# You're at home and someone breaks in. Do you shoot/kill them? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 23, 2005, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019 "2005-12-23T21:52:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Nic2004](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/4491bb/32.png) [@Nic2004](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nic2004)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2005, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/61 "2005-12-26T15:58:58Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > [TAP ammo.](http://www.hornady.com/story.php?s=149) Good link. I’ll check into these on my next range/gun show trip. Thanks ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2005, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/62 "2005-12-26T16:08:04Z")
What do I do? Depends on where he is. If there is nothing between him and the nearest available exit, he can go. If moving towards the nearest available exit means that he would approach something valuable - me, my wife, my children - then he will lie face-down on the floor and not think too loud while I dial 911. Whether or not I shoot him before he lies down is entirely up to him. And if I do have to shoot him, I’m pretty sure he had that kitchen knife when I first spotted him. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![lalaith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/96bed5/32.png) [@lalaith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lalaith)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2005, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/63 "2005-12-26T18:27:25Z")
> [@bdgr](#): > > Cite? The penal code here lists a whole slew of things you can legitimately use deadly force on, trespassing is not one of them. Also, most of the things that it says you can shoot someone for while you wouldnt go to jail for (you would go before a grand jury and the attorney fees would eat you alive) you are still civily liable for. For example, if someone is vandalizing your car after dark on your property you could shoot them and maybe not go to jail but you would most likely be sued by the persons family and lose. > > A good summary of the self defense laws in Texas. > [http://www.self-defender.net/law3.htm](http://www.self-defender.net/law3.htm) I heard about this on the national news (TV). A homeowner shot a college student who mistakenly came to his house. As tragic as the situation was, legally he was within the law. You can check out the following: > **[Trespass](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trespass)** > > Trespass is an area of criminal law or tort law broadly divided into three groups: trespass to the person, trespass to chattels, and trespass to land. > Trespass to the person historically involved six separate trespasses: threats, assault, battery, wounding, mayhem (or maiming), and false imprisonment. Through the evolution of the common law in various jurisdictions, and the codification of common law torts, most jurisdictions now broadly recognize three trespasses to the person: assault, which i... According to the article you can only shoot trespassers after dark. I’m guessing that means process servers try to do their work in the daytime. (Because how can you tell a process server from a trespasser? I’ve wondered about that myself.) ---
**Author:** ![lalaith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/96bed5/32.png) [@lalaith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lalaith)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2005, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/64 "2005-12-27T00:06:43Z")
I knew if I kept looking long enough that I could find the actual Texas penal code itself: Penal Code Justification Excluding Criminal Responsibility [http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/statutes/docs/PE/content/htm/pe.002.00.000009.00.htm](http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/statutes/docs/PE/content/htm/pe.002.00.000009.00.htm) > [@](#): > > SUBCHAPTER D. PROTECTION OF PROPERTY > § 9.41. PROTECTION OF ONE’S OWN PROPERTY. (a) A person > in lawful possession of land or tangible, movable property is > justified in using force against another when and to the degree the > actor reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to > prevent or terminate the other’s trespass on the land or unlawful > interference with the property. > (b) A person unlawfully dispossessed of land or tangible, > movable property by another is justified in using force against the > other when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force > is immediately necessary to reenter the land or recover the > property if the actor uses the force immediately or in fresh pursuit > after the dispossession and: > (1) the actor reasonably believes the other had no > claim of right when he dispossessed the actor; or > (2) the other accomplished the dispossession by using > force, threat, or fraud against the actor. > > Acts 1973, 63rd Leg., p. 883, ch. 399, § 1, eff. Jan. 1, 1974. > Amended by Acts 1993, 73rd Leg., ch. 900, § 1.01, eff. Sept. 1, > 1994. > § 9.42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is > justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or > tangible, movable property: > (1) if he would be justified in using force against the > other under Section 9.41; and > (2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the > deadly force is immediately necessary: > (A) to prevent the other’s imminent commission of > arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the > nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime; or > (B) to prevent the other who is fleeing > immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated > robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the > property; and > (3) he reasonably believes that: > (A) the land or property cannot be protected or > recovered by any other means; or > (B) the use of force other than deadly force to > protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or > another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury. > > Acts 1973, 63rd Leg., p. 883, ch. 399, § 1, eff. Jan. 1, 1974. > Amended by Acts 1993, 73rd Leg., ch. 900, § 1.01, eff. Sept. 1, > 1994. > § 9.43. PROTECTION OF THIRD PERSON’S PROPERTY. A person > is justified in using force or deadly force against another to > protect land or tangible, movable property of a third person if, > under the circumstances as he reasonably believes them to be, the > actor would be justified under Section 9.41 or 9.42 in using force > or deadly force to protect his own land or property and: > (1) the actor reasonably believes the unlawful > interference constitutes attempted or consummated theft of or > criminal mischief to the tangible, movable property; or > (2) the actor reasonably believes that: > (A) the third person has requested his protection > of the land or property; > (B) he has a legal duty to protect the third > person’s land or property; or > © the third person whose land or property he > uses force or deadly force to protect is the actor’s spouse, parent, > or child, resides with the actor, or is under the actor’s care. > > Acts 1973, 63rd Leg., p. 883, ch. 399, § 1, eff. Jan. 1, 1974. > Amended by Acts 1993, 73rd Leg., ch. 900, § 1.01, eff. Sept. 1, > 1994. If I’m reading this right and “movable property” includes your car, does this mean if you catch someone vandalizing your car in a parking lot at night that you can kill them? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2005, 7:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/65 "2005-12-27T07:03:06Z")
> [@yojimbo](#): > > I’ve walked in on burglars. One took out a rather big knife and I thought to myself “bollocks, I’m going to die in this poxey flat\*” > > I said “Lads you’ve got what you’ve got. Just leave with that”. Luckily the did and I lost about a hundred DVDs. I cried when they left. It was really terrifying and emasculating. > > If I had of had a gun on me and I was comfortable in it’s use I almost certainly would have used it when that cunt pulled a knife. I’d have felt 100% justified as well. > > That said I am 100% behind my country’s gun control laws i.e. NO GUNS FOR SELF DEFENCE JUST SPORT AND ANIMAL CONTROL. > > Although there are many situations were guns could be useful IMO overall less people die as a result of the population not having easy access to guns. I realise this is a very non-American way of looking at it but it seems to be the consensus over here 🙂 > > \*For our American cousins. Shit, I’m going to die in this shitty apartment While I respect your support of your gun laws I’d like to see the long term consequences of crime as a result of it. I don’t have a gun at this time but my house is set up for the event of home invasion. I can retire to a defensible spot that allows me to fight a gun-wielding intruder with a bat. He will be as dead as if I used a gun so I guess my response would be to flee if my life was not in danger and shoot if it was. If I lived in a local that frowned on personal protection then they would have to retrieve the body from a nearby river. I don’t feel obligated to suffer a life threatening attack with a prison sentence. yojimbo, your American translation was spot on so you must have a few Hollywood movies in your DVD collection. And that was certainly a chunk of change if you lost 100 movies. ---
**Author:** ![Tristan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tristan/32/18058_2.png) [@Tristan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tristan)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2005, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/66 "2005-12-27T07:14:35Z")
Pretty much the tail ending of what Shodan said. Get their attention, so that the entry wound is in the “frontish” part of the torso. The kitchen knife in their hands won’t fall far from the body, I’m sure. If convicted, which I doubt (line: I was in fear for my life and the life of my loved ones) I will do the time standing on my head, as I won’t have done anything wrong by my own moral code. ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2005, 7:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/67 "2005-12-27T07:22:52Z")
