# Young inner-city males and work **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 30, 2012, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103 "2012-08-30T02:52:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![lavenderviolet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/cdc98d/32.png) [@lavenderviolet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lavenderviolet)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/21 "2012-08-30T15:57:44Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > 1. Many have criminal records, and no one will hire them. I think this is a huge factor. A much higher percentage of young black men have criminal records than other races: [Race in the United States criminal justice system - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_in_the_United_States_criminal_justice_system#Likelihood_of_going_to_prison) It’s hard enough finding a job nowadays even for well-educated people with decent job histories. Good luck finding a job if you have a criminal record, a spotty work history, and/or poor education. As far as the mothers not forcing them to look for work, it’s quite possible that their mothers grew up in an environment where this kind of behavior was normal and don’t even know where to begin in trying to get their sons on a better path. Also, I know from experience in trying to help a not very ambitious relative :rolleyes: that even if you do force someone to look for a job, they can easily sabotage things to ensure they don’t actually get the job. If you actually are concerned about the plight of young black men, I would suggest looking into getting involved in a mentoring program like Big Brothers Big Sisters. I personally feel that one of the biggest things we can do to help people who grow up in these kinds of environments is to provide a positive role model and a template for how to be successful. I do think that the issue of successful people leaving the ghettoes, leaving only those who don’t know or don’t care about how to do better in life as role models for the kids growing up there, is a huge factor in why these social problems continue. ---
**Author:** ![corlet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f14d63/32.png) [@corlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/corlet)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/22 "2012-08-30T16:21:19Z")
I’ll try this one more time. My question is, why do the parents and grandparents allow this? My neighbors work full time but they allow their 20 year old grandson to hang out on the street all day with his six or seven buddies. Why don’t they kick him out? That’s what is confusing me. Do the poor simply have different values that keep them from kicking them out? ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/23 "2012-08-30T16:32:59Z")
The [economy](http://www.bls.gov/news.release/youth.nr0.htm) sucks. > [@](#): > > The number of unemployed youth in July 2012 was 4.0 million, little changed from 4.1 million a year ago. The youth unemployment rate was 17.1 percent in July 2012. The unemployment rate for young men was 17.9 percent, in July 2012, and the rate for women was 16.2 percent. The jobless rate for whites was 14.9 percent, compared with 28.6 percent for blacks, 14.4 percent for Asians, and 18.5 percent for Hispanics. I don’t imagine kicking your kid out when almost 3 out of 10 of his peers is unemployed would be beneficial for anyone. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/24 "2012-08-30T16:36:51Z")
> [@corlet](#): > > Just keep ignoring the problem though. I’m sure it will go away. Hmmm. Nope. You still here. ---
**Author:** ![split\_p\_j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e19b73/32.png) [@split\_p\_j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/split_p_j)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/25 "2012-08-30T16:37:23Z")
> [@brujaja](#): > > I have lived, and now work, in Oakland. Since I do in-home care for elderly people there, I’m in a low-income residential area all day. So here’s my take on it: > > Yes, a lot of them are getting checks: SSI, welfare, whatever. But you can’t get a welfare check anymore unless you keep up a regular, _documented_ job search. Even then, it ain’t much at all – I’m talking like a $100 rent voucher that goes straight to your landlord, you don’t get much cash. And I venture to say that it’s pretty hard to get SSI these days unless you really do have an issue. However, there is money for, say, the children of veterans if they are in school. Don’t forget, a large number of this generation’s fathers served in the Gulf Wars. > > Also, a lot of the young men around here go to school at night, or have night jobs. They will congregate at certain parts of the day only; and never at others. Nightshifts are harder to fill and, sadly, more likely to be filled by people from low-income neighborhoods. > > Also, yes, a lot of them sell pot; but I don’t really have a problem with that. They’re always hella mellow to talk to. 