"You know, that's handicapped parking spot!"

The BBQ Pit
341

That’s rather wishful thinking. I’m in CA and just an hour ago a guy entering the freeway hit the shoulder, cut me off in the right hand lane and cut the guy off in the lane left of me in one smooth motion (and a cloud of dust).

I yearn for the day with 360 degree vehicle cameras and the ability to sign and send the video of stuff like that to the police.

I’d absolutely use them in the current situation as well. There’s just too many people that think that if someone else can use their discretion to park in a reserved handicapped spot, they too “need” to park there “for just a minute”.

Back in the day I used to have to deliver 70-80 pound CRT displays and printers and I never parked in handicapped zones. And trust me, parking in Santa Monica is a real challenge and they enforce parking zones with zeal.

342

And thus the problem. No matter how “swift” you may be, you are still wrongly depriving someone of using a space that may be the only space that works for them. Not all handicapped spaces are made equally. Not all are van accessible, some are closest to ramps, some allow extra space on the passenger side.

You cannot possibly predict who may need that space for the 10-15 minutes you illegally occupy it. You do not need that space, you want it, but you are not entitled to it. If you honestly, after several hundred posts, cannot understand why yes, you were wrong, and will be wrong when you inevitably, selfishly, do this again, then you need to ask a mod to close the thread, because there’s no point in continuing to shout at the wall of brick that is your head.

343

Eonwe did note in post 239 that he should, indeed, find a dolly. Pretty much conceded or caved, and was pretty cool about it, considering the weight of the opposition.

Resolved?

344

Well the thread seems to still be going? I’m waiting to hear when Eonwe’s trail date for his crimes against humanity. If he gets stuck with a jury of his peers from the Straight Dope I’d expect nothing less then life imprisonment and that’s getting off easy only because the death penalty polls poorly on the Dope.

345

yeah, that’s why I said he “should” be safe. We do seem to have more than our share of suicidal drivers.

Oh hell, I yearn for the day when I can have a laser cannon mounted on the top of my car! :smiley:

346

That’s a little melodramatic. I mean, as far as I remember reading, the strongest actual sentence proposed was “having his car bulldozed out of the parking space by a handicapped person who needs it (in the event that ever happens)”.

I mean, it was my suggestion, so I’m partial to it.

347

I would settle for a $500 - $1500 fine, like most parking ordinances would require, but to be paid to The Dope since the local police proved incompetent in this crime spree and moral teaching opportunity.

Maybe we can have a pizza party with it. Just pick a place with plenty of street parking there are some real assholes around here.

348

There’s an important distinction here… there’s no guarantee that he’s depriving anyone of anything. He’s POSSIBLY depriving someone of something. That’s important in the pros-vs-cons weighing of his action. The likelihood that a handicapped person will show up in the time that he’s unloading is low. The likelihood that they’ll only be able to park in the precise spot he parked in is lower still.

There’s also a big difference, to me, between a 2-3 minute time frame, particularly one where he’s never straying further from his car than to right inside a nearby visible door, and a 10-15 minute time frame.

The point I’m trying to make is that I don’t see it as an absolute… “anyone who parks in any handicapped space ever who is not handicapped is always being a thoughtless entitled insensitive asshole, always, period paragraph end of story”. I don’t think it’s that simple. Which is obviously a dangerous argument to make, because the moment you open the door to exceptions, entitled assholes (who do exist) (even if the OP isn’t one) (although of course he might be one) will assume the exceptions all apply to them. Which is why the law really can’t have exceptions. But morally, ethically, an action is weighed not by whether it breaks the rules (although that isn’t totally irrelevant), but by the actual predictable outcomes it is likely to have. Which means subjectivity comes into play, and I see many mitigating circumstances in the OP which lead me to believe that his action was not particularly damnable.

349

Heh heh - you said number one and number two lanes. :smiley:

350

In my imaginery perfect world, Eonwe pulls into aforementioned handy-spot and leans in to pull out his cumbersome keyboard. Straightens his virile back and spies another keyboardist, just 15 feet away, wheelchair bound, struggling to pull out his cumbersome keyboard.

Their eyes meet. Slowly, each turns his face slightly to the right, to better assess his doppelganger. Each lifts the left eyebrow. “Hmmm… I wonder if he’s any good” each thinks to himself. Then… spell broken, **Eonwe **saunters into the bucket o’ blood and sets up his kit. Satisfied with his efforts, Eonwe charges out to move his car quickly before a more deserving person arrives and finds the spot occupied by a musician.

Only to find the ramp blocked by the wheelchair bound competition struggling to fit a 4 foot wide keyboard through a 36" door.