> [@lalaith](#): > > I knew if I kept looking long enough that I could find the actual Texas penal code itself: > > Penal Code > Justification Excluding Criminal Responsibility > [http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/statutes/docs/PE/content/htm/pe.002.00.000009.00.htm](http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/statutes/docs/PE/content/htm/pe.002.00.000009.00.htm) > If I’m reading this right and “movable property” includes your car, does this mean if you catch someone vandalizing your car in a parking lot at night that you can kill them? YEah, notice tresspass is not in there. Criminally yes you can kill them if you catch them stealing your hubcaps after dark. Civily you will get your ass sued off by their family. ---
**Author:** ![lalaith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/96bed5/32.png) [@lalaith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lalaith)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2005, 9:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/68 "2005-12-27T09:50:52Z")
> [@bdgr](#): > > YEah, notice tresspass is not in there… My underlining: > [@](#): > > § 9.41. PROTECTION OF ONE’S OWN PROPERTY. (a) A person > in lawful possession of land or tangible, movable property is > justified in using force against another when and to the degree the > actor reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to > prevent or terminate the other’s trespass on the land or unlawful > interference with the property. > § 9.42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is > justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or > tangible, movable property: > (1) if he would be justified in using force against the > other under Section 9.41; and > (2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the > deadly force is immediately necessary: > (A) to prevent the other’s imminent commission of > arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the > nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime The assumption behind this, the assumption behind the case I originally heard about, is that if someone is on your property at night it’s for no good reason. That college kid who was killed had not done a thing besides inadvertently trespassed. He was not going to be doing anything illegal besides the trespassing. The homeowner believed he needed to use deadly force for protection and the law allows it. Don’t like the way the way the statute is being interpreted in real life, move to Texas (if you’re not already there) and argue with the state legislature. You asked for a cite. I provided two. > [@bdgr](#): > > Criminally yes you can kill them if you catch them stealing your hubcaps after dark. Civily you will get your ass sued off by their family. That’s an interesting point. Can you be sued for doing something legal? Yes. Will the case be successful if your actions were legal? Not in Florida. (The new law here in Florida provides protection against civil charges. The dead person’s family can sue, but if it turns out that the using of deadly force was legal, the dead person’s family will lose and have to pay the defendant’s legal fees. Since I expect you’ll ask for a cite on _that_, see below. The law in Florida relates to defense of person. As far as I know, in Florida you can’t shoot someone for vandalizing your car in a parking lot at night.) Don’t know the law in Texas about civil liability. Since you bring up the point, feel free to look it up. Or to quote you, “Cite?” Florida’s Stand Your Ground Law > [@](#): > > [Division of Elections - Florida Department of State](http://election.dos.state.fl.us/laws/05laws/ch_2005-027.pdf) > > “providing immunity from criminal prosecution or civil action for using deadly force” > > “Whereas, the Legislature finds that it is proper for law-abiding people to protect themselves, their families, and others from intruders and attackers without fear of prosecution or civil action for acting in defense of themselves and others” > > “The court shall award reasonable attorney’s fees, court costs, compensation for loss of income, and all expenses incurred by the defendant in defense of any civil action brought by a plaintiff if the court finds that the defendent is immune from prosecution as provided in subsection (1).” ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2005, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/69 "2005-12-27T13:52:16Z")
Hell yes, I’d shoot him. Last time I had to deal with an intruder, I did it barehanded and naked. I exploited the element of surprise and gave him the mother of all beatings. If there is to be a next time, I want a gun. And clothes. ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2005, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/70 "2005-12-27T21:28:26Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > If there is to be a next time, I want a gun. And clothes. Nah, the nudity probably won half the battle for you. I wouldn’t want to fight barehanded with someone who’s manhood was slapping in my face 😛 I own nothing of that much value that I can’t just say to an intruder, “take it and leave its not worth that much to me.” But then I couldn’t say how much anger I might feel seeing someone taking my property 😕 ---
