# You're "lovely"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 23, 2014, 8:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072 "2014-05-23T08:44:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![JohnClay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c37758/32.png) [@JohnClay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnClay)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2014, 8:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/1 "2014-05-23T08:44:28Z")
I was trying to think of some words that don’t involve saying that someone is objectively hot - e.g. “lovely”, “adorable” Though this could be used for people who aren’t particularly attractive, it could also be used on hot women to make them think about why you’re not using strong enough language… ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2014, 9:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/2 "2014-05-23T09:04:48Z")
Newsflash for you: _no_ words describing appearance are “objective.” You ever hear the song “You Are So Beautiful”? The lyrics add “to me,” but that part’s unnecessary, because that’s really what people mean when they say “You’re beautiful.” Because for every seemingly “objectively” gorgeous person out there, I guarantee you, a nonzero percentage of people will find them unattractive. Why would anyone be so _obsessed_ with quantifying people’s looks, how to describe them, how to categorize them, etc.? ---
**Author:** ![JohnClay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c37758/32.png) [@JohnClay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnClay)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2014, 9:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/3 "2014-05-23T09:14:18Z")
> [@](#): > > …Because for every seemingly “objectively” gorgeous person out there, I guarantee you, a nonzero percentage of people will find them unattractive… Say there is a winner of a Miss Universe contest… most people should agree that she is attractive. Not that they are necessarily turned on by her but they should understand why she was chosen - significantly because of her appearance. ---
**Author:** ![JohnClay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c37758/32.png) [@JohnClay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnClay)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2014, 9:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/4 "2014-05-23T09:18:30Z")
> [@choie](#): > > …Why would anyone be so _obsessed_ with quantifying people’s looks, how to describe them, how to categorize them, etc.? There are self-proclaimed “Pick Up Artists” who place a lot of importance with looks. Some of them ask the “hot” girls what do they offer besides there looks because in some situations beauty is common. Though they claim that they don’t get validation from the girls they can get they aim high anyway. ---
**Author:** ![JohnClay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c37758/32.png) [@JohnClay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnClay)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2014, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/5 "2014-05-23T09:49:00Z")
> [@choie](#): > > … You ever hear the song “You Are So Beautiful”? The lyrics add “to me,” but that part’s unnecessary, because that’s really what people mean when they say “You’re beautiful.”… Yes there are songs about subjective beauty, but what about this: [http://www.metrolyrics.com/when-youre-in-love-with-a-beautiful-woman-lyrics-dr-hook.html](http://www.metrolyrics.com/when-youre-in-love-with-a-beautiful-woman-lyrics-dr-hook.html) Dr Hook - When You’re In Love With A Beautiful Woman > [@](#): > > When you’re in love with a beautiful woman, it’s hard; > When you’re in love with a beautiful woman, you know it’s hard; > **Everybody** wants her, everybody loves her; > **Everybody** wants to take your baby home; > > …Cause everybody tempts her, > everybody tells her she’s the most beautiful woman they know… Though of course it isn’t quite **everybody** … ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2014, 10:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/6 "2014-05-23T10:15:53Z")
Is this how you snagged yer ole ball n chain? Knocked her down a peg or two? **JC** , the PUA. Whoda thunk it? 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2014, 11:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/7 "2014-05-23T11:08:05Z")
> [@JohnClay](#): > > Say there is a winner of a Miss Universe contest… Until beings from planets other than earth compete, there is no Miss Universe contest. Let’s get that straight, K? /pet peeve ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2014, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/8 "2014-05-23T11:35:07Z")
> [@JohnClay](#): > > Dr Hook - When You’re In Love With A Beautiful Woman > > > [@](#): > > > > When you’re in love with a beautiful woman, **it’s hard** ; > > When you’re in love with a beautiful woman, you know **it’s hard** ; > > Everybody wants her, everybody loves her; > > Everybody wants to take your baby home; > > > > …Cause everybody tempts her, > > everybody tells her she’s the most beautiful woman they know… I think you missed the whole point of that song. 😉 _Dr Hook_ were a bunch of jokers. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2014, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/9 "2014-05-23T11:48:29Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Until beings from planets other than earth compete, there is no Miss Universe contest. Let’s get that straight, K? /pet peeve Your concept of female is meaningless on Fy’LoRgleez 3! ---
**Author:** ![papergirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/aca169/32.png) [@papergirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/papergirl)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2014, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/10 "2014-05-25T00:09:47Z")
Men call me adorable. Really, they do. But I believe that what they mean is “You have a cheery smile and are cute in a slightly overweight, roly-poly puppy sort of way.” They most distinctly do NOT mean that I am “hot.” Just a little input from this perspective. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2014, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/11 "2014-05-25T01:13:58Z")
> [@papergirl](#): > > Men call me adorable. Really, they do. But I believe that what they mean is “You have a cheery smile and are cute in a slightly overweight, roly-poly puppy sort of way.” They most distinctly do NOT mean that I am “hot.” Just a little input from this perspective. Maybe so, but I think you will also find that a lot of men would be a lot happier to have an “adorable” girlfriend, wife, or whatever, than a “hot” one. The assumption that every straight man aspires to have a pornstar or supermodel-style “hot” woman is way off the mark. ---
