what would make you take concrete action to expatriate yourself?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-living-in-the-u-s-what-would-make-you-take-concrete-action-to-expatriate-yourself/1014372) ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/3 "2025-03-31T12:56:20Z")
My heart says Italy but my head says France or Germany. Germany for pretty much the reasons outlined in the OP - I get the impression it’s a very ‘liveable’ place -, and France because it’s a very beautiful, very civilised, very tidy country with great infrastructure, a great approach to work/life balance and some lovely housing stock at pretty reasonable prices. I would need to learn immaculate French though. Italy will always be my first love, but getting anything practical done in a timely, professional, non-who-you-know manner can be a challenge. You can’t ever piss anyone off. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/4 "2025-03-31T13:04:56Z")
My sister is trying to get us all German citizenship, so that’s where I’m going if that works and I decide I have to leave. Second would be to buy my way into Portugal. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/5 "2025-03-31T13:32:53Z")
I would only leave Canada in the face of immanent or actual collapse due to US annexation efforts. Under those conditions, it seems to me the UK would be my best bet. I think they’d be more likely to accept Canadian refugees due to our shared heritage. ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/6 "2025-03-31T13:34:56Z")
My wife and I are kicking around the idea of retiring to Costa Rica or some similar beautiful, tropical place where our retirement dollars will stretch and we can forget that Michigan winters exist. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/7 "2025-03-31T13:36:34Z")
Magicking away immigration obstacles and language barriers: Spain, Portugal, New Zealand, Australia, some of the Caribbean islands. Given my IRL English-only limitations, it’s NZ or AU. There are plenty of other EU countries that are culturally attractive. But I will not live where it gets cold. As in below about 60F / 15C. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/8 "2025-03-31T13:41:38Z")
You Decide You Have To Leave Your Country, Only To Find Out That Most Countries Aren’t Interested In Having You Unless You’ve Got Lots Of Money Or A Particular In-Demand Skill Set. Most would-be expatriates haven’t considered the big picture. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/9 "2025-03-31T13:42:56Z")
**Moderating** : Given, but not the point of this thread. So lets drop it here. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/10 "2025-03-31T13:50:21Z")
My wife are trying to emigrate now. We have a lawyer. The first step is to get a tax id number so that we can purchase property there. We don’t need to have citizenship to do that. We have a plot of land identified and a contractor to build us a small home, but we can’t do business there until we have our tax id number. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/11 "2025-03-31T13:51:03Z")
Emigrate to where? ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/12 "2025-03-31T13:54:22Z")
Right now, I’d rather not say, but it’s a country that allows people to buy property on a tourist visa and is pretty easy to get a long term visa for retirees. Once I’ve purchased the land and started work I will feel comfortable posting more, I just don’t have the energy to defend my choice on the Dope right now, ---
**Author:** ![Chad\_Sudan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chad_sudan/32/4509_2.png) [@Chad\_Sudan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chad_Sudan)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/13 "2025-03-31T13:54:53Z")
American, living in the Baltics. From this visitor’s perspective, **the Netherlands** appears to be governed relatively well, and its history fascinates me. I presume there are hidden disadvantages to living there, but I’d love to give it a try. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/14 "2025-03-31T13:57:49Z")
Ok, fair enough. I realize that my response left out the why. Well, if I can get German citizenship, that would be easiest. I speak some German and have relatives there as well. If that path doesn’t work out, Portugal is my best bet for buying my way in, as far as I understand it. I haven’t researched what other countries would let us move there, without buying in, and I think Portugal is on the cheaper side for those Golden Visas. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/15 "2025-03-31T14:49:23Z")
It helps that my wife and I spent much of our adult lives living overseas. We were both foreign aid workers when that was a thing that Americans did and we speak a few languages between us (mostly her) and were comfortable dropping in to a country and setting up shop. ---
**Author:** ![MindsEye\_Watering](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mindseye_watering/32/3619_2.png) [@MindsEye\_Watering](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MindsEye_Watering)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/16 "2025-03-31T15:25:32Z")
Mrs. Watering has dual US/EU (Ireland) citizenship. If we had to go, it would be to Ireland. My understanding is that it would be fairly easy to gain my dual citizenship due to marriage, though I haven’t investigated this at all yet. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/17 "2025-03-31T16:43:26Z")
I believe I could get a British passport. Not that I want to live in England, but it would/might make living elsewhere in Europe much easier. But given my druthers, I’d head to SEAsia. I’ve travelled a lot there and I could comfortably hold up in any number of backwater places, quite easily. It would be simple enough to shift about country to country, and I have friends there. But in truth I don’t want to be an exile, ever. But these are strange times we live in! ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/18 "2025-03-31T19:53:12Z")
> I believe I could get a British passport. Not that I want to live in England, but it would/might make living elsewhere in Europe much easier. Not since Brexit, it wouldn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/19 "2025-03-31T19:54:56Z")
Tasmania, New Zealand, Australia-in that order. ---
**Author:** ![Ellecram](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellecram/32/18948_2.png) [@Ellecram](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellecram)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395/20 "2025-03-31T19:56:01Z")
Norway, Netherlands, Germany. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-decide-you-have-to-leave-your-country-where-do-you-go-and-why/1016395.md?page=2)