# You keep being wrong jezzaOZ. How 'bout acknowledging this fact? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 10, 2015, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329 "2015-04-10T14:03:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/1 "2015-04-10T14:03:30Z")
Being wrong is not a major offence here, to my knowledge. If it is, I’ve been guilty several times. Consistently being wrong is, but this post is not about that, or even about my impression about where between never wrong and always wrong jezzaOz is, it’s about how his(?) response to being wrong is consistently one of ignoring it. If you’re going to keep shooting from the hip and occasionally encouraging ignorance instead of fighting it, how about you start having the decency to acknowledge it? Changing the subject, like the example below, turns a forgivable mistake into evidence of either a lack of ability to explicitly admit errors, or the lack of ability to understand your errors. You could try the “it’s an implicit admission”-excuse, but you do it too frequently for that to be acceptable. > [@Should artwork be judged by the artist's person?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-artwork-be-judged-by-the-artists-person/717196/34): > > It’s only a Nazi propaganda film because their team lost. > [@Should artwork be judged by the artist's person?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-artwork-be-judged-by-the-artists-person/717196/35): > > No, it’s a Nazi propaganda film because it’s a propaganda film. Made for the Nazis. Them winning wouldn’t have changed that. > [@Should artwork be judged by the artist's person?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-artwork-be-judged-by-the-artists-person/717196/38): > > Show me any US or UK propaganda film that even begins match the technical and artistic quality. > > They were just as much propaganda but not nearly as good. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/2 "2015-04-10T14:43:00Z")
[This](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=753966) is the thread. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/3 "2015-04-10T15:35:03Z")
> [@BlankSlate](#): > > [This](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=753966) is the thread. Or you could just click the links in any one of the quotes … ---
**Author:** ![Rhythmdvl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/4 "2015-04-10T15:42:25Z")
> [@BlankSlate](#): > > [This](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=753966) is the thread. Thanks. Though there are direct links to posts in the OP, it’s good form (and appreciated) to also link to the thread. The post-links are good, but typically start in the middle of a conversation. The TL link usually allows a quick overview of the original question and a quick scroll gives the context to the quoted posts. About the Pit, it seems that it’s not wrong per se but that you’re arguing past each other. I think the point of arguing past each other would be easier to change from Nazi films to Big Roman Monuments. “raping and pillaging aside, the artwork on these monuments is really good.” “But raping and pillaging!” Especially in the context of the thread, they both make sense and insisting on ‘wrong’ is kind of silly. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/5 "2015-04-10T15:51:33Z")
This is pretty weak sauce. Yes, you’re right. Yes, **jezzaOZ** is wrong. But it was not exactly a hostile and confrontational exchange in the first place. Why not try to explain that the word propaganda need not apply only to the artistic and publicity efforts of the losing side, and that British and American wartime posters and films were also propaganda designed to rally the population to the wartime cause. As **Telemark** suggested in the other thread, the fact of winning wouldn’t have made Riefenstahl 's films any less propaganda, and the fact that the Allies won the war does not alter the fact that the American “Why We Fight” films were propaganda. Edit: **MrDibble** , in post #48 of the other thread, made a similar point. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/6 "2015-04-10T16:23:42Z")
> [@naita](#): > > Or you could just click the links in any one of the quotes … Just admit you’re wrong and do it the way rhythmdvl says. ---
**Author:** ![fachverwirrt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@fachverwirrt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fachverwirrt)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/7 "2015-04-10T16:45:17Z")
I hate admitting I’m wrong. That’s why I’m never wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/8 "2015-04-10T17:44:57Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > As **Telemark** suggested in the other thread, the fact of winning wouldn’t have made Riefenstahl 's films any less propaganda, and the fact that the Allies won the war does not alter the fact that the American “Why We Fight” films were propaganda. I did post in that thread, but I didn’t post what you’re referencing here. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/9 "2015-04-10T17:56:48Z")
> [@Rhythmdvl](#): > > Thanks. Though there are direct links to posts in the OP, it’s good form (and appreciated) to also link to the thread. The post-links are good, but typically start in the middle of a conversation. The TL link usually allows a quick overview of the original question and a quick scroll gives the context to the quoted posts. I might remember to include a link to the thread start another time. Personally I find it more natural to go to the quoted place and scroll up and down as needed to get context. But it’s simple enough. > [@](#): > > About the Pit, it seems that it’s not wrong per se but that you’re arguing past each other. I think the point of arguing past each other would be easier to change from Nazi films to Big Roman Monuments. “raping and pillaging aside, the artwork on these monuments is really good.” “But raping and pillaging!” Especially in the context of the thread, they both make sense and insisting on ‘wrong’ is kind of silly. I’m not pitting any argument related to my participation in the thread and your suggestion is irrelevant to the point I sought to make with these quotes. