# You say you want a revoluuuution **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 7, 2017, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698 "2017-07-07T15:23:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2017, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/21 "2017-07-08T21:20:54Z")
Sorry. I’m busy that day. Gotta wash one of the dogs. Nice “No!” pussy hat. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2017, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/22 "2017-07-08T22:09:18Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > Fascists want the state to be run by the military. > > Trump would never support that. It takes attention away from him. Unless it came with a really really fancy uniform, a title and a cult of personality. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2017, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/23 "2017-07-09T14:54:41Z")
Speaking of really really fancy uniforms, check out the snappy garb these Refuse Fascism protestors are wearing (scroll down for the video). > **[July 15 Trump/Pence Must GO! Organizers Kit](https://refusefascism.org/2017/06/30/july-15-nationwide-demonstrations-organizers-kit/)** > > Dear organizer(s), > As RefuseFascism.org's Call to Action states: "The Trump/Pence Regime is a Fascist Regime.  Not insult or exaggeration, this is what it is.  For the future of humanity and the planet, we, the people, must drive this... Now, if they can generate millions of protestors around the country on July 15th, that could have some impact. Four people in robes and wigs on a subway platform, not so much. I don’t see who the [del]ringleaders[/del] organizers of Refuse Fascism are, but their speakers sound like a cross section of America, including: Andy Zee, PZ Myers, Carl Dix, Jeremy Scahill, Imam Ayub Abdul-Baki, Rev. Doris Johnson, Sunsara Taylor, Immortal Technique, and Fran Luck. In that group I only recognized PZ Myers (an atheist biologist), but the others are probably household names, just in other households. March to repel the Fascists! (at least until the cold weather arrives). ---
**Author:** ![igor\_frankensteen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/839c29/32.png) [@igor\_frankensteen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/igor_frankensteen)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2017, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/24 "2017-07-09T15:08:48Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > I’m not “alarmed” by it–I’m pitting it. I’m pitting the idiots who think a legally and fairly elected president is “illegitimate”, and that a mass populist insurrection to overthrow that legally and fairly elected president would not be the death knell of American democracy. Did you oppose the Republicans repeated attempts to do exactly the same thing to Clinton and Obama? Or were you pleased about THEM trying to overturn a “legal and fairly elected President” as well? ``` Why weren't the GOP's efforts to defeat democratic processes "a death knell to American democracy"? ``` ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2017, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/25 "2017-07-09T16:00:19Z")
“Mourning in America” ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2017, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/26 "2017-07-09T18:02:09Z")
What’s difficult is that the CIC is not a madman. He’s a moron. etc. etc. etc… I support those that want him out of office. Protests are great, but I doubt they will do anything more to his base than to lock and load. But gotta start somewhere. enipl ~ Armed liberal/moderate. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2017, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/27 "2017-07-09T19:07:28Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > I’m not “alarmed” by it–I’m pitting it. I’m pitting the idiots who think a legally and fairly elected president is “illegitimate”, and that a mass populist insurrection to overthrow that legally and fairly elected president would not be the death knell of American democracy. Assuming for the moment that he’s “legitimate,” I still want the bastard gone asap. If the resistance can help accomplish that through peaceful protests, our democracy will be fine. Even prosper. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2017, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/28 "2017-07-09T19:29:13Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > I’m not “alarmed” by it–I’m pitting it. I’m pitting the idiots who think a legally and fairly elected president is “illegitimate”, and that a mass populist insurrection to overthrow that legally and fairly elected president would not be the death knell of American democracy. Trump is not fit to shovel shit from one place to another. The sooner you accept that, the sooner we can actually put someone competent to work actually making America great again. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/74df32/32.png) [@The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Devil_s_Grandmother)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2017, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/29 "2017-07-09T19:30:42Z")
> [@snoe](#): > > This thread title chaps my hide. Lennon very clearly sings “you say you want a revoolutiooon.” C’mon, man, get it right. > > (Low energy nutpicking – SAD!) That’s because he’s [talkin’ about a revolution](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2wneBVssPc), Grandpa. Poor people are gonna rise up and take their share. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2017, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/30 "2017-07-09T21:22:48Z")
> [@igor\_frankensteen](#): > > Did you oppose the Republicans repeated attempts to do exactly the same thing to Clinton and Obama? Or were you pleased about THEM trying to overturn a “legal and fairly elected President” as well? > > ``` > Why weren't the GOP's efforts to defeat democratic processes "a death knell to American democracy"? > > ``` How exactly did they do that? If you mean the “birther” bullshit, it really was just that- bullshit, in the not-even-a-lie sense that Harry G. Frankfurt defined it. No majority was going to take seriously a claim that Obama wasn’t constitutionally eligible to serve as president. At most it perpetuated the mythology that an evil conspiracy had hijacked the republic; and that was mostly just a rallying point for the political equivalent of creationists and moon hoaxers. Useful idiots iow. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2017, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/31 "2017-07-09T21:44:37Z")