**Author:** ![FlyingCowOfDoom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyingcowofdoom/32/21776_2.png) [@FlyingCowOfDoom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlyingCowOfDoom)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2005, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/71 "2005-12-27T21:49:48Z")
I would simply shoot the intruder with my X26. No warning is necessary, and no worries about killing him or her. If I wanted to, I could then proceed to beat the crap out of the intrudrer while he/she was electrically paralyzed writing on the floor in pain, just to reinforce my displeasure with him/her. [Taser X26](http://www.taser.com/self_defense/x26c_features.htm) –FCOD ---
**Author:** ![buns3000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c89c15/32.png) [@buns3000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buns3000)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2005, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/72 "2005-12-28T02:49:50Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > Perhaps if England didn’t have such strict gun laws, there would be fewer burglaries? Perhaps not. Perhaps just more dead folks. ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2005, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/73 "2005-12-28T03:08:00Z")
> [@lalaith](#): > > My underlining: > > The assumption behind this, the assumption behind the case I originally heard about, is that if someone is on your property at night it’s for no good reason. That college kid who was killed had not done a thing besides inadvertently trespassed. He was not going to be doing anything illegal besides the trespassing. The homeowner believed he needed to use deadly force for protection and the law allows it. IIRC, the person in question was inside their house. Generally the courts around here consider that reason to assume they mean you harm. He was not shot for trespassing. > [@](#): > > Don’t like the way the way the statute is being interpreted in real life, move to Texas (if you’re not already there) and argue with the state legislature. You asked for a cite. I provided two. I’ve lived in texas for 40 years (except for a brief stint in utah). I worked armed security for abou 15 years of that (both full and part time) and I had to take a 40 hour long class on precisely who you can shoot and why. I’ve also talked to lawyers and cops about it quite a bit. I’m pretty familiar with the law. In fact, I have arrested people for trespass before. The cite you provided (Wikipedia doesnt count) but the actual penal code says NOTHING about shooting someone for trespassing. People who have done here over the time I’ve lived here have wound up indicted for it. > [@](#): > > That’s an interesting point. Can you be sued for doing something legal? Yes. > > Will the case be successful if your actions were legal? Not in Florida. (The new law here in Florida provides protection against civil charges. The dead person’s family can sue, but if it turns out that the using of deadly force was legal, the dead person’s family will lose and have to pay the defendant’s legal fees. Since I expect you’ll ask for a cite on _that_, see below. The law in Florida relates to defense of person. As far as I know, in Florida you can’t shoot someone for vandalizing your car in a parking lot at night.) Don’t know the law in Texas about civil liability. Since you bring up the point, feel free to look it up. Or to quote you, “Cite?” > > Florida’s Stand Your Ground Law There is no provision in texas law offering protection against civil liability in this case. I can not prove a negative. It is not in the penal code. So I guess my only cite for it is the copy of the penal code you posted from…its not there. Conealed handgun, and security classes in the state all teach that the likelyhood is that you will be sued and that you will lose. Since their cirriculim is not online I cant show you that. Come here, shoot someone for trespass, and see where it gets you. This isn’t the wild west anymore. ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2005, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/74 "2005-12-28T18:04:17Z")
> [@Padeye](#): > > The scenario sounds more like a home invasion which is much more threatening than a burglary. In any event I believe the only reason to use deadly force if for an **immediate** threat to my life or that of my family. That doesn’t mean shooting a fleeing burglar in the back as he escapes. All other things being equal I would much rather watch a burgler get away than to have his bleeding corpse in my house. > > He’s going to be fleeing with a load in his pants. My home defense weapon is a 12 guage pump shotgun with a weapon light. The light is bright enough to temporarily blind someone even in daylight. It also ensures that I am able to evaluate him as a threat. A good tactical light is first line of defense that can send someone running. If that and the sound of racking the shotgun doesn’t do it I am not fucking around with “shooting to wound.” What he said. Give 'em a RACK-CLACK of the 12 ga., say “Hi there!” in a friendly, cheerfull voice, and then ask them to please not move as I just got new carpet and don’t want to have to replace it again so soon. Let them know the A-thauri-ties (pronounce