# You-Snark-It Forbidden Thread (Mafia Discussion) **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [December 13, 2007, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805 "2007-12-13T02:59:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2007, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/1 "2007-12-13T02:59:00Z")
LIVING PLAYERS FROM THE YOU-SOLVE-IT MAFIA GAME PLEASE STAY OUT! It seems to be my turn to start the Forbidden Thread for the current Mafia game [(see game thread)](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=447411). The usual rule applies in this thread: Living players and eligible subs please stay out of this thread. Dead players are welcome after their death scene has been posted. To start the peanut gallery commentary: As I understand the rules, the death scene and dossier take the place of investigation roles. With zero power roles, this game will favor the nitty-gritty attentive players. Who’s going to be the first to get lynched? Place your bets now. Kat? zuma v1? sachertorte? A new player? ---
**Author:** ![SkipMagic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skipmagic/32/20706_2.png) [@SkipMagic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SkipMagic)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2007, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/2 "2007-12-13T03:58:23Z")
I added “Mafia Discussion” to the thread title to help make it less ambiguous for folks who aren’t involved with the game. ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2007, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/3 "2007-12-13T06:02:52Z")
> [@faithfool - "in the Game Thread"](#): > > Sorry, sorry, sorry! I got the PM and thought I’d already sent it back. My head’s spinning over all this and I’m trying to keep up with here and **the link Mtgman sent**. Hopefully, I’ll have at least a sorta basic working knowledge of what’s going on and what I should do. Again, I apologize for the delay. Now I’m off to reading and **the other confirming**. Bolding Mine. Um what link and confirming would that be? To the scum boards perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![Panurge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/fbc32d/32.png) [@Panurge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Panurge)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2007, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/4 "2007-12-13T15:44:54Z")
[QUOTE=USCDiver] Bolding Mine. Um what link and confirming would that be? To the scum boards perhaps? [/QUOTE] I think it’s a link to the flash tutorial on the scum boards. ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2007, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/5 "2007-12-13T19:50:27Z")
[QUOTE=USCDiver] Bolding Mine. Um what link and confirming would that be? To the scum boards perhaps? [/QUOTE] Yea, you weren’t the only person to pick up on that. I’m not sure I did the right thing by explaining what I had sent her, but I did have interaction with her, specifically, that I didn’t have with others, so I figured I should explain it. Also note I didn’t say that was the only link I’d sent her, just that I had sent a link to a mafia tutorial to her. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2007, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/6 "2007-12-13T19:58:47Z")
[QUOTE=Mtgman] Yea, you weren’t the only person to pick up on that. I’m not sure I did the right thing by explaining what I had sent her, but I did have interaction with her, specifically, that I didn’t have with others, so I figured I should explain it. Also note I didn’t say that was the only link I’d sent her, just that I had sent a link to a mafia tutorial to her. Enjoy, Steven [/QUOTE] I think you were fine. She said something that was meant to reffer to a specific situation, she is new and doesn’t know that she really has to watch what she says (even if she “knows” this, she doesn’t know it), I think you would have said the same thing no matter what her alignment. Frankly that last one is the most important. You might not have said it if she wasn’t new, but then she wouldn’t have posted that either. ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2007, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/7 "2007-12-13T22:13:59Z")
By the way, this game is designed to be spectator friendly. The comments shared about each player are only the tip of the iceberg, there are lots more like those, some crazier, under their covers(so to speak). The logic puzzle is solvable by anyone as info is released(please let the players do their own work though) and we’re happy to have people participate in making the gruesome, and very unflattering, death scenes for those players too lazy to write their own. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![CatInASuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3be4f8/32.png) [@CatInASuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CatInASuit)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2007, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/8 "2007-12-14T21:34:12Z")
So, the game is about to kick off properly with the first Day coming up shortly. I wonder how the game will start. Random Voting Dossier Discussion What the secret is or just general panic and argument 😃 ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2007, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/9 "2007-12-14T21:39:48Z")
[QUOTE=CatInASuit] So, the game is about to kick off properly with the first Day coming up shortly. I wonder how the game will start. Random Voting Dossier Discussion What the secret is or just general panic and argument 😃 [/QUOTE] My money is on option 3. Go team secret! ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2007, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/10 "2007-12-14T21:43:26Z")
I think that the DA, LLP will at the least steer discussion towards the Dossiers. I’m interested to see how they react if the town is flat-out against publicly disclosing them. Will **Pleonast** shoot his off just to be himself? Will **sachertorte** involve himself in a long winded, numbers focused, argument with half the town? Will the end result help the Associates or the DA? ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2007, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/11 "2007-12-14T21:49:23Z")
never mind ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2007, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/12 "2007-12-14T22:42:55Z")
Oh, now that’s interesting. **Pleonast** is trying to get **Santo Rugger** to organize a “reveal the dossiers” party in his death scene. Kind of rude to impose on the dead like that, IMHO, but it does open up a new aspect of gameplay. Instead of just color/flavor in the death scenes, there could be one-shot strategy. Interesting. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2007, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/13 "2007-12-14T22:59:07Z")
[QUOTE=Mtgman] Oh, now that’s interesting. **Pleonast** is trying to get **Santo Rugger** to organize a “reveal the dossiers” party in his death scene. Kind of rude to impose on the dead like that, IMHO, but it does open up a new aspect of gameplay. Instead of just color/flavor in the death scenes, there could be one-shot strategy. Interesting. Enjoy, Steven [/QUOTE] We’ve got to give **Pleonast** some kudos for coming up with a very interesting idea. But it may be of limited use; ISTR that the death scene will be [del]censored[/del]copyedited by the Mods. Still, the death scene is the one chance **Santo Rugger** has to do something in the game. I hope e makes good use of it. ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2007, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/14 "2007-12-14T22:59:36Z")
