# You & your pet are stranded far from home. Do you abandon the pet if it means you get to go back? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 21, 2010, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480 "2010-07-21T16:42:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Precambrianmollusc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/precambrianmollusc/32/63_2.png) [@Precambrianmollusc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Precambrianmollusc)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/81 "2010-07-22T20:37:20Z")
Wife and kids trump Mac as lovely as he is. ---
**Author:** ![gallan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ee59a6/32.png) [@gallan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gallan)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/82 "2010-07-22T20:56:26Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > Being in in a burning building is nowhere like undergoing “a series of unpleasant adventures” in a land where he might think he “will soon be dead.” > > In the OP’s scenario, staying there at least holds out the possibility of survival. You’ve made it this far, haven’t you? He said nothing at all about said survival being at the cost of the constant burning and melting of your flesh. Like, you know, in a burning building. I guess you and I just imagined the situation differently. I envisioned something like walking through hell with fire and brimstone and angry demons chasing us. I assumed that choosing to not immediately abandon my animal and board the ship would quickly result in a painful death. Correct me if I’m wrong, but it sounds like you envisioned something out of a bad Jim Carrey movie, where you assumed some chance of survival for an extended period of time if you chose to stay. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/83 "2010-07-22T21:02:32Z")
> [@gallan](#): > > I guess you and I just imagined the situation differently. I envisioned something like walking through hell with fire and brimstone and angry demons chasing us. I assumed that choosing to not immediately abandon my animal and board the ship would quickly result in a painful death. Yeah, I didn’t see it that way. If the question amounts to “If there were only one seat on the lifeboat, would you give it to your dog” puts a different spin on it. > [@](#): > > Correct me if I’m wrong, but it sounds like you envisioned something out of a bad Jim Carrey movie, where you assumed some chance of survival for an extended period of time if you chose to stay. A Jim Carrey movie? Fido’s on his own! Seriously, I suppose I saw just enough wiggle room in his scenario to leave a chance of survival. And I just could not abandon my dogs there. I could not. I suspect I would take my own life soon after escaping, unable to handle the guilt. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/84 "2010-07-22T21:18:38Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > Yeah, I didn’t see it that way. If the question amounts to “If there were only one seat on the lifeboat, would you give it to your dog” puts a different spin on it. > > A Jim Carrey movie? Fido’s on his own! > > Seriously, I suppose I saw just enough wiggle room in his scenario to leave a chance of survival. And I just could not abandon my dogs there. I could not. I suspect I would take my own life soon after escaping, unable to handle the guilt. I left the wiggle room on purpose. I mean, if I’d written _You and the dog are in a burning house, and you don’t know where the dog is but think it’s probably upstairs, and you are downstairs, and the staircase is on fire and you are not Spider-Man_, then the choice is obvious to all but the mad. ---
**Author:** ![obfusciatrist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/4af34b/32.png) [@obfusciatrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obfusciatrist)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/85 "2010-07-22T21:21:10Z")
Really easy decision. I’d get on the boat. And when I got home I’d get to have a kitten again. Win, win, maybe lose (depending on whether my current cat is going to be harmed or simply deprived of going home with me). ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/86 "2010-07-22T21:40:44Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > The OP’s example is nothing like being in a burning building. Based on the way I read it, it is. Either you get out and the pet stays, or you both stay and “you’ll soon be either mad or dead,” which leaves the pet in exactly the same predicament as if you’d abandoned it when you had the chance to get out, only now \*you’re \*fucked, too. > [@Contrapuntal](#): > > Yeah, I didn’t see it that way. If the question amounts to “If there were only one seat on the lifeboat, would you give it to your dog” puts a different spin on it. Not even. I’d say it’s, “If there were only one seat on the lifeboat, would you take it, or would you drown with your pet?” > [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > I left the wiggle room on purpose. I didn’t see any wiggle room at all. “You have no reason to think you’ll ever have another chance to get out of this situation,and every reason to think that, if you stay in this strange land any longer, you’ll soon be either mad or dead.” That seems pretty straightforward to me. 'Cause if I can wiggle out of the “mad or dead” part, what’s to stop me from wiggling out of the “can’t get the pet home” part, thereby negating the entire premise? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/87 "2010-07-22T22:09:03Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Based on the way I read it, it is. Either you get out and the pet stays, or you both stay and “you’ll soon be either mad or dead,” which leaves the pet in exactly the same predicament as if you’d abandoned it when you had the chance to get out, only now \*you’re \*fucked, too. > > Not even. I’d say it’s, “If there were only one seat on the lifeboat, would you take it, or would you drown with your pet?” > > I didn’t see any wiggle room at all. “You have no reason to think you’ll ever have another chance to get out of this situation,and every reason to think that, if you stay in this strange land any longer, you’ll soon be either mad or dead.” That seems pretty straightforward to me. 'Cause if I can wiggle out of the “mad or dead” part, what’s to stop me from wiggling out of the “can’t get the pet home” part, thereby negating the entire premise? _You have no reason to think X_ is not QUITE the same as saying _X is true_. ---
**Author:** ![gallan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ee59a6/32.png) [@gallan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gallan)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/88 "2010-07-22T22:33:11Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > _You have no reason to think X_ is not QUITE the same as saying _X is true_. It’s the same thing when it comes to decision-making. If an employer has no reason to think that you’re qualified for the job, you’re not going to get it no matter how qualified you actually are. To say that we have no reason to believe something implies that we have exhausted all possible avenues of reason and have come to the conclusion that the given thing is impossible. So maybe it’s just me, but to say that I have no reason to believe I’d ever have another chance to get home means that I have expended all of my available resources and tried everything I could possibly think of and I truly and honestly believe that abandoning my dog and boarding the ship is my one and only way home. If I had even the slightest hope that there might be another way, then I would have at least _one_ reason not to get on board, and 1 \> 0. 🙂 So I’ll put it this way. If there is at least a shred of hope for my survival and ultimate escape, I would stay with my dog. However, if staying meant I definitely would die alongside my dog in the very near future, I would leave him. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/89 "2010-07-22T22:35:38Z")
I would abandon my current pet and any pet I’ve ever owned. But I would NOT be happy about it. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/90 "2010-07-22T22:41:21Z")
> [@gallan](#): > > It’s the same thing when it comes to decision-making. If an employer has no reason to think that you’re qualified for the job, you’re not going to get it no matter how qualified you actually are. > > To say that we have no reason to believe something implies that we have exhausted all possible avenues of reason and have come to the conclusion that the given thing is impossible. So maybe it’s just me, but to say that I have no reason to believe I’d ever have another chance to get home means that I have expended all of my available resources and tried everything I could possibly think of and I truly and honestly believe that abandoning my dog and boarding the ship is my one and only way home. If I had even the slightest hope that there might be another way, then I would have at least _one_ reason not to get on board, and 1 \> 0. 🙂 > > So I’ll put it this way. If there is at least a shred of hope for my survival and ultimate escape, I would stay with my dog. However, if staying meant I definitely would die alongside my dog in the very near future, I would leave him. Hmm. At this point, we’re discussing, as much as anything else, what _hope_ means. One can _choose_ to hope–that is, to act as if there were the possibility of a good outcome–even when one does not feel the _emotion_ of hope. Let’s say I was in the OP situation with a child I loved, and the callous captain made the demand of me. I know that the child cannot possibly survive without me (and is, in fact, probably less capable of taking care of himself that my cats would be). I would still choose to stay in the child, _hoping_, as a verb, that my judgment of the situation is wrong. I’d be willing to do that for a kid, but not my cats. ---
**Author:** ![gallan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ee59a6/32.png) [@gallan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gallan)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/91 "2010-07-22T22:50:51Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Let’s say I was in the OP situation with a child I loved, and the callous captain made the demand of me. I know that the child cannot possibly survive without me (and is, in fact, probably less capable of taking care of himself that my cats would be). I would still choose to stay in the child, _hoping_, as a verb, that my judgment of the situation is wrong. > > I’d be willing to do that for a kid, but not my cats. Fully agree. I guess it would be much easier for me to have hope if it was a child than it would if it was a dog (or other animal). ---
**Author:** ![moejoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de053/32.png) [@moejoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moejoe)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/92 "2010-07-22T23:38:43Z")
Probably if enough of us stay behind with our pets we can make it a better place. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2010, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/93 "2010-07-22T23:46:33Z")
