# Young voters and gun laws...
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [February 23, 2018, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395 "2018-02-23T05:17:23Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 3
### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [February 24, 2018, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/42 "2018-02-24T14:24:57Z")
> [@Bone](#):
>
> Because at some point, a person is legally an adult or they are not. With adulthood come both privileges and responsibilities. I’m not saying that adulthood must be at 18. It could be 21, 25, 30, whatever. But whatever it is, it should be consistent.
There’s absolutely no requirement for this, though. Law can be as arbitrary as you like, and why must it be “you have to be an adult to buy X” versus “you must be 21 or over to buy X.”
> [@](#):
>
> Saying a person can vote, sign contracts, and serve in the armed forces but they can’t have a drink? That’s silly. It’s not a huge deal, but I’m a fan of consistency.
Well, take it up with the hobgoblins.
> [@](#):
>
> If the age for long guns were raised to 21 I don’t think that’s a fight worth having, other than to point out it’s inconsistent with the idea of the age of majority. I actually don’t think it’s a bad idea, though I do think it’d wreak havok on how the rest of society has been established to treat 18 year olds as an adult.
“Wreak havok”, really? What do you think will happen, people will start shooting up schools? How much “havok” do you see in a hypothetical:
Article 6, Paragraph B: On the purchase of firearms.
I. The required age for a person to legally purchase firearms in the state of Texachusetts is hereby set at 21, with the attached exceptions.
II. Convicted felons of any age are prohibited from purchasing firearms.
III. Persons with outstanding domestic protection orders…
IV. Persons with a state designation as being currently under treatment for mental illness…
V. through VIII. Other limitations…
IX. Persons under the age of 21 but over the age of 18 may legally purchase firearms if they are currently enrolled in and are in good standing with:
i. A branch of the United States Armed Forces.
ii. The National Guard of the state of Texachusetts.
iii. The enforcement division of a sheriff’s department or police department in a county or city in the state of Texachusetts.
Compared to the complexity of many existing laws, this is actually pretty tepidly straightforward. Little havok potential, here.
Anyway, even if a society decides that an arbitrary age is the clear demarcation of adulthood, simple biology laughs at such efforts and while some citizens may be sufficiently intellectually mature for the franchise and all other adult responsibilities at 17, others may not be even at 22. I have my doubts Nikolas Cruz was ever going to be trustworthy with firearms, but of course I’ve never met him.
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### Author:  [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)
#### Post date: [February 24, 2018, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/43 "2018-02-24T18:14:53Z")
I wrote that poorly. I meant wreak havoc if the age of majority were raised to 21. Changing the long gun minimum age to 21 is not a big deal.
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### Author:  [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)
#### Post date: [February 24, 2018, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/44 "2018-02-24T20:56:57Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#):
>
> Probably not. I think you’ve bought into a media narrative that isn’t terribly reflective of reality.
You are right…Millennials and younger have not been big at going to vote in the past.
If you’re up for it I will make you a $100 bet to the winner’s charity of choice that this trend reverses in 2018. (So they have to do better than the 17% or so turnout for a mid-term as seen [here](http://www.electproject.org/home/voter-turnout/demographics).)
Wanna take that bet?
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### Author:  [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)
#### Post date: [February 24, 2018, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/45 "2018-02-24T20:59:26Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#):
>
> You are right…Millennials and younger have not been big at going to vote in the past.
>
> If you’re up for it I will make you a $100 bet to the winner’s charity of choice that this trend reverses in 2018.
>
> Wanna take that bet?
Perhaps, but you’re going to have to be a bit more specific on the metrics of our bet.
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### Author:  [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)
#### Post date: [February 24, 2018, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/46 "2018-02-24T21:08:36Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#):
>
> Perhaps, but you’re going to have to be a bit more specific on the metrics of our bet.
Sorry…I edited my post after you replied (but did not see your reply).
The bottom age group (18-29) need to improve turnout in 2018 over the percentages shown [here](http://www.electproject.org/home/voter-turnout/demographics) from the 2014 midterm election.