Also, unless the Dead reveal _their_ complete Dossier in their death scene, it will be quite difficult to do a meaningful analysis of revealed Dossiers. Particularly if it makes it to Day 2 or 3 before the town agrees to reveal all. ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2007, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/15 "2007-12-14T23:05:40Z")
[QUOTE=Scuba\_Ben] We’ve got to give **Pleonast** some kudos for coming up with a very interesting idea. But it may be of limited use; ISTR that the death scene will be [del]censored[/del]copyedited by the Mods. Still, the death scene is the one chance **Santo Rugger** has to do something in the game. I hope e makes good use of it. [/QUOTE] I’m thinking there isn’t much I’d reject a death scene for. Attacks on players would be forum violations(so they’re out), and there are a couple other restrictions, otherwise it’s pretty wide open. If **Santo Rugger** wants to dance to someone else’s tune in his death scene, that’s his call. Everyone else in the thread will have to decide if they think it’s a good idea on their own. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2007, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/16 "2007-12-15T18:15:29Z")
So it seems the reveal of the private dossier components is gathering steam. A couple players are digging in against it, a couple are leading the charge to try to force it. Most are silent on the issue. What do you think? Enough have been revealed by now publically to do some analysis. Do you think further reveals would help or hurt the town? Why or why not? This is part of the publicly accessible logic puzzle I promised for spectators. If there were suddenly six pieces of info per player which were public, but only one of them was trustworthy, how would that affect the calculus when a new death scene with a piece of info came out? Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2007, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/17 "2007-12-15T22:21:57Z")
I’m interested to see what **Hal Briston** does with his information. Personally, I think the town is pretty much lost without the mass reveal. They have no other information. Without a dossier manifest to analyse, the town is left to root out seemingly scummy info from actual posts (a la **faithfool** ’s foolish post) which in my experience is about 10-20% accurate at finding true Scum. At that rate, they’ll have killed each other off in sufficient numbers to give the game to the DA, LLP. In the same light, if the DA has effectively obfuscated their Dossiers it will be damn near impossible to find one of them based on the Death Scene’s unless the town is lucky enough to hit on the Public Item once or twice. My big question is when will it occur to the town to No-Lynch for a few Days? ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2007, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/18 "2007-12-16T00:11:23Z")
[QUOTE=USCDiver] I’m interested to see what **Hal Briston** does with his information. Personally, I think the town is pretty much lost without the mass reveal. They have no other information. Without a dossier manifest to analyse, the town is left to root out seemingly scummy info from actual posts (a la **faithfool** ’s foolish post) which in my experience is about 10-20% accurate at finding true Scum. At that rate, they’ll have killed each other off in sufficient numbers to give the game to the DA, LLP. In the same light, if the DA has effectively obfuscated their Dossiers it will be damn near impossible to find one of them based on the Death Scene’s unless the town is lucky enough to hit on the Public Item once or twice. My big question is when will it occur to the town to No-Lynch for a few Days? [/QUOTE] The thing is, the game was designed so the dossiers wouldn’t really help or hurt either side much at all, no matter what is done with them. They give the town a slight edge, but not much edge at all. Same thing with the secret mechenisms in the game. They are to give the town a slight edge, but they are not desinged to be able to allow either side to reach victory. If the game is played well, town should be able to find and catch scum with no power roles at all. I know it can be done, because I have played in games where it is done, and have read other games where it is done. It is just hard, and will take the town actually working together. The game is really just a vanilla vs. scum game. Everything else is there (more or less) just to generate discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2007, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/19 "2007-12-16T02:05:04Z")
[QUOTE=USCDiver] I’m interested to see what **Hal Briston** does with his information. Personally, I think the town is pretty much lost without the mass reveal. They have no other information. Without a dossier manifest to analyse, the town is left to root out seemingly scummy info from actual posts (a la **faithfool** ’s foolish post) which in my experience is about 10-20% accurate at finding true Scum. At that rate, they’ll have killed each other off in sufficient numbers to give the game to the DA, LLP. In the same light, if the DA has effectively obfuscated their Dossiers it will be damn near impossible to find one of them based on the Death Scene’s unless the town is lucky enough to hit on the Public Item once or twice. My big question is when will it occur to the town to No-Lynch for a few Days? [/QUOTE] But you see, that’s exactly how vanilla on vanilla Mafia works. They have to comb the conversation for inconsistencies or illogical behavior. With no hidden motives for anything any of the town are doing or saying they should be transparent. Someone weaseling or lying is almost certainly scum. There are plenty of examples of twenty person games with five scum, all vanilla, where the town finds the scum. The group seemed to be losing their ability to analyze posts for scummy behavior and were becoming reliant on power roles or fancy mechanics. I designed the dossier to be straightforward(a couple of people have hit on how simply it really works) and they’re making far too much of it really. Both town and scum are falling into this trap, but it’s worse for town to obsess over it than for scum. We’ll see if they can pull their heads back together pretty soon. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![WF\_Tomba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d9b06d/32.png) [@WF\_Tomba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WF_Tomba)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2007, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805/20 "2007-12-16T03:30:53Z")
I’ve been trying to follow this game, and as far as I can tell the dossier system isn’t doing anything at all. I think Town should ignore it entirely. They get ONE piece of information about a killer per night. With each player having six discoverable pieces of information, and an unknowable amount of duplication, I don’t see how this is likely to help except perhaps very late in the game, when there are fewer players left. It’s more of a distraction than an aid. By the way, I wonder if anyone has noticed that the dossier attributes are taken from the recent Two Truths and a Lie thread. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-snark-it-forbidden-thread-mafia-discussion/429805.md?page=2)