# "Your Claim is Untrue" is Not Allowed? **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [August 12, 2014, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374 "2014-08-12T16:17:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2014, 8:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/41 "2014-08-18T08:33:34Z")
There appears to be room for disagreement on your first point. Some would take the position that in order for a falsehood to be a lie, the utterer must know it to be false. Under this rubric, there can be no such.thing as an “inadverrtent” lie. But I’m only posting in this thread at all to test whether my phone will send a post. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2014, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/42 "2014-08-18T11:17:08Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > I gotta agree with **Shodan** as well: nothing in that post was out of line or even close to becoming out of line. Word. Methinks that there are a lot of mods getting too overly watchful; that isn’t a problem, per se, yet, it provokes them to make some really goofy calls and give warnings/etc… that are uncalled for. On top of that, it leads to more and more stretches-to say “I disagree” makes a clear implication that the poster would believe a statement to be ‘untrue’. What, then, should the one be censured for calling the other a liar??? Isn’t there room for an ‘agree to disagree’ anymore??? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2014, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/43 "2014-08-18T12:14:47Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > There appears to be room for disagreement on your first point. Some would take the position that in order for a falsehood to be a lie, the utterer must know it to be false. Under this rubric, there can be no such.thing as an “inadverrtent” lie. In general, I think that’s pretty much the only way to distinguish between lying and just being wrong. There might be borderline cases where (for example) someone ignorantly repeats a blatantly obvious lie that has already been widely exposed and debunked - in that case, it may not be true to say “you are a liar”, but the challenge: “that thing you just said is a lie” may be correct (although against the rules here to say either). ---
**Author:** ![jimbuff314](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c57346/32.png) [@jimbuff314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jimbuff314)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2014, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/44 "2014-08-18T20:49:02Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > […] But I’m only posting in this thread at all to test whether my phone will send a post. Why would your phone not send a post? Has someone _lied_ to you? ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/45 "2014-08-19T03:01:41Z")
> [@jimbuff314](#): > > Does “your claim is untrue” = “this thing which you typed here is not the truth”? > And does that not = “you lied” - advertantly, inadvertantly - how are we to know? No. There is no equivalence. “Your claim is untrue”, “This thing which you typed here is not the truth”, merely make the point that the statement is false. Untrue. So I I were to state that babe Ruth hit more home runs than any other baseball player, you can fairly say, “Tour claim is untrue”. I might be lying. Or I might just be ill-informed. Without strong, near-definitive evidence that I KNOW that the statement I make is untrue, the assumption has to be that I was merely incorrect. “Oh, I forgot about Hank Aaron, Mark McQuire, and Sammy Sosa. Thanks.” ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/46 "2014-08-19T04:14:19Z")
This thread has offered no clarity whatsoever. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/47 "2014-08-19T04:41:48Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > This thread has offered no clarity whatsoever. That is not necessarily unfalse. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/48 "2014-08-19T22:09:48Z")
> [@jimbuff314](#): > > Why would your phone not send a post? > > Has someone _lied_ to you? I don’t really know what was going on. I kept trying to post this message to a thread in GD. It was long-ish, but it Just. Would. Not. Go. Through. Very frustrating. I wound up printing it from a WordPad page, bringing it home, and rewriting it on my own computer. ---
**Author:** ![jimbuff314](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c57346/32.png) [@jimbuff314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jimbuff314)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2014, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/49 "2014-08-20T02:38:36Z")
Weird. My big beefs (that’s not _beeves_, is it?) with phone posting is Autocorrect (although it’s getting better, as it ‘learns’) and my big fat fingers. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2014, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/50 "2014-08-20T13:14:51Z")
> [@jimbuff314](#): > > (that’s not _beeves_, is it?) Cattle. ---
**Author:** ![jimbuff314](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c57346/32.png) [@jimbuff314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jimbuff314)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2014, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/51 "2014-08-21T00:31:00Z")
At least not b[del]o[/del]ullocks, eh? > [@Mangetout](#): > > Cattle. > [@jimbuff314](#): > > Weird. My big [del] **beefs** [/del] cattle (that’s not _**[del]beeves[/del]**_ _cattle_, is it?) with phone posting is Autocorrect (although it’s getting better, as it ‘learns’) and my big fat fingers. Thanks. FTFM. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/52 "2014-09-05T02:15:23Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > That is not necessarily unfalse. Reported. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![TubaDiva](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tubadiva/32/507_2.png) [@TubaDiva](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TubaDiva)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/53 "2014-09-05T04:22:11Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > What started off as a simple post soon became a movement… But you still have to pick up the garbage. (However, you can still get anything you want.) ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/54 "2014-09-05T15:28:54Z")
Still no clarity. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/55 "2014-09-05T15:55:33Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > Still no clarity. Our apologies. **Jonathan Chance** intended to deal with this quite a while ago but we was busy and it was eventually lost in the shuffle. The mods discussed this issue while this thread was more active and concluded that **Shodan** did not break the rules here. “Your claim is untrue” means the claim is incorrect and is not equivalent to saying the poster is lying. ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2014, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/56 "2014-09-05T16:01:57Z")
Thank you, **Marley23**! I’m sure I’m not alone in appreciating that this decision was made, and correctly, I might add. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2014, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374/57 "2014-09-08T01:22:12Z")
No problem - thanks for the response. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/your-claim-is-untrue-is-not-allowed/695374.md?page=2)