it just like that) are on their way to collect them up, and ask the intruder if they want I should call 911 back and let them know to send the Coroner along, as well. If that don’t give 'em pause, and they’re still intent on advancing further on me or into my home, then they’re either too stupid or too crazy to be allowed to remain in the gene pool, and I will STOP them with whatever force I feel is appropriate. And since I already have the shotgun in my hands (a Mossberg 500 shorty, with laser pointer and a nice, bright Tac Light mounted on the barrel), with a round up the spout… > [@Martin Hyde](#): > > Prosecutors are people too. Most of the time if you give a good statement to the police, and they really believe it was self-defense, they aren’t going to try to railroad you and may end up not indicting you at all. Seconded. The one time I actually pulled a gun on someone was to defend someone else, and the prosecutors could’ve nailed me on breaking and entering, trespassing, and whatever it is when you point a deadly weapon at someone, threaten violence, but don’t actually commit violence (some form of assault). But the prosecutor didn’t press charges. I just got a stern lecture from the cops about the perils of intervening in a domestic dispute, especially a violent one. > [@GuanoLad](#): > > There seems to be rather a lot of people in this thread saying “I’ve always wanted to shoot/kill someone.” That’s a bit frightening, really. Not I. Not for any deeply moral reasons, mind you. Under the “proper” circumstances, I can kill someone deader than dogshit and sleep like a baby that night. But I think violence for violence’s sake is sick. I’m fully capable of committing horrible violence (I think most human beings are, under the individually “proper” circumstances), but only to a specific purpose, such as self defense, or defending family members, even total strangers, if need be (see above). As an independent contractor with some experience with how shitty insurance companies can be, I could conceivably hurt (even kill) someone fucking with my work truck; that’s my livelihood. The roof over my head and the food on my table, and few of my clients are understanding or forgiving enough to cut me some slack because the insurance company are being dickheads with my claim. > [@bdgr](#): > > There is no provision in texas law offering protection against civil liability in this case. I can not prove a negative. It is not in the penal code. So I guess my only cite for it is the copy of the penal code you posted from…its not there. > > Conealed handgun, and security classes in the state all teach that the likelyhood is that you will be sued and that you will lose. Since their cirriculim is not online I cant show you that. Come here, shoot someone for trespass, and see where it gets you. This isn’t the wild west anymore. Again, seconded. While I have no specific objection to anything **bdgr** said, I’d just add my IMO comment that I _think_ your liability in Texas may vary depending upon locale (thus the makeup of your jury), and that you may see a wider variance in “decisions” from urban, suburban, and rural juries as to just how liable you are for the person you shot (assuming it was justified in any way to begin with). ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2005, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/75 "2005-12-28T18:58:15Z")
> [@ExTank](#): > > While I have no specific objection to anything **bdgr** said, I’d just add my IMO comment that I _think_ your liability in Texas may vary depending upon locale (thus the makeup of your jury), and that you may see a wider variance in “decisions” from urban, suburban, and rural juries as to just how liable you are for the person you shot (assuming it was justified in any way to begin with). Absolutely. I just wouldn’t want to roll those dice. From what my cop friend told me (and I take legal advice from cops with a grain of salt) that any time you shoot someone in Texas you can count on going before a grand jury even if there is a high probability that it will tossed. The cost of hiring a lawyer for that, and probably having to make bail, would encourage me to let them take the damn stereo as long as they left. My pit bull would have something else to say about the matter but at least thats covered under my homeowners policy. If they were intent on harming me or mine it would be a differant story. I keep a .40 cal berreta 96 in the headboard loaded with mag safe. There was a guy not too far from here many years ago that shot a man in defense of a third person, (legally according to the law). the DA tried to make an example out of him and although the grandy jury set him free his lawyer and bail bondsman fees were probably well over 5 grand. I felt bad for the guy, he did the right thing and gets totally screwed for it. ---
**Author:** ![corkboard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@corkboard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/corkboard)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2005, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/76 "2005-12-28T20:03:10Z")
> [@GWVet](#): > > First off, I live in New Jersey and the law is stacked in the intruder’s favor. Do you have a cite for that? I’m not challenging you, I live in NJ too and have been looking for info on this very topic. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2005, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/77 "2005-12-28T21:40:19Z")