😉 I think this is pretty much the case. I’m a black male and although I’m 40 and no longer young, I remember when I was. Most of the jobs I had at that age were food service or working in warehouses, part time for the most part of course. Plenty of time to hang out for most of the day and then go work for 6 hours or so and then hang out some more. My housemates (some of them were white) had pretty much the same routine, so at certain times it could appear that none of us jobs and all we did was hang out. I’ve been working since I was 15, and I’ve never had a regular 9-5 job. Even now, as an engineer at a major Class 1 railroad making close 100K a year, I still work mostly at night. I’m like the only one around in my apartment complex during the day. I’m sure some people think I’m a drug dealer too. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/26 "2012-08-30T16:44:03Z")
> [@corlet](#): > > I’ll try this one more time. My question is, why do the parents and grandparents allow this? My neighbors work full time but they allow their 20 year old grandson to hang out on the street all day with his six or seven buddies. Why don’t they kick him out? That’s what is confusing me. Do the poor simply have different values that keep them from kicking them out? Family ties can be very strong. It’s not all that uncommon for struggling adult children to live with their parents. In fact, the number of parents who would “kick them out” is probably lower than the number of parents who would help them. The more money you have, the less dependent you are on your own family, the more removed you are from that mindset and the less you understand it. If poor black families didn’t take care of each other, who would? If you owned a business, would you give that man a job? Why not? Can you imagine anyone actually giving him a job? Can you imagine being in a situation hopeless as his is? ---
**Author:** ![BlueOhio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/439d5e/32.png) [@BlueOhio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlueOhio)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/27 "2012-08-30T17:06:07Z")
Ask them? Or are they too Large and Angry? ---
**Author:** ![Sahirrnee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sahirrnee/32/13937_2.png) [@Sahirrnee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sahirrnee)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/28 "2012-08-30T17:19:43Z")
One of my best friends could be one of the young black men you are talking about. He grew up ghetto, both parents were drug addicts, doesn’t even know his real father, saw his first murder when he was 8, was stealing cars at 12. He has a record for possession of marijuana. He is also one of the most intelligent, compassionate, non judgmental, hard working people I know. He would love to have a job, try finding one in this economy, with or without a record. Try finding a job when you don’t have a car and don’t have access to one, and you can’t afford the insurance anyway. Until you have walked in their shoes you don’t know what it’s like. I live in a mostly white neighborhood in the suburbs and I can tell you at least 25% of the houses here have 3 and sometimes 4 generations living in them. There is NO work, young people are moving back home. The difference is, here everybody stays indoors. Why do the parents allow it? Most people aren’t going to throw their kids out on the street, and in some cases it’s the younger generation is helping to support the older ones. The sad thing is, most employers won’t hire somebody who isn’t already working. Most of them won’t even consider you, so the people who need the jobs the most are being passed over. A friend is screening apps for a start up company and he was told to throw away the apps of anybody not currently working. If people with good work histories who have been laid off can’t find a job, how in the hell are people who don’t have the advantages that most of us take for granted supposed to find work. ---
**Author:** ![Tristan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tristan/32/18058_2.png) [@Tristan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tristan)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/29 "2012-08-30T18:58:32Z")
Also, because it’s a shitty parent that would kick their kid out and make them homeless when there are little to no jobs to go around that allow one to make rent, pay bills and buy groceries. But you know that too, OP. ---
**Author:** ![MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c0e974/32.png) [@MPB\_in\_Salt\_Lake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MPB_in_Salt_Lake)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/30 "2012-08-30T19:12:06Z")
> [@corlet](#): > > Even Sven. Thanks for the intelligent non-answer. I do work. I see them mornings, when I come home at lunch and after work and on weekends. Does that answer your question? As for being stock traders or students, unlikely. They do nothing but hang out in front of the house all day long, every day. That is all they do. Chat up girls. Litter the street with beer cans and cigarette butts. I admitted I knew nothing about these young men, that’s why I posted the question, genius. Just keep ignoring the problem though. I’m sure it will go away. What kind of beer? ---
