# You'd think Amazon would understand the concept of what a book is **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 4, 2015, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818 "2015-02-04T18:07:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2015, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/21 "2015-02-04T21:56:19Z")
Why doesn’t Amazon just print a catalog and send it to people! ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2015, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/22 "2015-02-04T22:29:37Z")
As an employee of the USPS, let me just say: _I’m for that!_ But if they intend to send their catalog out at bulk mail prices, I would like to insist that they have the printer bundle them in such a way that the bundles are guaranteed to remain intact on our sorting machinery. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2015, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/23 "2015-02-04T22:45:54Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > As an employee of the USPS, let me just say: > > _I’m for that!_ > > But if they intend to send their catalog out at bulk mail prices… They have drones for that. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2015, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/24 "2015-02-04T22:52:29Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Has Amazon wandered so far away from its original market that it’s forgotten what a book is? Yes and no. They know what books are. They also know that many of their customers are looking for “solutions” rather than specific niche products - and that filling that more general need is more profitable. I’d guess the list you saw was weighted by search results, sales, reviews, ratings and other factors. Books are also a pretty poor way to learn a language, these days. It never was a good solution, not by itself; you have to hear the language spoken and, ideally, have your pronunciation and use corrected by a fluent speaker. Books can’t do that. Audio recordings can; good software like Rosetta Stone can, better and more patiently and conveniently than most human teachers. (At least for the basics.) Giving you a broader answer by showing products that might be a better solution is neither good nor bad, IMVHO… just Amazon. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2015, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/25 "2015-02-04T23:09:03Z")
Personally, I’m pissed at the whole _stick a jillion ebooks into the search_ thing, myself. Is Kindle in such shitty shape, that they gotta pimp it this way? Is Amazon Kindle about to go belly-up, as a device? After all, Amazon hasn’t been doing as well as it used to. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/26 "2015-02-05T04:35:24Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I think it depends on context. There are situations when an e-book is not a book and oral sex is not sex (if you’re trying to get pregnant, oral sex won’t get the job done). And if you’re sterile and want to get pregnant, then suddenly nothing is sex? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/27 "2015-02-05T04:45:40Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > If that one additional click is too much for you, you could start with Advanced Search. You can specify a format, although AFAIK you can’t specify more than one an a time (e.g. Paperback or Hardback). > > “Pretend they have a filter for doing it”? > > This is quite possibly the first-worldest problem I’ve seen in a very long time. For a really good Pitting, you should have mentioned how angry you were and thrown in some colorful obscene insults directed at Amazon. You still seem to be missing the point. It’s like if you went to an ice cream stand and asked for an ice cream cone. “Do you want vanilla, chocolate, strawberry, orange cream, or black raspberry?” “Chocolate sounds good.” “We only sell vanilla.” It’s not a problem that they only sell vanilla. The problem is offering the customer choices which you’re not prepared to follow through on. If Amazon isn’t going to filter their search results to only books then they shouldn’t ask customers if they want their search results to be filtered to only books. I’m not angry about this and I don’t see why you’d think I was. I’m annoyed about this. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/28 "2015-02-05T04:48:03Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > And if you’re sterile and want to get pregnant, then suddenly nothing is sex? That would obviously be a different context. Which was my point. You can’t say _“oral sex is sex”_ or _“oral sex is not sex”_. Both statements are sometimes true and sometimes false. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/29 "2015-02-05T04:57:06Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > The problem is offering the customer choices which you’re not prepared to follow through on. > > If Amazon isn’t going to filter their search results to only books then they shouldn’t ask customers if they want their search results to be filtered to only books. I’m still confused as to _where_ you think they’re doing this (asking customers if they want their search results to be filtered to only books). ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/30 "2015-02-05T05:47:34Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > I’m still confused as to _where_ you think they’re doing this (asking customers if they want their search results to be filtered to only books). Go to the Amazon home page. The search engine’s at the top of the page. There’s a field for typing in your search term. And just to the left of it, there’s a drop-down list where you can filter the search. The default setting is “All Departments”. But you can open up the drop-down list and choose a category to be searched like “Apps & Games” “Electronics” “CDs & Vinyl” “Kindle Store” “Software” “Videogames” “Movies & TV”. If I enter the Beatles as a search term and specify I want to see “CDs & Vinyl” then I think it’s reasonable to expect them to show me a list of Beatles CDs and albums. Not a list of various Beatles merchandise like CDs and books and DVDs and posters and t-shirts all mixed together. At the very least, all of the CD’s and vinyl albums should appear first before any other items make the list. Otherwise what’s the point in asking me what category I’m looking for? If they’re going to treat every search like an “All Departments” search why not just eliminate the list of choices? ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/31 "2015-02-05T06:02:22Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > That would obviously be a different context. Which was my point. > > You can’t say _“oral sex is sex”_ or _“oral sex is not sex”_. Both statements are sometimes true and sometimes false. No, oral sex is always sex. