# "you'd complain if you were hung with a new rope" **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 28, 2013, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409 "2013-08-28T16:03:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![JBDivmstr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b4bc9f/32.png) [@JBDivmstr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JBDivmstr)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/1 "2013-08-28T16:03:54Z")
“He would complain even if he was hung with a new rope.” or “you’d complain if you were hung with a new rope” I’ve heard this phrase used to describe someone that constantly complained about every little thing. A Wiki search gives [this](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/you'd_complain_if_you_were_hung_with_a_new_rope), but I can’t seem to find any other information on the _ **origin** _ of the term. Perhaps somebody with better ‘google-fu’ than I can enlighten me/us. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/2 "2013-08-28T16:21:32Z")
That should be “hanged.” I found [this](http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_origin_of_the_phrase_you%27d_complain_if_you_were_hung_with_a_new_rope). But the “right” to being hanged with a new rope sounds apocryphal. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/3 "2013-08-28T16:23:45Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > That should be “hanged.” Even if he’s the picture of health? ---
**Author:** ![cwthree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@cwthree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cwthree)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/4 "2013-08-28T16:25:33Z")
Execution by hanging is generally performed with a rope that has been prepared by boiling and drying under tension. New rope tends to coil, which causes it to act like a spring when it supports the weight of the body during hanging. This is at best undignified and at worst likely to interfere with the effectiveness of the procedure and/or damage the corpse. Thus, one might complain upon learning the he would be hanged with a new, unprepared rope. The U.S. Army document, “[Procedure for Military Executions](http://www.loc.gov/rr/frd/Military_Law/pdf/procedure_dec-1947.pdf),” describes the preparation of the rope for execution by hanging: **30. Rope** The rope will be of manila hemp, at least 3/4, inch and not more than 1% inches in diameter and approximately 30 feet in length. The rope will be boiled and then stretched while drying to elim- inate any spring, stiffness, or tendency to coil. The hangman’s knot (figure 7) will be used in the preparation of the noose. That portion of the noose which slides through the knot will be treated with wax, soap, or grease to insure a smooth sliding action through the knot. The noose will be placed snugly around the prisoner’s neck in such a manner that the hangman’s knot is directly behind his left ear. (Department of the Army. _Procedure for Military Executions_, December 1947, p. 15) I believe [Albert Pierrepoint](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Pierrepoint), the longtime British executioner, documented a similar process for removing the springy quality from the rope prior to use. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/5 "2013-08-28T16:26:20Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > Even if he’s the picture of health? Men are hanged, pictures are hung. Unless you’re Johnny Wadd, in which case you’re well hung. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/6 "2013-08-28T16:43:10Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > That should be “hanged.” The only thing more annoying than unnecessary pedanticism is incorrect unnecessary pedanticism. [“For both transitive and intransitive senses 1b the past and past participle hung, as well as hanged, is standard. Hanged is most appropriate for official executions \ but hung is also used \. Hung is more appropriate for less formal hangings \.”](http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/hanged?show=0&t=1377707760) ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/7 "2013-08-28T16:47:44Z")
From [American Heritage Dictionary](http://education.yahoo.com/reference/dictionary/entry/hang): “_Hanged_, as a past tense and a past participle of _hang_, is used in the sense of ‘to put to death by hanging,’ as in _Frontier courts hanged many a prisoner after a summary trial_. **A majority of the Usage Panel objects to _hung_ used in this sense.** In all other senses of the word, _hung_ is the preferred form as past tense and past participle, as in _I hung my child’s picture above my desk_.” ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/8 "2013-08-28T16:49:02Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Men are hanged, pictures are hung. Unless you’re Johnny Wadd, in which case you’re well hung. I a man and I’m well hung too. I’ll bet there’s more if us. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/9 "2013-08-28T16:49:55Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > In all other senses of the word, _hung_ is the preferred form as past tense and past participle, as in _I hung my child’s picture above my desk_." I prefer pepperoni on my pizza. Doesn’t mean the cheese-lovers are wrong to leave it off. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/10 "2013-08-28T16:50:48Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > I prefer pepperoni on my pizza. Doesn’t mean the cheese-lovers are wrong to leave it off. Apples and oranges. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/11 "2013-08-28T17:19:56Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Apples and oranges. Have no place on pizza. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/12 "2013-08-28T17:23:45Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > From [American Heritage Dictionary](http://education.yahoo.com/reference/dictionary/entry/hang): > > “_Hanged_, as a past tense and a past participle of _hang_, is used in the sense of ‘to put to death by hanging,’ as in _Frontier courts hanged many a prisoner after a summary trial_. **A majority of the Usage Panel objects to _hung_ used in this sense.** In all other senses of the word, _hung_ is the preferred form as past tense and past participle, as in _I hung my child’s picture above my desk_.” Nobody in America pays attention to the American Heritage Usage Panel, and that especially includes members of the American Heritage Usage Panel. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/13 "2013-08-28T18:35:31Z")
