# You voted for these wars, so what exactly is your problem? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 12, 2013, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696 "2013-11-12T03:36:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![BubbaDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bubbadog/32/333_2.png) [@BubbaDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BubbaDog)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/21 "2013-11-12T13:37:59Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > … > The people hollering for these cuts are the same fellows who got us into the last two wars and generated these veterans in the first place. … [QUOTE=Try2B Comprehensive] …The identity is murky as it isn’t clear who is ultimately behind the food stamp cuts… … [/QUOTE] ??? ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/22 "2013-11-12T13:59:16Z")
It’s a volunteer military. Don’t like the benefits, don’t join. Where in the recruiting brochures does it say “Food Stamps For Life”? ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/23 "2013-11-12T14:00:50Z")
If these soldiers had really wanted to serve their country best, they would have stepped on a mine the last week of their tour. They didn’t? Fuck 'em! > [@John\_Mace](#): > > A temporary [SNAP] increase is set to expire. That is not a “cut”, except in the bureaucratese that exists in Wash DC. Replace “temporary [SNAP] increase” (and don’t forget the underlining :smack: ) with “temporary tax decrease” and every right-wing imbecile (as well as the “libertarian” moron 🆒 ) would get a hernia twisting into a somersault to take the _exact opposite perspective_ on “temporary.” ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/24 "2013-11-12T14:21:22Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > It’s a volunteer military. Don’t like the benefits, don’t join. Where in the recruiting brochures does it say “Food Stamps For Life”? You might have missed the thousands of TV commercials and recruiting materials that lie about all the awesome civilian employers that will be clamoring to hire veterans when they leave the services. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/25 "2013-11-12T15:01:28Z")
> [@VarlosZ](#): > > I don’t have an opinion about funding for food stamps, but this is a \*really \*weak argument. > > On the one hand it can be applied to basically anything since veterans will be a percentage of every program (“Cut funding for the Smithsonian? But veterans go to those museums!”), and on the other hand it’s not like their military service is the \*reason \*for these veterans’ being on food stamps. I mean, I’m sure there are people for whom that’s the case, but that’s gonna be the exception and not the rule. It was Veteran’s Day. I don’t know about you, but I saw it all day long, and these days it just isn’t the same since our wars do not seem to be good causes. The soldiers sign up honorably to do their duty, then they get screwed by politically motivated wars. Then they’re fucked up and can’t all function in society and end up on food stamps, which stupidly gets cut for politically motivated reasons. Yeah, there is a much broader point than veterans’ well-being, but I needed an anchor for my outrage here in the pit. Of all the people on food stamps, fucked up veterans are one group that is clearly created by unjust-war voting, food-stamp cutting congresscritters. > [@BubbaDog](#): > > ??? I don’t think most voters want to cut food stamps, and I don’t think most GOP congresscritters really think for themselves. Who makes the decisions for GOP congresscritters? Dunno. We could blame the Koch brothers I guess, but I doubt that is a complete list of the people who are Really behind these cuts. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/26 "2013-11-12T15:05:26Z")
To those suggesting the food tax cuts are a one-time roll-back of increases, note the following from my cite: > [@](#): > > - The second big change is that the House bill would restrict states’ abilities to determine a person’s eligibility for food stamps based in part on whether they qualify for other low-income benefits. This is known as “categorical eligibility” and has generally allowed families just above the poverty line to receive food stamps if they have unusually high housing costs or are facing other hardships. > This second change would take another 2.1 million people off food stamps in 2014 and then remove an additional 1.8 million people per year for the next decade. Those cuts are pending on Congressional action. But, not to be deterred: > [@](#): > > **New state restrictions**. Even if Congress doesn’t pass further cuts to the program, some states could act on their own to restrict eligibility. > In 2013, 44 states qualified for federal waivers that would allow more able-bodied adults to receive food stamps if unemployment in the area was particularly high. House Republicans want to curtail those waivers as part of their farm bill. But even if the House GOP doesn’t get its way, some states are planning to stop asking for waivers anyway. > Kansas already let its waiver expire at the start of October, a change that could affect some 20,000 residents. The Oklahoma state legislature passed a bill to add a similar work requirement to its food-stamp program. Ohio is planning to enact similar restrictions starting Jan. 1, and Wisconsin will follow suit next July. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/27 "2013-11-12T15:10:19Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > You might have missed the thousands of TV commercials and recruiting materials that lie about all the awesome civilian employers that will be clamoring to hire veterans when they leave the services. They go straight to the fucking front of the line for any jobs that _are_ open. Automatic bump for all state and county jobs as well. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/28 "2013-11-12T15:30:08Z")
And yet they are unemployed at greater rates than the general public. ---
