Um, Arcite, I think you may have had problems parsing my sentence. Sloppy writing on my part.
I’ll rewrite it so that it makes more sense:
If ‘Vincent’ had spoken perfect English with, say, a midwest accent, fulfilled the order perfectly, and the customer went away satisfied, then where would the problem be?
I’ve actually got a case for an Indian guy on my desk right now. His first name is actually John, even on his birth certificate, and his last name is obviously of Portuguese origin. Same for his wife’s maiden name. It happens all the time.
I see other people’s birth certificates and marriage certificates and passports from other countries all the time, and you’d be surprised how common it is for people in countries with native languages other than English to give their kids Anglophone first names, or in Hong Kong, Chinese first names and Anglophone middle names (often the people with Anglophone middle names will choose to use them rather than their first names in the U.S., but then a lot of Americans do that, too, if they don’t like their first names). And whenever I’m not speaking English, it’s easier just to translate my first name into whatever foreign language (that’s the nice thing about Old Testament names; there’s always a translation!) It’s convenience, nothing more sinister.
For some reason, there also seem to be a lot of Salvadorans named Nelson.
I don’t see why – as long as the person is reasonably coherent. I work in New York City which is chock full of service representatives with foreign-sounding names. If they are polite, can understand me, and are reasonably coherent, it’s no problem at all.
I’d love to do business only with companies that do not engage in deceptive practices. Maybe before I sign up for anything, I’ll ask “Does your company engage in deceptive practices?” :rolleyes:
I kind of figured that’s what you meant, but what I was saying was that, while there would strictly speaking be no problem with the actual customer service in that hypothetical scenario, the fact is that the Vincents of the world speak poor English with thick accents, and thus real-life experience with overseas call centers to date has been that they don’t provide good service because customers can’t understand them.
The company that my full time job is with is actually owned by a much larger umbrella company, that owns companies all over the globe. So these other companies are our sister companies.
The mother company does a great job of keeping us informed of how and what the other companies are doing. A monthly newsletter is sent out to everyone. One side is in English, the other side is in Dutch or Norwegian (I think).
Anyway, there are always pictures of employees from the Far East included in these newsletters.
Not a single “native” name among them. They all have real names such as “Paul,” and “Gary,” and “Steve.” I find that hilarious every time I see it.
As a side note, it’s not only an American / Foreign thing. When I worked as a telemarketer, I was told that when I called the southern part of the US, I should change my last name to something ‘less Jewish’. Was I offended? Not really. Sort of amused. I did it, it didn’t bother me. Some times you gotta do what you gotta do.
There was recently a documentary on TV here (Australia in the absence of location) about this very thing. It followed groups of Indian call centre staff learning to be faux Americans/Australians. They even go to the extent of keeping up to date with your local weather so they can pretend they are in the same city. It was pretty funny watching them getting depressed because they couldn’t fake a different nationality well enough. They all attended “schools” to learn how to pretend to be American/Australian.
There’s been the same TV programme in the UK; Indian’s learning UK culture and accent. Except the one I recall was cold-calling, rather than call centre. They were told to say they were based in London, as that is metropolitan enough to explain just about any accent.
Lesson No 1 was : “What is Marmite & Branston Pickle?”
I oversee call centers here and in India for my company.
Agents in Mumbai and Chennai go through weeks of accent nuetralization training, choose American names, watch American movies and try to get up to speed on simple American slang. “Get to know America” and other cheesey stuff. Heck, our vendor there was showing them nothing but Gangster Rap movies and videos, thinking that was a good cultural influence.
It is nothing but headaches. These are good people over there and they are unprepared to engage in heavy convos about credit cards, loans, and intricate details of an American and their finances.
I know first hand.
But the corporate bean counters see their salary as 3500 per year instead of 35,000.
But how would this Indian person calling himself by an Indian name assure you that the company wasn’t engaged in so-called deceptive practices? Because then you’d “know” he wasn’t physically in this country? Are there no people with foreign names and accents living here? Did you ask him where exactly he was and he lied to you?
How does having a supervisor who doesn’t work in the same location equal “deceptive”? Have you never heard of telecommuting? If you are dealing with someone working for his company from home (whether you know it or not) and you have a problem and he says, “I’ll have to patch you to my office manager to deal with that” is that also being deceptive? Should he have stated up front that he wasn’t actually in the office, just so you’d know?
Really, the only valid point you have in your rant is having to deal with someone who cannot be clearly understood, due to accent or lack of knowledge of English. Otherwise you’re spouting nonsense.
I have no idea what your point is here. Previously, you seemed to be saying that if I objected to being lied to, I should not do business with companies that lie. My proposal of asking companies in advance whether or not they lie was facetious and intended to show how ridiculous your argument is. I have no idea what your response means.