> [@Idle Thoughts](#): > > What do you do? Do you kill them? Injure? Point the gun and tell them not to move? Wait for a perilous second to see what they are going to do (and if they start running, let them go; and if they start charging or reaching for their own weapon, shoot?) > > What does what you do depend on in all of this situation? What do you have to do when you have to make a decision in a couple seconds or less? : / I shoot, and I shoot to kill on sight. No attempt to apprehend. Aim for the center of mass, fire twice and then a third time if needed. I don’t wait to see what he might do; his very presence in my house has told me that. There are sayings that have abounded for years. One of the most accurate ones is > [@](#): > > Better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6. ---
**Author:** ![Mint\_Julep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bc79bd/32.png) [@Mint\_Julep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mint_Julep)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2005, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/78 "2005-12-28T22:02:31Z")
I walked in when a man was robbing my apt. My ex-bf was with me and spotted the guy and screamed “what the &$%# are you doing” and charged the guy. Burgler had my patio doors open to place my goods outside and bolted through the open doors. My ex chased him and (in hindsight) probably encouraged the burglar’s inner Jackie Joynerness by shouting his intentions to maim and or kill the burglar, should he loose the race. I dont think I would have shot the robber if I had owned a gun though. A) I am embarrased to say it, but I sat stunned for a moment because it all happened so fast and it was as if my brain could not process the scene. B) The guy RAN…and QUICK. He was not looking for a confrontation. (lucky for me-see A) for my cat like reflexes) C) Unless I had the gun in my purse, the intruder might have found it already and used it on me. (He had ransacked my bedroom and all bureaus and I feel certain he would have taken any weapons found) Plus, let us refer again to A) for my lack of Quick Draw skills. However, if you google: Jackson MS burglar shot- you will see that home owners here became so fed up with staggering crime rates that they have taken matters into their own hands. Burglars are shot weekly here. ---
**Author:** ![GWVet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/65b543/32.png) [@GWVet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GWVet)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2005, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/79 "2005-12-29T00:37:32Z")
> [@McNew](#): > > Do you have a cite for that? I’m not challenging you, I live in NJ too and have been looking for info on this very topic. > > Thanks. A cite, no not really. It was more of an opinion based on the fact that hollowpoint ammunition is illegal for non-Law Enforcement use in NJ. You can find most firearms laws on the [State Police web site](http://www.njsp.org/about/fire_ag2.html). It seems to me that the laws here are stacked against firearms owners at every turn, so my statement was more of an opinion than a fact. Personally, I recommend [this site](http://www.evannappen.com/) and any books you are able to find in print by Evan Nappen. If you ever need an attorney for firearms issues in New Jersey, he’s the guy to get. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2005, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019/80 "2005-12-29T20:26:10Z")
I live alone and have a pump-action shotgun for self-defense. If the intruder is not in the room with me, I’d rack the gun to get his attention, give a warning, and let him run. (I’m sure he’d run if he was just a burglar - the sound is quite unmistakeable and very loud in a quiet nighttime house.) I do not plan on leaving my bedroom in that situation; I’d get the bed between me and the door and be ready to shoot. If he were already in the room with me, I’d shoot. I’m not sure what to do if they come in through the bedroom window though - the gun is under the bed, the bed is under the window, and the window is accessable by the deck. I imagine I’d have the warning to run, but I’d be leaving the gun and the landline behind me. I do keep the alarm on at night, which has glass-break detectors for the rooms on the front porch (although not my room, grr), motion detectors, and door opening alarms. I have a dog, but he’s small and he’s put up in the laundry room at night. I live close enough to a rough area that I’ve put a lot of thought into this. I’ve gone to the range and practiced with the gun, although I’d like to put more practice into loading it in the dark. I do not keep it loaded; I’ve been known to wake up very disoriented and I want to have to take a few seconds to be sure I know what I’m doing. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-at-home-and-someone-breaks-in-do-you-shoot-kill-them/337019.md?page=5)