# You say "da Vinci," I say "Leonardo"
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [June 21, 2005, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266 "2005-06-21T23:03:07Z")
**Posts on this page:** 15
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@KlondikeGeoff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KlondikeGeoff)
#### Post date: [June 21, 2005, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/1 "2005-06-21T23:03:07Z")
I was always under the impression that the artist’s name was “Leonardo” and that “da Vinci” meant he came from Vinci near Florence, and that was not his last name. Therefore, calling him “da Vinci,” as everybody seems to do now, is not correct. Is this true, or am I wrong?
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### Author:  [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)
#### Post date: [June 21, 2005, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/2 "2005-06-21T23:29:33Z")
Sure, except what is a surname anyway? Is there really any difference between calling him Mr DaVinci and calling someone else, say, Mr Dupont? Surnames came into being from trade, place, behaviour descriptors, so why not include DaVinci in that?
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### Author:  [@Quasimodem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quasimodem)
#### Post date: [June 21, 2005, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/3 "2005-06-21T23:32:49Z")
You are correct, sir!
As I understand it, “Da Vinci” means he _came_ from there, and _not_ that this was his last name!
Calling him “Da Vinci” is just wrong. He deserves to be called Leonardo just as Galileo deserves to be called by _that_ name and Michaelangelo and Cher derserve their first names!
Well, maybe not Cher
You wouldn’t call me “from Dallas, Geogia”, wouldya? 😃
Quasi
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### Author:  [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)
#### Post date: [June 21, 2005, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/4 "2005-06-21T23:41:04Z")
> [@Quasimodem](#):
>
> As I understand it, “Da Vinci” means he _came_ from there, and _not_ that this was his last name!
If it’s the only way to identify him without confusion, then why not stick with ‘Da Vinci’? It’s hardly as if his mother is going to complain. If it’s the commonly-used phrase, and there’s no other common option, then go with the inaccurate one. Nobody is forcing you to permanently identify your collection along those lines.
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### Author:  [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)
#### Post date: [June 21, 2005, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/5 "2005-06-21T23:43:57Z")
His father was Ser Piero da Vinci
(from Wikipedia)
> [@](#):
>
> As he was born before modern naming conventions developed in Europe, his full name was “Leonardo di ser Piero da Vinci”, which means “Leonardo, son of Mister Piero, from Vinci”. Leonardo himself simply signed his works “Leonardo” or “Io, Leonardo” (“I, Leonardo”). Most authorities therefore refer to his works as “Leonardos”, not “da Vincis”. Presumably he did not use his father’s name because of his illegitimate status.
Anyone know when the modern naming convention started in Europe?
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### Author:  [@pinkfreud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkfreud)
#### Post date: [June 21, 2005, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/6 "2005-06-21T23:45:27Z")
These days, if you just say “Leonardo,” a lot of folks will think you mean Leonardo DiCaprio.
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### Author:  [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)
#### Post date: [June 21, 2005, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/7 "2005-06-21T23:52:18Z")
> [@pinkfreud](#):
>
> These days, if you just say “Leonardo,” a lot of folks will think you mean Leonardo DiCaprio.
Or the mutant ninja turtle.
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### Author:  [@Jake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jake)
#### Post date: [June 21, 2005, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/8 "2005-06-21T23:52:58Z")
> [@Quasimodem](#):
>
> You are correct, sir!
>
> As I understand it, “Da Vinci” means he _came_ from there, and _not_ that this was his last name!
>
> Calling him “Da Vinci” is just wrong. He deserves to be called Leonardo just as Galileo deserves to be called by _that_ name and Michaelangelo and Cher derserve their first names!
>
> Well, maybe not Cher
>
> You wouldn’t call me “from Dallas, Geogia”, wouldya? 😃
>
> Quasi
Yep. Galileo is the proper title. I’ve read this but please don’t ask me for a cite.
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### Author:  [@bonzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bonzer)
#### Post date: [June 22, 2005, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/9 "2005-06-22T00:36:18Z")
[An old thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=159054) discussing such conventions, with particular emphasis on Leonardo and Galileo.
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### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [June 22, 2005, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/10 "2005-06-22T00:39:39Z")
Quick! Recall all those books and change the title!!!
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### Author:  [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)
#### Post date: [June 22, 2005, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/11 "2005-06-22T01:56:55Z")
I’d say Leonardo is his main name. Calling him Da Vinci is approximately the equivalent of referring to Alexander as Mr Great.
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### Author:  [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)
#### Post date: [June 22, 2005, 9:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/12 "2005-06-22T09:01:34Z")
I disagree; I think _not_ calling him Da Vinci is approximately equivalent to calling John Smith, “John, descendant of a metalworker”
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### Author:  [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)
#### Post date: [June 22, 2005, 9:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/13 "2005-06-22T09:05:03Z")
> [@Mangetout](#):
>
> I disagree; I think _not_ calling him Da Vinci is approximately equivalent to calling John Smith, “John, descendant of a metalworker”
John, claims he’s a smith but he’s really an accountant?
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### Author:  [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)
#### Post date: [June 22, 2005, 9:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/14 "2005-06-22T09:06:44Z")
Where did the “Shouldn’t that be” that I’d planned to put in there go?
Preview is for fraidycats.
Good think I am one though, or the number of typos in this post would be much larger.
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### Author:  [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)
#### Post date: [June 22, 2005, 9:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-da-vinci-i-say-leonardo/309266/15 "2005-06-22T09:58:39Z")
> [@Bippy the Beardless](#):
>
> His father was Ser Piero da Vinci
>
> (from Wikipedia)
> Anyone know when the modern naming convention started in Europe?
It varied a lot depending on the country…