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### Author:  [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)
#### Post date: [February 24, 2018, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/47 "2018-02-24T21:53:21Z")
Been seeing a lot of new, young faces at the various shooting ranges I frequent.
Kids (early/mid-twenties) sporting semi-autos (hand, long, and short guns); hipster kids, man-buns, kids with parti-colored hair/piercings/tats, some of them wearing apparel expressing graphically frank displeasure with the current occupant of 1600 Penn. Ave.
And more than a few of them wearing expressly pro-2 Ad./NRA stuff, too.
One memorable kid (for one, he was cute as hell; two, he was a dead-eyed-dick with his Smitty-Wess at 25 yards, and scored very well in the tac course and shoot house) had a pro-LGBT/rainbow-colored shirt with the “Molon Labe” logo on it. Good for him. Let the fag-bashers try some shit with him; they might get a whole lot more than they bargained for.
Now, I don’t know how many of them, if any, are single-issue voters; or, even, if they vote at all. But I’d wager that a fair number of them aren’t too keen on the idea of more gun laws, especially since the Broward shooting points out just as many, if not more, flaws in law enforcement and medical/social services as it does in any gun laws.
Point being, I think a lot of folks hoping and praying for young voters to change things more in line with their point(s)-of-view in the wake of Broward might not get the results they’re expecting, should the push come to shove.
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### Author:  [@tim-n-va](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim-n-va)
#### Post date: [February 24, 2018, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/48 "2018-02-24T22:01:48Z")
It will be interesting to watch. I can’t help but remember that if young voters had turned out like surveys indicated we would have had President Kerry in 2004.
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)
#### Post date: [February 24, 2018, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/49 "2018-02-24T23:15:11Z")
> [@ExTank](#):
>
> One memorable kid (for one, he was cute as hell; two, he was a dead-eyed-dick with his Smitty-Wess at 25 yards, and scored very well in the tac course and shoot house) had a pro-LGBT/rainbow-colored shirt with the “Molon Labe” logo on it. Good for him. Let the fag-bashers try some shit with him; they might get a whole lot more than they bargained for.
Who uses a revolver any more? Did he watch too many Dirty Harry movies?
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### Author:  [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)
#### Post date: [February 24, 2018, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/50 "2018-02-24T23:35:30Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#):
>
> Who uses a revolver any more? Did he watch too many Dirty Harry movies?
They’re plenty common and plenty enjoyable to use. Comfort is a big part of it, particularly for people with smaller hands. But overall feel and action are very different.
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### Author:  [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)
#### Post date: [February 24, 2018, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/51 "2018-02-24T23:58:56Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#):
>
> Who uses a revolver any more? Did he watch too many Dirty Harry movies?
😕 who said it was a revolver? Smith & Wesson makes plenty of semi-autos.
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### Author:  [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)
#### Post date: [February 25, 2018, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/52 "2018-02-25T00:08:16Z")
> [@andros](#):
>
> They’re plenty common and plenty enjoyable to use. Comfort is a big part of it, particularly for people with smaller hands. But overall feel and action are very different.
I thought the advantage of a revolver is reliability. They pretty much can’t jam as I (a non-gun user) understands it.
The complaint is once you’ve shot your six(ish) shots reloading is a pain compared to a semi-auto. My feeling is for the average Joe is if six shots are not sufficient to resolve the situation you are in a supremely unlikely situation to begin with so good luck (just as applied to Joe Schmo on the street).
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)
#### Post date: [February 25, 2018, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/53 "2018-02-25T00:41:24Z")
Bah I’ll take my trusty (not so) dusty Colt .45 M1A1 any day.
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#):
>
> I thought the advantage of a revolver is reliability. They pretty much can’t jam as I (a non-gun user) understands it.
I’ve cooked off thousands of rounds through my .45 and never had a misfire. Of course, I’m pretty much fanatical about cleaning it, and I don’t buy cheap ammo.