**Author:** ![Hampshire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hampshire/32/4887_2.png) [@Hampshire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hampshire)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/31 "2012-08-30T20:10:23Z")
> [@corlet](#): > > I’ll try this one more time. My question is, why do the parents and grandparents allow this? My neighbors work full time but they allow their 20 year old grandson to hang out on the street all day with his six or seven buddies. Why don’t they kick him out? That’s what is confusing me. Do the poor simply have different values that keep them from kicking them out? I don’t think it’s a universally ‘black’ or ‘poor’ problem. I know plenty of middle and upper class kids (as well as adult children) who live off their parents. Some parents just don’t have it in them to get tough with their own kids and kick em out. One of my dad’s friends (a white, 70 something, retired state civil engineer) had a couple of deadbeat adult kids who mooched off of him for years, putting him back into deep debt, forcing him to get another job (kids wouldn’t work), which eventually lead to an early death. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/32 "2012-08-30T20:30:32Z")
Malt liquor, of course. 😃 I can see where the OP is coming from even though I cringed at the way the question was framed. Still, at least he’s asking as opposed to sitting in a darkened room writing up a manifesto about how to kill the cock-a-roaches littering up his neighborhood. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/33 "2012-08-30T21:39:50Z")
> [@grude](#): > > That is what is hard to get about “ghetto” areas too, there is literally nothing but low income housing for miles usually. No shops, no restaurants, maybe a snack shop if they haven’t left yet. Perception becomes reality, and the other way around too. Anyone who can leave does, leaving behind those who can’t or won’t. Yeah, but where I live in Hoboken, NJ, there is litterally a 3 block ghettoish stretch of Jackson Street[where there are always dudes just hanging out day or night.](http://maps.google.com/maps?q=hoboken+nj&hl=en&ll=40.741952,-74.040199&spn=0.000001,0.000772&sll=37.6,-95.665&sspn=40.218517,101.25&hnear=Hoboken,+Hudson,+New+Jersey&t=h&z=21&layer=c&cbll=40.741952,-74.040199&panoid=_PyO_tS7hAcTpe_BzgssXA&cbp=12,273.09,,0,5.71) The rest of the city is relatively affluent. And it’s like one square mile anyway and 15 minutes from Manhattan. It’s just this one small section that stays “ghetto”. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/34 "2012-08-30T22:06:51Z")
> [@black\_rabbit](#): > > Seriously, what’s with all the white chicks walking around with yoga mats under their arms at 10AM on a Thursday? I’m completely serious when I say this: Whenever I have a daycation, and I see hordes of yuppies sitting on patios, or the classic set of white girls walking around with yoga mats, I’m like, “The fuck are these people doing? Don’t they have jobs?” I’d like to think on days where I have nowhere to be on a Thursday, everything will be empty, yet I see everyone and their dog loafing around. Get to work! ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/35 "2012-08-30T22:54:47Z")
> [@corlet](#): > > I’ll try this one more time. My question is, why do the parents and grandparents allow this? My neighbors work full time but they allow their 20 year old grandson to hang out on the street all day with his six or seven buddies. Why don’t they kick him out? That’s what is confusing me. Do the poor simply have different values that keep them from kicking them out? Actually, **corlet** , you are right. I actually know a few of the guys you must be talking about, and I see where you are coming from. I know a guy who dropped out of school, never got a job, and spends his life drifting from fleabag motel to fleabag motel. His stated goal in life is to sample every drug he can get his hands on, and enjoy the local women, paid or otherwise. It’s been years since he’s done anything productive, and I’m constantly amazed that he hasn’t been thrown in jail yet. I’ve know another guy who spends 99% of his time playing video games or making drama with his trashy abusive girlfriend (who has a one year old from another guy). From what I know, he sometimes does some auto repair work, but I’ve never actually heard of him actually going to work. Mostly he seems to hang out at his brother’s house doing drugs or crashing with his girlfriend in some sort of screwed up drama or another. Another guy I know is a bit more ambitious. He’s got all kinds of dreams and is quite intelligent