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/10 "2015-04-10T18:06:09Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > This is pretty weak sauce. Weak pittings are my forte. Get’s the subject off my chest without having to go all obsessive, read lots of all posts and properly document the pattern that annoys me. > [@](#): > > Yes, you’re right. Yes, **jezzaOZ** is wrong. But it was not exactly a hostile and confrontational exchange in the first place. > > Why not try to explain that the word propaganda need not apply only to the artistic and publicity efforts of the losing side, and that British and American wartime posters and films were also propaganda designed to rally the population to the wartime cause. For one thing it wasn’t my sub-conversation in the first place. And secondly well I already described my interpretation of **jezzaOZ** ’s quoted reply. No one said Riefenstahl’s films weren’t good, or that allied propaganda was, or that the Allies didn’t produce propaganda. > [@](#): > > As **Telemark** suggested in the other thread, the fact of winning wouldn’t have made Riefenstahl 's films any less propaganda, and the fact that the Allies won the war does not alter the fact that the American “Why We Fight” films were propaganda. > > Edit: **MrDibble** , in post #48 of the other thread, made a similar point. Which is appropriate, since he’s the one jezzaOz responded to. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/11 "2015-04-10T18:07:33Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Just admit you’re wrong and do it the way rhythmdvl says. Yes, I was wrong. I’ll never post quotes without a complete set of appropriate links again. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/12 "2015-04-10T18:44:26Z")
More gems: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=18257268#post18257268](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=18257268#post18257268) [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=18245134#post18245134](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=18245134#post18245134) [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=18246343#post18246343](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=18246343#post18246343) ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/13 "2015-04-10T19:03:18Z")
A big lump of coal from him here: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18269362&postcount=3](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18269362&postcount=3) Yep, he even denies the most **confirmed** basics of the greenhhouse effect, not even sceptical scientists fall for that nonsense. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/14 "2015-04-10T21:29:38Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > More gems: > > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=18257268#post18257268](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=18257268#post18257268) > > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=18245134#post18245134](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=18245134#post18245134) > > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=18246343#post18246343](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=18246343#post18246343) I knew someone would do the looking for me. Move the goal posts, change the subject or just leave the conversation … Nice pattern. I like this place for all the people who, like I aspire to, enjoy fighting their own ignorance as well as others. ---
**Author:** ![get\_lives](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecb155/32.png) [@get\_lives](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/get_lives)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/15 "2015-04-10T22:32:53Z")
Perhaps Jezza feels the most honorable thing to do is shut up when proven wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Ranger\_Jeff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranger_jeff/32/2065_2.png) [@Ranger\_Jeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranger_Jeff)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2015, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/16 "2015-04-10T23:23:52Z")
Ah, John Lennon wasn’t much of a husband to Cynthia or father to Julian. Paul McCartney is said to have left behind him quite a few illegitimate children and certainly wasn’t faithful to Jane Asher. But they wrote some great songs and recorded some great music. ---
**Author:** ![Nanoda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ce73a5/32.png) [@Nanoda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanoda)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2015, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/17 "2015-04-11T02:05:03Z")
> [@fachverwirrt](#): > > I hate admitting I’m wrong. That’s why I’m never wrong. I thought I was wrong once, but I was mistaken. ---
**Author:** ![Stringbean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Stringbean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringbean)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2015, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/18 "2015-04-11T06:09:41Z")
**jezza** does provide cites for the arguments he presents, though from the outside looking in those arguments seemingly always fall flat. I have a sordid respect for that. ---
**Author:** ![Mince](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@Mince](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mince)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2015, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/19 "2015-04-11T09:20:37Z")
Oh what a plain, simple, idealistic, dreamy, hopeful, utopian, naive, belief that people actually admit they’re wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Mince](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@Mince](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mince)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2015, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329/20 "2015-04-11T09:28:42Z")
> [@Nanoda](#): > > I thought I was wrong once, but I was mistaken. I thought I’ve heard this once or twice. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-keep-being-wrong-jezzaoz-how-bout-acknowledging-this-fact/717329.md?page=2)