> [@](#):
>
> The complaint is once you’ve shot your six(ish) shots reloading is a pain compared to a semi-auto. My feeling is for the average Joe is if six shots are not sufficient to resolve the situation you are in a supremely unlikely situation to begin with so good luck (just as applied to Joe Schmo on the street).
A speed-loader takes just about the same amount of time as changing clips once you get the hang of it…but I still like the feel of the auto, and I can tell immediately when I’m out of ammo, if I didn’t already know.
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### Author:  [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)
#### Post date: [February 25, 2018, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/54 "2018-02-25T00:53:27Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#):
>
> I’ve cooked off thousands of rounds through my .45 and never had a misfire. Of course, I’m pretty much fanatical about cleaning it, and I don’t buy cheap ammo.
So reliability between semi-auto pistols and revolvers is not a real consideration? Even if the revolver is “more reliable” we are talking about something so rare as to not be an issue a gun user should consider when choosing a gun?
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)
#### Post date: [February 25, 2018, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/55 "2018-02-25T00:58:34Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#):
>
> So reliability between semi-auto pistols and revolvers is not a real consideration? Even if the revolver is “more reliable” we are talking about something so rare as to not be an issue a gun user should consider when choosing a gun?
I wouldn’t call a revolver more reliable as far as firing is concerned (or number of shots, for that matter). But shitty ammo or letting debris pile up in the barrel will definitely affect things. I can’t speak for other models, because this is the only one I’ve ever owned and used long-term, or particularly wanted to.
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### Author:  [@JXJohns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JXJohns)
#### Post date: [February 25, 2018, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/56 "2018-02-25T01:11:03Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#):
>
> So reliability between semi-auto pistols and revolvers is not a real consideration? Even if the revolver is “more reliable” we are talking about something so rare as to not be an issue a gun user should consider when choosing a gun?
With today’s modern semi auto’s they are pretty reliable. Keep them clean and a typical user will have no problems. The same can be said of revolvers. If not kept clean, they can fail. We are talking about being really dirty however to get to that point…
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### Author:  [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)
#### Post date: [February 25, 2018, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/57 "2018-02-25T01:22:54Z")
> [@JXJohns](#):
>
> With today’s modern semi auto’s they are pretty reliable. Keep them clean and a typical user will have no problems. The same can be said of revolvers. If not kept clean, they can fail. We are talking about being really dirty however to get to that point…
QFT. The main problem I’ve seen with semi-autos are bad mag springs and/or dented/deformed/misaligned mag followers. Every so often, you get a gun with a steep or narrow feed ramp that doesn’t care for certain types/makes of ammo.
I’ve yet to see a revolver so gummed up/dirty that it won’t shoot, but am aware that it can happen.
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### Author:  [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)
#### Post date: [February 25, 2018, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/58 "2018-02-25T01:26:14Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#):
>
> A speed-loader takes just about the same amount of time as changing clips once you get the hang of it…but I still like the feel of the auto, and I can tell immediately when I’m out of ammo, if I didn’t already know.
I hear that can be difficult with a revolver 🙂
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### Author:  [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)
#### Post date: [February 25, 2018, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/59 "2018-02-25T02:26:25Z")
Sometimes my Twitter feed serves up something better than our sequential threads…
Tweet 1 - “Emma4Change now has more followers than the NRA. The young people will win.”
Tweet 2 - Emma retweets a [RegisterTVoteFlorida.gov](http://RegisterTVoteFlorida.gov) link
Tweet 3 - A retweet of NRA’s Dana Loesch saying “Teenagers piss me off”
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### Author:  [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)
#### Post date: [February 25, 2018, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/60 "2018-02-25T02:32:07Z")
To be fair, that was an old tweet of Dana’s - but the sequence was hilarious.
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### Author:  [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)
#### Post date: [February 25, 2018, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/young-voters-and-gun-laws/809395/61 "2018-02-25T03:01:17Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#):
>
> …but I still like the feel of the auto, and I can tell immediately when I’m out of ammo, if I didn’t already know.
Brings to mind this scene from the movie [Deadpool](https://youtu.be/tLmStxxzhkI?t=30).
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