My sole current pet is a goldfish, and I’m not very attached to him. Good luck, fishie. On the other hand, I would have had a real hard time abandoning the dog I had for 15 years. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/94 "2010-07-23T00:02:13Z")
> [@gallan](#): > > I envision them sitting down with their dog and saying, “I promise to take good care of you.” and the dog replies, “So I can have food now?” because he doesn’t really care. Some of them care intensely. If you’ve ever rescued a really traumatized dog, you’ll know that he or she wants, _much_ more than food, to know that you will be a good pack leader – that you will be present, and kind, and know what to do. > [@Contrapuntal](#): > > I have run into traffic to save a dog before. Yeah, I’ve done that (also for a snapping turtle on a superhighway). > [@Contrapuntal](#): > > I’d pay $5 to watch rats fuck, so I’m not sure how much weight to give your wager, if any. Hrm…I smell a business opportunity. I wonder if [ratfuck.com](http://ratfuck.com) is registered? > [@Contrapuntal](#): > > In the OP’s scenario, staying there at least holds out the possibility of survival. You’ve made it this far, haven’t you? Yeah. I’m starting to wonder if some of the people responding to this thread would have stood with Churchill in 1940, because there’s very little chance of ever winning, or stuck to their guns in Bastogne, or shivered through Valley Forge, or hauled the colors back up on the _Bonhomme Richard_. ---
**Author:** ![obfusciatrist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/4af34b/32.png) [@obfusciatrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obfusciatrist)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/95 "2010-07-23T00:35:11Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > Yeah. I’m starting to wonder if some of the people responding to this thread would have stood with Churchill in 1940\*. And other people (me, but I’m everyman) are thinking some people way overvalue their pets if abandoning one is a decision par with giving up on saving Europe from Hitler. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/96 "2010-07-23T14:42:13Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > Yeah. I’m starting to wonder if some of the people responding to this thread would have stood with Churchill in 1940, because there’s very little chance of ever winning, or stuck to their guns in Bastogne, or shivered through Valley Forge, or hauled the colors back up on the _Bonhomme Richard_. Honeyplease. There is a world of difference between “you have \*very little chance \*of surviving” and “you have **no reason to think** you’ll survive.” We may be splitting semantic hairs here, but I think they’re important ones. ETA: There’s also a huge difference between fighting to save your life and the lives of a bunch of other people against long odds, where not fighting means a whole lot more death and possibly eventually yours as well, and taking a 100% chance to save yourself over an (apparently) 100% chance to die. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/97 "2010-07-23T15:35:31Z")
I reject the notion that remaining in the OP’s scenario is equivalent to 100% chance to die. That would be a very uninteresting poll indeed. You can’t seriously think I’m arguing that i would just instantly die rather than face the choice. The OP is interesting only if one is choosing to face uncertainty. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/98 "2010-07-23T16:02:47Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > I reject the notion that remaining in the OP’s scenario is equivalent to 100% chance to die. Then \*\*Skald \*\*should have phrased it less ambiguously. ---
**Author:** ![Not\_a\_Platypus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/d26b3c/32.png) [@Not\_a\_Platypus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_a_Platypus)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/99 "2010-07-23T16:20:04Z")
I’d abandon my pets. I’d feel guilty about it, but the choice as I see it is stay and MAYBE survive a miserable existence, or get the hell out and have a much higher chance of LIVING. There are very few humans I’d choose to stay for, much less a pet. Even if you do survive, your pet is likely going to die in a few years, leaving you all alone. It’s not like choosing to stick around for your child or human companion, who you could reasonably expect to be with you for a long time. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480/100 "2010-07-23T19:16:37Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Then \*\*Skald \*\*should have phrased it less ambiguously. ☹ I really was trying to phrase things so that the hypothetical person _thought_ she or he was probably doomed, but could possibly have been wrong. In penance I will watch a hip-hop video of your choosing on YouTube. No Marshal Mathers, though. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/you-your-pet-are-stranded-far-from-home-do-you-abandon-the-pet-if-it-means-you-get-to-go-back/547480.md?page=6)