despite dropping out of school, but the reality is that he’s hitting 30, has never worked for more than a month or two in his life waiting tables or working at the docks. Every time he gets a job, he gets bored of it and quits. Last I heard, he was trying to stick as a host at a restaurant long enough to get promoted to waiter. At one point, he was living in a commercial establishment which he had connections to. Mostly he seems to hang out playing video games and dicking around. Why do their parents and grandparents allow this? Do their parents have different values? Is something wrong with their culture? Have they just given up? Do they assume that they are the victim of racism and just don’t even try? Is something wrong with their families? I don’t know. Maybe you have to ask some millionaire, because all of the people I described have large trust funds, come from intact families, and are reasonably smart (one dropped out of his physics Phd. for example.) They’ve just all got other things they’d rather be doing than running the rat race. There are plenty of unambitious people at all levels of society who are happy to live a somewhat scaled back lifestyle in exchange for more free time, few responsibilities, and generally more ability to screw around. The rich ones waste their time away at nightclubs and resorts rather than on the street corner, but qualitatively it’s the same thing, just on a different scale. There are guys willing to live on 10k a month if it means not working, and there are guys (and gals) willing to live on 1k a month if it means not working. Why is one somehow worse than the other? ---
**Author:** ![mo50](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@mo50](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mo50)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/36 "2012-08-30T23:09:38Z")
Another factor to consider (sorry if mentioned before) is that alot of manufacturing/manual labor jobs that these guys might have otherwise been qualified for in the past have either gone out of the cities, out of the country, or are now done by immigrants (legal, illegal, whatever) who are willing to do the work for alot less than most Americans are. Not saying thats right/wrong, good or bad, just an observation. Also, I work in a high school n the Bronx, NY, certainly inner city, and there doesn’t seem to be as much emphasis on vocational training/placement of kids as there could or should be, at least to me. Again, purely anecdotal. Of course they could just be lazy f\*cks, but those kinda folks exist across races, classes, & ethnicities! (I was/am one of 'em). 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![mo50](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@mo50](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mo50)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2012, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/37 "2012-08-30T23:57:37Z")
Sorry, forgot to mention that in terms of why these guys aren’t kicked out of wherever they’re living: When I participate in parent/teacher conferences (I’m a school social worker), if a parent/guardian does appear, which is rare, I’ve often gotten the sense that the person (usually a young mom or grandmother) is so overwhelmed themselves by poverty, disability, addiction, or working several jobs, that the idea of having the energy/knowledge/gumption/ whatever you’d call it, to evict a healthy young male from their home is a tall order. There certainly are irresponsible parents, but it seems to me there are also frequently mitigating factors to keep in mind. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2012, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/38 "2012-08-31T00:07:34Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > I’m completely serious when I say this: Whenever I have a daycation, and I see hordes of yuppies sitting on patios, or the classic set of white girls walking around with yoga mats, I’m like, “The fuck are these people doing? Don’t they have jobs?” I’d like to think on days where I have nowhere to be on a Thursday, everything will be empty, yet I see everyone and their dog loafing around. Get to work! Hahaa! I always think, “Damn. Look at white folks. Independently wealthy. Don’t even gotta work. Lucky bastards.” ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2012, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/39 "2012-08-31T00:41:56Z")
Another thing to consider: \*someone \*is paying for their clothing. \*Someone \*is paying for their housing. \*Someone \*is paying for their food. \*Someone \*is paying for their beer and cigarettes. And maybe that’s all they want. Why work when you have everything you want? ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2012, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103/40 "2012-08-31T00:49:09Z")
No shit. Lazy yoga bitches. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-inner-city-males-and-work/633103.md?page=3)