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/32 "2015-02-05T06:10:05Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Otherwise what’s the point in asking me what category I’m looking for? If they’re going to treat every search like an “All Departments” search why not just eliminate the list of choices? Subtle but, I think, not insignificant distinction: they’re not asking you what category you’re looking for; they’re asking you what department you’re looking in. Another part of the confusion is that the word “books” can refer to form or content, medium or message. If I’m talking about a specific book, I could be referring to that paperback sitting on the table there, or I could be referring to _Watership Down_. I _think_ Amazon is using “Books,” not to refer to the specific format (i.e. a stack of pages bound together between two covers) but to the content. But they’re not altogether consistent. They do also have a “Kindle Store” department. And when it comes to other things, they have separate departments for “CDs & Vinyl” and “Digital Music” (though they didn’t _used_ to separate these, IIRC), but just one big department for “Movies & TV” which includes DVDs, Blu-Rays, video downloads, and I assume any VHS tapes they still sell. Beyond that, I stand by what I said earlier in Post #4. Amazon believes that a set of CDs intended to help you learn French is closer to being a kind of book than it is to fitting in any of the other departments they have. ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/33 "2015-02-05T06:13:46Z")
I hear ya, and to me nothing replaces the smell and feel of a new book. But its 2014, its not unreasonable for Amazon to promote Kindle and audio recordings as “books”. Even my local library has a “books on tape” and “books on CD” collection; if its good enough for librarians (there is a college degree in library science, BTW) then surely we can’t ask better out of a website. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 9:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/34 "2015-02-05T09:11:43Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > You still seem to be missing the point. It’s like if you went to an ice cream stand and asked for an ice cream cone. > > “Do you want vanilla, chocolate, strawberry, orange cream, or black raspberry?” > “Chocolate sounds good.” > “We only sell vanilla.” > > It’s not a problem that they only sell vanilla. The problem is offering the customer choices which you’re not prepared to follow through on. > > If Amazon isn’t going to filter their search results to only books then they shouldn’t ask customers if they want their search results to be filtered to only books. > > I’m not angry about this and I don’t see why you’d think I was. I’m annoyed about this. You’re an idiot for posting this in the pit in the first place and an idiot again for this mangled analogy. Amazon isn’t telling you there are some things they don’t sell, they are just using the top level concept of books in a manner you disagree with, and in a manner I bet most their customers **do** agree with. A more apt comparison would be this: Little Nemo arrives at ice cream stand. LN: I would like an ice cream cone. Vendor: What flavour would you like? LN: What do flavours ice cream do you have? V: I have vanilla, strawberry sherbet, chocolate, cho… LN: WTF, sherbet isn’t ice cream! Why are you including sherbets when I asked about ice cream. * * * When I search on “learning french” the line right over the results is this: Book Format:Kindle Edition|Paperback|Audio CD|Board Book If you want to go back in time you should visit a f… a physical book store. ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/35 "2015-02-05T09:25:54Z")
The really sad thing is, same thing happens to me when I use the on-line search function at the LIBRARY. It is all-in-all a terrible interface, though. I don’t know what goes wrong. I have searched for a specific author, let’s say Robert Williams. I specify that I am searching “author” and I am searching in “books.” I get 5 entries before I get to any Robert Williamses, the likes of William the Conquerer, William II (whoever he was), Julia Roberts, and a couple of things that seem to meet none of the elements my search criteria. Searching for any book, the first thing that comes up is usually an audible ebook, whatever that is. Then large print, then some video… At the LIBRARY. It should be all about the books. But it also rents out paintings and toys, that I know of… ETA: But sometimes it works. For instance I once couldn’t think of the name of Armistead Maupin, although eventually I remembered Armistead, and that worked. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 9:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/36 "2015-02-05T09:50:07Z")
Yeah, I’m not objecting to this pile on, since this is a moronic complaint. It seems you’ve somehow made it through life without learning how hierarchical categorization works. It doesn’t work the way you seem to think it does. Your choices of top level categories is “Books, Magazines, MP3 Downloads, Music, Classical Music,Movies & TV, and Toys & Games.” Those are the only choices. And all the items you mention fit best under Books. As you continue on, you are given a list of subcategories, dividing things up further. You have a link to choose what type of books you are looking for. Someone even posted a screenshot showing this to you. It’s right in front of your face. And how can anyone in the 2010s not realize that “book” doesn’t refer exclusively the paper kind? Audio **books** and e **books** are still books, just not in the traditional hardback or paperback forms. It’s still the same content–just the delivery method is different. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/37 "2015-02-05T20:22:25Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > Here - I made you a thing. > > [Imgur: The magic of the Internet](http://i.imgur.com/8TvXWW2.png) I think this needs to be re-emphasized. ---
**Author:** ![theR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/977dab/32.png) [@theR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/theR)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2015, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/38 "2015-02-05T21:45:02Z")
> [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > I think this needs to be re-emphasized. Absolutely! I think it’s also worth re-emphasizing that audio **books** , e- **books** , paperback **books** , and hardcover **books** are all, in this day and age, considered to be in the category called books. ---
**Author:** ![LibrarySpy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f9ae1b/32.png) [@LibrarySpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LibrarySpy)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2015, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/39 "2015-02-06T18:32:42Z")
Pimsleur Language Programs is the way to go. Even if she wants to learn reading and writing French. It’s the fastest and most immersive program, and what we always recommend to patrons wanting to learn a language. Amazon was clearly trying to help. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2015, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818/40 "2015-02-06T20:53:27Z")
> [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > I think this needs to be re-emphasized. It shows that Amazon is capable of separated books from non-books - on a second-level search. Why they don’t do it on a first-level search is my question. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youd-think-amazon-would-understand-the-concept-of-what-a-book-is/711818.md?page=3)