# You're the President on 9/11 - What do you do? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 14, 2011, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232 "2011-09-14T01:40:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![FordPrefect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e99b99/32.png) [@FordPrefect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FordPrefect)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/21 "2011-09-14T17:23:59Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > All replies so far stink of hindsight, and are not taking into account the mentalities of the time. If you were president _today_ you would ground all planes immediately, but its not today, its ten years ago, and planes weren’t weapons then. Post WWII Kamikaze attacks and post the near constant hijacking of airplanes in the 70’s and 80’s (or so it seemed to me as a child back then) one would think that in some think tank filled with smart analysts that the combination of hijack and plane as weapon would have been considered and a solution planned out. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/22 "2011-09-14T17:24:12Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > To answer this question honestly, I think you are all going to have to lose ten years of living with the idea of planes as weapons. > > I guarantee you that if any of you were president on that morning, you would not in any way have decided to ground all planes by the same you had even left the school. At that stage there will still have been confusion about what was actually happening, no chance that you immediately deciphered the terrorists plans. > > All replies so far stink of hindsight, and are not taking into account the mentalities of the time. If you were president _today_ you would ground all planes immediately, but its not today, its ten years ago, and planes weren’t weapons then. In actuality the order to ground all planes did happen very quickly, at 9:42 AM, just moments after the Pentagon was hit. Given the fact that everyone was running around confused up to that point, it’s actually a pretty amazing story about how the national ground stop was issued, it wasn’t the President or even the head of the FAA. It was a mid level manager who recognized that it had to happen **right now**. It wasn’t until after noon that all air traffic actually was stopped, though. That’s something that _hasn’t_ changed. In the grand scheme of things even if Bush had ordered all air traffic down at 8:50 AM it wouldn’t have been completed til around 11:45-12:00 at the earliest, and by that time everything that happened would have happened. We still wouldn’t have been able to stop flight 175 from hitting the second tower, and flight 77 was already too far along to realistically hope to stop it from hitting the Pentagon. By the time we could have recognized Flight 77 was hijacked there just wasn’t time to respond. The only flight we had any potential to respond to was U93. It was the only flight on that day where we knew it was a hijacked flight and that it was heading for Washington, and we knew it far enough in advance that we could act. Actions were taken, and fighters were immediately put into the air (they were essentially given kamikaze orders, because there was no time to arm them.) Even if you issued a ground stop at 8:50, U93 still would have happened the same way it did, because it had taken off before the first tower was hit. That’s actually good planning, the guys who planned 9/11 knew they wanted the first hit to happen _after_ all planes were in the air. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/23 "2011-09-14T17:26:32Z")
[Here](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2035704/9-11-anniversary-Heather-Penneys-suicide-mission-United-93.html) is an article about the two pilots who actually went up to ram U93. ---
**Author:** ![bucketybuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@bucketybuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bucketybuck)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/24 "2011-09-14T17:40:02Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > [Here](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2035704/9-11-anniversary-Heather-Penneys-suicide-mission-United-93.html) is an article about the two pilots who actually went up to ram U93. Until today that is an aspect of the whole 9/11 story that I had never heard. It is rather humbling. ---
**Author:** ![No\_umlaut\_for\_U](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ea5d25/32.png) [@No\_umlaut\_for\_U](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/No_umlaut_for_U)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/25 "2011-09-14T17:48:36Z")
I don’t think GWB could have done any damage control at that moment. I’d have said, “and they all lived happily ever after. The End,” then set the book down and calmly walked out to my minders. Then panicked. ---
**Author:** ![TheBori](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ee7513/32.png) [@TheBori](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheBori)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/26 "2011-09-14T18:01:55Z")
Very good insight by all posters here. The one comment that struck home with me was the call to think back to what hijackings were prior to 9/11. Planes were hijacked, flown to some unfriendly country, parked and ransomed. That’s why a plane, pre-9/11, could be taken over with a box knife. The concern was for the safety of the passengers, not the general public. Now, of course, this could not happen. Passengers would know that they were going to die unless they did something, ref: flight U93. The pasengers had heard what happened in NYC. When I first heard that a plane hit the WTC, I assumed it was a horrible accident. Perhaps a tourist plane, perhaps a pilot had a heart attack. My first thought was certainly not terrorism. The president…any president…is not omnicient, magic or all-powerful. Discretion is the better part of valor. I can only imagine the anti-Bush rhetoric today IF he had indeed shot down a civilian airliner that turned out NOT to contain terrorists, but simply had a faulty transponder. ---