My dad says “gold rope”. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/14 "2013-08-28T18:38:59Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Men are hanged, pictures are hung. Unless you’re Johnny Wadd, in which case you’re well hung. See, I was making a joke. You were supposed to laugh. But thanks for the unnecessary lecture. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/15 "2013-08-28T19:15:41Z")
They said you was hung! ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/16 "2013-08-28T19:41:30Z")
> [@cwthree](#): > > New rope tends to coil, which causes it to act like a spring when it supports the weight of the body during hanging. This is at best undignified and at worst likely to interfere with the effectiveness of the procedure and/or damage the corpse. Yeah, once they drop through the gallows floor it’s probably best if they don’t keep popping back up through like some perch on a bobber. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/17 "2013-08-28T20:08:37Z")
BTW, in case someone misses the point, the phrase in question points out that the subject would complain about the new rope when he should be more upset about the fact of the hanging. But as pointed out by the previous posts, it could mean the subject is aware enough that he knows it would only make things more painful… ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/18 "2013-08-28T20:12:04Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > They said you was hung! And they was right! ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/19 "2013-08-28T23:40:05Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > . . . > I found [this](http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_origin_of_the_phrase_you%27d_complain_if_you_were_hung_with_a_new_rope). But the “right” to being hanged with a new rope sounds apocryphal. Well, since I agreed that it sounds like a folk etymology, I thought I’d try out Google Book, looking for the phrase. The oldest snippet I found was “… who might be proud of being hung with a new rope.” from The Month - Volume 27 1876 (I’d have had to pay money to see the whole page, so that didn’t happen). Then I found a story that was printed in newspapers from one side of the country to the other from 1896 to 1903. It was an amusing story that got a lot of play. WHY HANK WAS NOT HANGED (Many newspapers changed the title, but this was the most common.) WHEN Hank Taylor was put on trial at Strawberry Hill for killing Steve Brown, he pleaded guilty, and, in a little speech to the crowd, said : “In course you’ll hang me. I expect it and shall be disappointed if you don’t. But I want it understood right now that I hev rights.” “What be them rights, prisoner?” queried the Judge. “Waal, I want to be hung with a new rope. I was brung up respectably, and I want to die that way. Then I want to wear a biled shirt. I was brung up to wear biled shirts, and I don’t want to disgrace the fam’ly. I want to be shaved, to have my hair combed and parted in the middle, and I insist on Zeke Cooper lendin’ me his new butes. That’s my rights, and I shall insist on 'em.” “Prisoner, hain’t you just a little too partik’lar?” inquired the Judge. “Haint it puttin’ this ‘ere camp to a good deal of extra trouble for no real benefit? Whar are we goin’ to get a biled shirt, for instance?” “I dunno, but we hev got to hev one. Do you s’pose I’m goin’ to bring up in the other world with this old red shirt on? They wouldn’t allow me to stake a claim or set up a shanty.” “How are you goin’ to be shaved when we han’t got no razors in camp? We kin furnish you some grease and a comb, but thar can’t be no shavin’.” “Got to be,” replied Hank. “I han’t goin’ over the divide lookin’ like a wolf with his winter fur on. And as fur grease, I want reg’lar bar’s ile. I am bound to look just as purty as I kin.” “Zeke, will you lend him your butes?” asked the Judge. "Naw. I could never feel easy in ‘em ag’in.’.’ “Then I don’t hang! Mind you, boys, I han’t denyin’ that I killed Steve, who everybody knows was a provokin, cantankerous cuss, and orter been killed long ago, and I han’t kickin’ as to what will follow, I’m jest stickin’ out fur my rights, S’posin’ any one o’ you was goin’ to arrive at the other world as a tenderfoot, wouldn’t you want to look fairly decent?” “That’s so, that’s so,” mused the Judge. “In course it’ll be known that you cum from Strawberry Hill and in course we’ll hev a pride in fittin’ you out in decent shape. The prisoner will be removed while we hev a talk.” We had a talk. We couldn’t get a white shirt, a new rope, and a razor anywhere within one hundred miles. And, as Hank had observed, Steve Brown was always saying mean things and provoking quarrels, and wasn’t much account. After discussing the pros and cons, it was decided to overlook the offence and let up on Hank, but after telling him our decision the Judge said : “But don’t do it again, Hank. It are the opinyun of some of the boys that you were too darned particklar about the biled shirt, and of others, that you were right about wantin’ to make a decent appearance on the other shore, and so we decided to call it squar’. Next time, however, we’ll hang you with a mule rope and in yer old duds, and let ye run all the chances.” * * * For those who don’t speak pseudo western hick, biled=boiled and refered to a white dress shirt. I have no idea what butes are. Bar’s ile may or may not be bear grease. I can make no claims, but I’m guessing that this story got around and that being proud to be hung (not hanged - the bad grammar would have been part of the story) with a new rope was something that only an amusing rustic would do. Saying someone was complaining about the new rope, rather than being proud of it, was implying that they were less rustic, but also less charming. And if this is another false lead to the origin, well, at least it’s an amusing one. ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409/20 "2013-08-28T23:42:12Z")
> [@Yllaria](#): > > I have no idea what butes are. Boots, perhaps? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-complain-if-you-were-hung-with-a-new-rope/667409.md?page=2)