**Author:** ![Cognoscant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Cognoscant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cognoscant)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/29 "2013-11-12T15:48:46Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > And yet they are unemployed at greater rates than the general public. For some strange reason employers don’t like to hire people with PTSD or other fun mental disorders. The other “fun” thing about the military is that if you go serve right out of high school then get injured or wash out you are leaving with little more than a GED and a “good luck.” Even if vets are at the front of the line, if they are seen as being unable to do the job the employer is well within its rights to say “next!”. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/30 "2013-11-12T15:59:12Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > Between you and me, I don’t think small benefits to the working poor are what’s wrong with our economy. But they are a thing wrong with our **society.** ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/31 "2013-11-12T16:36:30Z")
[Why the GOP wants to decimate food stamps](http://www.businessinsider.com/why-the-gop-really-wants-to-decimate-food-stamps-2013-10) ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/32 "2013-11-12T16:44:51Z")
Many American business firms have, nonetheless, an admirable devotion to the health and well being of our citizens. Firms like Cargill, General Foods, Monsanto… ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/33 "2013-11-12T18:40:03Z")
> [@Cognoscant](#): > > Even if vets are at the front of the line, if they are seen as being unable to do the job the employer is well within its rights to say “next!”. Of course they are. That is entirely beside the point, which is that the military sells recruits on the idea that every employer out there will be begging for their services when they go back to civliandom because they’ll have learned Useful Skills Employers Need and they’ll be Leaders. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/34 "2013-11-12T18:48:13Z")
NM ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/35 "2013-11-12T18:55:08Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > It’s a volunteer military. Don’t like the benefits, don’t join. Where in the recruiting brochures does it say “Food Stamps For Life”? It’s not necessarily the benefits that make you join. A lot of young men join the military to have a steady paycheck, to learn a trade, or to escape whatever hell they are presently living in. Most benefits are at the end of a career, not at the end of an enlistment. The possibility of going into combat is part of the job, not all of it, and many military folk never fire a shot in anger. But when you volunteer to put yourself in harm’s way, you are owed a certain debt by the taxpayer when it all goes sideways for you. I, like most vets, draw no disability, have never seen the inside of a VA hospital or a shrink’s couch, and have never drawn public assistance since retiring from the military. But I ate a lot of government cheese and butter while struggling to raise a family on E-5 pay, and appreciated every bit of it. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/36 "2013-11-12T20:29:07Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Of course they are. That is entirely beside the point, which is that the military sells recruits on the idea that every employer out there will be begging for their services when they go back to civliandom because they’ll have learned Useful Skills Employers Need and they’ll be Leaders. Heh. My older brother dropped out of high school in 1972 to join the army. He was a paratrooper (82nd Airborne) and a cook (mostly he baked bread). When he first contemplated whether he would reenlist, he went to see a career counselor to explore what the civilian world had waiting for him. The top option?Soldier of fortune. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2013, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/37 "2013-11-12T22:26:46Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > It’s a volunteer military. Don’t like the benefits, don’t join. Where in the recruiting brochures does it say “Food Stamps For Life”? Probably right next to the part where your buddy gets his ass blown off by an IED. :rolleyes: Or the part where it talks about getting PTSD. The food stamps are needed when they leave the military. My brother works in a homeless shelter for Vets. That such a thing is needed really sucks. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2013, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/38 "2013-11-13T16:50:36Z")
So even though it’s voluntary service, and the benefits and risks are explicitly known and stated, people join the military expecting that the government will be there in ways more than are explicitly stated? ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2013, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/39 "2013-11-13T17:11:19Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > A temporary increase is set to expire. That is not a “cut”, except in the bureaucratese that exists in Wash DC. > [@BrainGlutton](#): > > And everywhere else, as you know. > [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > The Bush tax cuts didn’t entirely expire, and certainly not as scheduled. At the risk of adding to the pile-on, another place that a temporary increase expiring is _definitely_ seen as a cut or loss is the Sacred, All-Knowing Private Sector™. When a company’s stock goes down, do the CEOs, CFOs, and analysts all complacently note that the previous value represented a temporary rise, and no action need be taken to reverse the loss? ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2013, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696/40 "2013-11-13T17:21:44Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > So even though it’s voluntary service, and the benefits and risks are explicitly known and stated, people join the military expecting that the government will be there in ways more than are explicitly stated? How do you reach that conclusion? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-voted-for-these-wars-so-what-exactly-is-your-problem/673696.md?page=3)