Left eyebrows arch as each regards the other. The competition considers hobbling Eonwe with his own keyboard stand. Then, as a rainbow forms overhead (double!!) Eonwe lowers himself to one knee, full of contrition, and reaches to assist with the musical burden. But alas! Two bluebirds bearing ribbon beat him to the punch, and busily tote the keyboard indoors whilst whistling tunes of merriment.

**Eonwe **realizes the error of his parking ways, and reaches inside his vehicle, unloosing the parking break. Appreciating the full spectrum of his motility, Eonwe rounds the front of his car, places a strong, capable foot upon his bumper, and shoves with all his vigorous might, rolling his errant vehicle down hill to a deserved fate. As it sinks into the bay, the bubbles sound like absolution.

Scapegoat properly sacrificed and feeling properly chastened, Eonwe looks on as his ride sinks into the bay. He turns, gazes up the handicapped ramp he realizes he will never Biblically know again, and finds it blocked by his adversary, who is having a ciggy and chatting on his celly while smugly nodding self-righteous approval.

Call ended, the Adversary calls out in a concillitory fashion: “Smooth move, Handtruck. We should talk shop. Can I buy you a beer?”

And that, my dear reader, is how Eonwe earned his nickname.

351

Well, it is illegal period paragraph end of story. And I’m the sort of person who never breaks the law, or tells himself it’s OK because I need to… and if you are the sort of person who breaks a just and reasonable law when it’s convenient, then yeah. There’s a line, and you’re on the other side of it.

352

God damn it. Even in defending him you can’t be straight and just say, 'yes, it’s illegal". Unbelievable.

353

So? Given that he is doing it over and over, the likelihood that he is going to use a spot that a handicapped person needed rises with each time he does it. Remember, the number of spots are based on the percent of handicapped in the population.

The OP really has no way of knowing how many handicapped people he may have prevented from parking. For example, I ran errands today, to five different places. In three of those places, the handicapped spots were all taken and because the cars were parked nose in, I would have no idea if they were there legally unless they happened to have a handicapped license plate, because I don’t stop my car, haul myself out and around to look at the front. Shoot, I don’t even bother to look as I am passing them on the way into the store/whatever I guess because the enforcement is good enough here that it is rare for someone to decide they are important enough to use up a spot they don’t need.

Heh, many times that is exactly what those lanes are! :smack:

354

You’re totally misinterpreting. I’m just trying to say that I’m not sure whether it’s violating a LAW or a (just) a school ordinance… not that it’s in any way not a violation of the parking code because of (any extenuating circumstances). There was some discussion upthread about whether it was police or private property owners who enforce parking and that’s all I’m talking about.

355

OK, point taken except in your hypothetical you were talking about your place of work not his school. There’s just a lot of hedging going on in this thread.

If one is illegal so is the other. You might be decreasing the odds of inconveniencing a handicapped person by staying 3 minutes instead of 15 but if there is a non-handicapped spot available 15 feet away, they’re both wrong, IMHO.

356

It should be enforced by the police but budgetary concerns, violent crime, etc. tend to make it easy to get away with.

It looks like a lot of communities are ‘deputizing’ citizen volunteers to help enforce the code. So beware - that self-righteous bitch might have the legal authority to slap a ticket on you herself next time.

Plano Police Get Help Enforcing Handicapped Parking Laws
Handicapped Parking Enforced By Volunteers
Enforcing Disabled Parking A Success for Ponte Vedra Beach

357

Disabled parking is governed by the Americans with Disabilities Act (federal law) but enforcement is left up to the individual states. In Vermont (where the OP lives) you will find:

I haven’t found the specific legislation. Waste of my time to try because the OP can’t see past the end of his nose on this anyway.

In my state it’s a $250 fine if you don’t have a disabled placard or license plate. They seem to take this rather seriously because the state also issues a personal disabled ID card. The vehicle placard has to match against the authorized person. So if you were to park in a disabled parking spot (with the vehicle placard) but the disability exemption was not issued to you (or you are not an authorized caregiver driver for a disabled person) you could be fined as well.

358

True. And (other than complaining about the woman), the thing I find most worthy of condemnation about the OP’s actions is that he seems to do this as a matter of course.

I just feel that the absoluteness of the judgment handed down by so many dopers was an overreach. Parking in a handicapped spot when not handicapped is not in and of itself conclusive proof of irredeemable assholery.

359

Jesus fucking christ, of course there will be an exception like I was having a heart attack while driving a van load of preschool kids and needed a safe open parking place ASAP.

But other than a gigantic stretch of the imagination, it *is *irredeemable assholery. The self righteous assholes always think they are privledged and it never inconveniences someone who is legally handicapped and entitled to park in such places. And of course they never ever consider what “inconvenience” means to someone handicapped.

360

Only a SDMB rabid BBQ pit pile on could make me seriously dislike handicapped people and their supporters (of which I am one).

THE SDMB, where the impossible happens…