**Author:** ![Cara\_mel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/22d042/32.png) [@Cara\_mel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cara_mel)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2014, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/12 "2014-05-25T06:26:11Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > Maybe so, but I think you will also find that a lot of men would be a lot happier to have an “adorable” girlfriend, wife, or whatever, than a “hot” one. The assumption that every straight man aspires to have a pornstar or supermodel-style “hot” woman is way off the mark. Very comforting to hear this, **njtt**! Anyway, I came out of lurkerdom to say maybe I’m the only one, but I admire JohnClay. He’s obviously got some problems navigating the world of human strangeness, but every post and thread demonstrates how hard he’s trying. How difficult it must be, asking advice for every social situation, questioning your motives at every turn, when most of us would just say, “ok, I don’t like this part about her, but overall it’s all good.” It sounds like a nightmare existence to me. However, kudos to all who are giving concrete and sympathetic advice to our friend, JohnClay. ---
**Author:** ![Cara\_mel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/22d042/32.png) [@Cara\_mel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cara_mel)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2014, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/13 "2014-05-25T12:53:51Z")
Just adding this bit in to apologize to JohnClay for talking about you in the third person in your own thread. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2014, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/14 "2014-05-25T13:09:37Z")
How about “winsome” or “radiant”? ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2014, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/15 "2014-05-25T13:15:45Z")
Try “pulchritudinous” or “callipygian.” ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2014, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/16 "2014-05-25T14:29:47Z")
If you wanna be happy for the rest of your life Never make a pretty woman your life So from my personal point of view Get an ugly girl to marry you. – Jimmy Soul, 1963, “If You Wanna Be Happy” ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2014, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/17 "2014-05-25T14:52:25Z")
> [@JohnClay](#): > > I was trying to think of some words that don’t involve saying that someone is objectively hot - e.g. “lovely”, “adorable” > > Though this could be used for people who aren’t particularly attractive… Okay, I’m with you so far… For these kinds of situations, where I want to pay a genuine compliment relating to looks to someone who isn’t really all that to my taste (say a friend has just spent an hour on his hair and outfit and really wants feedback about his look), I’ll pick out a certain item or feature that I can appreciate. “I love that color blue on you! It really brightens up your whole look…good job picking that out!” If they’re not asking for feedback on their appearance…listen carefully now and pay attention…shut the fuck up. No one cares what you think when they’re not asking you what you think. You can only cause pain with a forced compliment. > [@](#): > > , it could also be used on hot women to make them think about why you’re not using strong enough language… Aaaaaand…huh? Aaaaaand…why are you worried about telling any women anything about their looks other than your wife (who we already know you don’t think is hot)? Stop it. That’s not cool. If you’re not another woman offering makeup/clothing advice, if you’re not available to fuck or finance her, then your opinion of her looks are completely irrelevant and don’t need to be aired. Shut up. And you tell your \*wife \*she’s beautiful even if she looks like an obese Yeti with a fungal infection. That’s part of the social contract of marriage. And vice-versa. My husband objectively looks like the lovechild of Tweedledee and a silverback gorilla. I still find him sexy as hell, and I tell him that I find him sexy as hell. (That being said, my husband knows I don’t play ego games. If I ASK if this skirt makes my ass look like a barge, I really want to know, because I can’t see behind me and I have 12 other skirts I could wear instead. But I’m asking about the SKIRT, not about me. I am still beautiful, goddamn it, even if this skirt isn’t the best option for my ass.) ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2014, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/18 "2014-05-25T15:06:13Z")
You’re so beautiful You could be a part-time model But you’d probably have to keep your normal job A part-time model Spending part of your time modeling, And part of your time, next to me – Flight of the Conchords, “Most Beautiful Girl (In the Room)” ---
**Author:** ![JohnClay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c37758/32.png) [@JohnClay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnClay)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2014, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/19 "2014-05-25T22:51:06Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > …If they’re not asking for feedback on their appearance…listen carefully now and pay attention…shut the fuck up. No one cares what you think when they’re not asking you what you think. You can only cause pain with a forced compliment. That’s what I do… sometimes when my wife is saying I’m really sexy or handsome I just say “thanks” and that’s all… > [@](#): > > …why are you worried about telling any women anything about their looks other than your wife (who we already know you don’t think is hot)? Stop it. That’s not cool. I didn’t say this possible situation applies to me. Well my wife sometimes says a girl is gorgeous or something and seems to want my opinion. Saying she’s “lovely” would be better than saying she’s gorgeous I think. ---
**Author:** ![Why\_Child](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b782af/32.png) [@Why\_Child](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Why_Child)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2014, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072/20 "2014-05-26T01:56:41Z")
> [@JohnClay](#): > > \ > Well my wife sometimes says a girl is gorgeous or something and seems to want my opinion. Saying she’s “lovely” would be better than saying she’s gorgeous I think. Maybe you could just say, “Yes, she’s pretty… but I don’t love _her_.” 😉 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-lovely/689072.md?page=2)