Only when Reagan seized upon Springsteen’s _Born in the USA_ was a popular song more thoroughly misunderstood and misused. As regards revolutionary ardor, it is one long sneer! ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2017, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/32 "2017-07-10T06:15:36Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Because populist revolutions against elected governments tend to turn out _so_ well. Sometimes it beats letting the elected government run wild. And if not a populist uprising, what? A military coup? ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2017, 9:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/33 "2017-07-10T09:31:22Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > I’m not “alarmed” by it–I’m pitting it. I’m pitting the idiots who think a legally and fairly elected president is “illegitimate”, and that a mass populist insurrection to overthrow that legally and fairly elected president would not be the death knell of American democracy. Then you are the one against democracy. If there is a big enough popular revolt, then that means that the people have decided he is not fit to be their president, which is exactly what democracy is–the people deciding. You are actually pitting people for opposing Trump and trying to fight back. You do realize that Hitler was legitimately elected, right? Was it wrong to oppose him? Did opposing him destroy democracy? Opposing an evil regime is what you’re _supposed_ to do. And for someone you aren’t afraid of, you have no problem lying about them. They say nothing about using anything other than their constitutionally guaranteed right of freedom of speech. So then you create the lie that they are fighting with guns and violence. You claim they can somehow possibly overturn democracy itself. You lie to be able to pit people who are against Trump, pretending like they are bad guys. You’ve switched from guy who is a little too soft on Trump to a full on Trump supporter. Go grab a cactus, pussy. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2017, 9:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/34 "2017-07-10T09:47:50Z")
And, yes, **Lumpy** , Trump is fucking evil. He is out for himself and damn anyone else. That’s evil. He is actually fascistic, which does not mean rule by the military but “an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.” Trump is authoritarian, nationalistic, and appeals to the right wing. He is a fascist, even if he has (so far) failed to accomplish his plans. Let’s not forget his attempts to shut down freedom of speech. And, yes, there were cries that Obama was illegitimate. They came on my Facebook all the time the past 8 years. The fact that these guys are getting more support is simply because Trump is a far, far worse person than Obama. You can’t argue that something is okay when a few people do it but wrong when more people do it. And, let’s not kid ourselves. Their reasons were racism. They saw a guy who didn’t look like them, and assumed he must be a foreigner. The reasons to not consider Trump legitimate are many, and none have anything to do with him being white. He was elected by a minority. He has a huge Russia scandal where he actually asked Russia to hack to influence our elections, and possibly more. He should have been in jail for all he’s done in the past and unable to run, but has gotten out of it by being rich. He has a clear personality disorder that makes him incapable of rational action in many situations. He may actually be going senile, given the differences in how he acts now vs. when he was younger. And, let’s not kid ourselves. He is a wannabe dictator. Nearly all his frustration is in not being able to do what he thought he could do as president. He wanted to be King of America. That’s a dictator, not a president. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2017, 10:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/35 "2017-07-10T10:50:53Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > . You do realize that Hitler was legitimately elected, right? Hitler was never elected. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2017, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/36 "2017-07-10T11:12:09Z")
What is it with Americans and fear of non-violent protests? Not only are they not anti-democracy, they’re a vital part of the democratic process. Leaders are _supposed_ to resign or be legally removed from office in face of mass public opposition. It’s how the system works. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2017, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/37 "2017-07-10T11:41:02Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > What is it with Americans and fear of non-violent protests? Not only are they not anti-democracy, they’re a vital part of the democratic process. Leaders are _supposed_ to resign or be legally removed from office in face of mass public opposition. It’s how the system works. I think the big American attitude is, you elect a President, he’s in for 4 years, like him or not. If he’s not popular, if people don’t like him, well, too bad. We’ve only had one president who had ever resigned, and that was on the verge of an impeachment for pretty blatant illegality that he knew he’d lose. So changing the government based on popular will isn’t really a thing that happens here. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2017, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/38 "2017-07-10T11:46:20Z")
Well, you also had LBJ refusing to run in 1968, partially due to protests, but I see your point. Things change, though. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2017, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/39 "2017-07-10T12:57:28Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > changing the government based on popular will isn’t really a thing that happens here. Well, choosing the President based on popular will isn’t a thing that happens there either, so at least it’s symmetric. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2017, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698/40 "2017-07-10T13:16:53Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Trump is not fit to shovel shit from one place to another. > > The sooner you accept that, the sooner we can actually put someone competent to work actually making America great again. The thing you (and a few other posters) on this thread seem to be too stupid to realize is that someone can be opposed to overthrowing an elected leader and still _not_ be a Trump supporter. Like it or not, an electoral majority of Americans voted to make Donald Trump the president of the United States. If people manage to oust him from office by popular uprising, then that will set the new standard for American politics. With every new president, there will be an uprising from the increasingly polarized opposition to overthrow that candidate, and the choice of the electorate will no longer matter, and our descent into a third-world joke would be complete. Are you really too short-sighted and small-minded to figure that out? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-say-you-want-a-revoluuuution/790698.md?page=3)