The supervisor was referred to as a “floor supervisor.” This suggests phsycial proximity.
I find it a bit strange myself. I’ve played cricket with a lot of guys from India, and none of them decided to go by an “Americanized” (or “UKised”) name. I just think it’s second nature that someone I know might be called Ashish or Chandra or Zain. When I’ve dealt with people from call centers in India I’ve almost been tempted to ask them for their real name.
Though here’s one man from India whose name would be pretty familiar in the US: David Johnson.
You are only making yourself sound more and more like a blowhard.
You said in your first post: “Now, I know it’s remotely possible that “Vincent” is really named Vincent, but come on. Much more likely that his name is “Bharat” or “Sanjoy” and someone told him to pick an American-sounding name to use for his work. And calling someone a “floor supervisor” when she is half a world away is deceptive too [emphasis mine].”
Therefore, you are suggesting that calling himself by an American name is deceptive, since having a “floor” supervisor is deceptive TOO. So my question is, “How would this Indian person calling himself by an Indian name assure you that the company wasn’t engaged in so-called deceptive practices?” It wouldn’t, as any rational person can see.
You probably shouldn’t make facetious statements that are no more strange than your serious ones. If you are really and truly annoyed about having to deal with companies who engage in what you believe to be deceptive practices, then you SHOULD ask them about whatever areas you’re concerned with. There is nothing wrong with doing that.
Yes, but so what? You’ve completely missed the point.
Let me ask you a question:
Do you agree that its valid to object to deceptive practices on the part of a company? Or do you think that if a company tries to deceive me, it’s completely my fault for having done business with a company that deceives people?
Err, I put in the roll-eyes smiley.
I am concerned about any and all deceptive practices. Thus, (apparently) according to you, before I sign a loan document; before I sit down in a restaurant; before I sign a lease; before I enter any kind of deal, I should ask the person if they engage in deceptive practices. If I fail to do so, then I have no valid complaint if I get lied to or cheated. Is that your position?
Apart from the question of the dubious practice of outsourcing, doesn’t the call service have an obligation to hire employees who speak English clearly? If the guy’s Hindi accent is too thick to be comprehensible to a Western caller, then the customer is receiving bad service. It is the responsiblity of the company to please the client, not the reverse.
If you feel you’re getting bad service from overseas call centers, then you should let the company know. They’re going for the bottom line, and most people don’t care enough to take their business elsewhere. CSRs in the US would thank you.
I work in a customer service call center myself. I was a representative (now a supervisor) and I can completely understand why people make up different names. Even vaguely uncommon names cause you to have to constantly repeat yourself. My name is somewhat uncommon, but common enough to have been the name of several sitcom characters in my lifetime, and is one syllable. Yet, I have had to repeat the 3 letter spelling (not even the pronunciation, the spelling!) to some customers 4 or 5 times because they act like it’s a name from a different galaxy. Some people even openly laughed at this “bizarre” name, or say “That’s the oddest name I’ve ever heard!” I had to try to drag people back from the subject at hand, as they were always asking if it was a nickname or my “real” name.
Some days, I really considered calling myself Jane or something, but we give out our names as identification so I imagine I would have had to get permission. It’s confusing, as our names are listed on the account, so if a customer says “I called back last week and talked to Jane” a newer rep might get really confused.
Some people with foreign names did go by “Mike” or “Steve”. In a way, it’s positive - when people screaming at me use my real name, it’s harder to stay professional and unemotional. I’ve heard of folks with Muslim-sounding names like Muhammed getting a lot of slack from customers or just generally more hostility. All-American names put people at ease, just as midwestern accents do.
The single and only problem I have with the current trend of outsourcing customer service jobs, is the fact that in my experience, 5 times out of 6, I simply cannot understand them because their accent is so heavy.
Now mind you, I have worked with people of many different nationalities in my life, and a great number of them had accents. It takes alot of work and time to lose a native accent. Heck, some people never do. That’s not a problem…I actually really enjoy working with such a diverse population, and enjoy listening to the various accents.
However, when I am having a problem with something such as my Compaq computer (which I did a while back) and need you to help me troubleshoot it, it helps if I can understand what the hell you’re saying. People with thick, heavy accents should probably not work at a CALL CENTER where speaking is your only way of communicating with me. See, if I’m in the same room as you, and I can’t understand what you’re saying, you have other resources you can use to communicate. You can gesture, motion, even write it down like one girl I worked with, whose thick Russian accent sometimes made it hard to understand her.
But, if you cannot communicate to me the information I need in any way, then you do me zero good as a customer service representative.