**Author:** ![gladtobeblazed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85f322/32.png) [@gladtobeblazed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gladtobeblazed)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/27 "2011-09-14T20:50:02Z")
I would do nothing. America is not under attack, it’s just a couple of terrorists flying planes into the World Trade Center. The odds that they could have hijacked more than two planes are pretty damn slim. Let the FBI handle it. Now when word reaches me that they crashed into the Pentagon…well what are the odds that they could have hijacked more than 3 planes? That’s even more unlikely than hijacking just 2 planes, so there’s almost no way they could have more planes out there. I see no reason to get involved, let the FBI handle it. ---
**Author:** ![markdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@markdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markdash)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/28 "2011-09-14T21:03:05Z")
> [@FordPrefect](#): > > Post WWII Kamikaze attacks and post the near constant hijacking of airplanes in the 70’s and 80’s (or so it seemed to me as a child back then) one would think that in some think tank filled with smart analysts that the combination of hijack and plane as weapon would have been considered and a solution planned out. The great American prophet Tom Clancy envisioned this in his 1994 magnum opus _Debt of Honor_, in which an angry Japanese pilot flies an empty 747 into the Capitol Building during a Presidential address to congress. It seems the failure to envision the events of 9/11 were more a failure of imagination than anything. Why would pilots, many of whom are military veterans, voluntarily fly a plane into a building? The concept of a team of hijackers, wielding sharp but nonballistic weapons, and having piloting expertise simply wasn’t considered. (AFAIK) ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/29 "2011-09-14T22:09:24Z")
> [@markdash](#): > > The concept of a team of hijackers, wielding sharp but nonballistic weapons, and having piloting expertise simply wasn’t considered. (AFAIK) Speaking for myself, during 9/11 I initially discounted the possibility that the first plane was deliberately flown into the WTC because it’s impossible for anyone untrained to fly a passenger airliner. Then the second plane hit, and I changed my mind. ---
**Author:** ![akrako1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c77e96/32.png) [@akrako1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/akrako1)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/30 "2011-09-14T22:12:58Z")
> [@markdash](#): > > It seems the failure to envision the events of 9/11 were more a failure of imagination than anything. Why would pilots, many of whom are military veterans, voluntarily fly a plane into a building? The concept of a team of hijackers, wielding sharp but nonballistic weapons, and having piloting expertise simply wasn’t considered. (AFAIK) Are you kidding? Just a year earlier, there was a SPECIFIC THREAT of terrorists flying planes into buildings during the 2000 G8 summit. So specific that anti-aircraft batteries were setup around the meeting! Besides censoring their general 9/11 page, Wikipedia actually has a decent article regarding this specific issue. See [here](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/September_11_attacks_advance-knowledge_debate#Using_planes_as_missiles) for a list of ‘planes as weapons’ history. A few quotes: > [@](#): > > A 2004 USA Today article, “[NORAD had drills of jets as weapons](http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2004-04-18-norad_x.htm)”, describes pre-9/11 NORAD drills that suggest they were prepared for such an attack as happened on 9/11: > “In the two years before the September 11 attacks, the North American Aerospace Defense Command conducted exercises simulating what the White House says was unimaginable at the time: hijacked airliners used as weapons to crash into targets and cause mass casualties. One of the imagined targets was the World Trade Center. In another exercise, jets performed a mock shootdown over the Atlantic Ocean of a jet supposedly laden with chemical poisons headed toward a target in the United States. In a third scenario, the target was the Pentagon — but that drill was not run after Defense officials said it was unrealistic.” > [@](#): > > The Joint Inquiry of 2002 confirmed that the Intelligence Community had received at least twelve reports over a seven-year period suggesting that terrorists might use planes as weapons. In addition to multiple reports that Bin Laden might you planes as weapons, you’ve got Bush’s Aug. 6th “Bin Laden Determine To Strike In U.S.” brief, Ashecroft’s acknowledged pre 9/11 warning to not fly commercial aircraft, and it’s not that big of a stretch to imagine they at least ‘conceived’ of such an attack… Shit, they had enough forethought to wire the towers, including WTC7, to blow in such a sensationalistic fashion (but that’s another debate) Going back to the op… the first thing I would have done as Commander-In-Chief was to cancel the record amount of wargames that were occurring on the very morning on 9/11: Vigilant Guardian, Vigilant Warrior, Northern Guardian, Northern Vigilance (Norad/Air Force), and even a National Reconnaissance Office “smashing a plane into a building” exercise. Wait, a plane smashing into a building exercise in D.C. was occurring the very morning of 9/11??? [Yup](http://www.boston.com/news/packages/sept11/anniversary/wire_stories/0903_plane_exercise.htm). Rumsfeld, in a rare acknowledgement of the 9/11 war games, brazenly stated that they should have only increased our ability to respond. lol. Airtraffic controllers are heard ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/31 "2011-09-14T23:29:41Z")
**akrako1**? Buddy? You stopped talking in the middle of a sentence. You okay? … oh shit. \*They \*got **akrako1**. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2011, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/32 "2011-09-14T23:32:31Z")
Fuck the kids, America’s under attack! I’d excuse myself and bolt straight the hell out of there. Lots of people are probably familiar with Andrew Card, the Chief of Staff at the time who whispered into Bush’s ear. His excuse that he gave Bush during this 10 year restrospect, a Tuesday Morning Quarterbacking if I’ve ever heard one, was to praise him for not scaring the children or, more absurdly, giving terrorists the satisfaction (???) that they got the president to react! WTF is that? You think Bin Laden gives one singular fuck about whether or not Bush reacted negatively? What if Bush smiled and cheered, would that piss Bin Laden off? Fuck you, Andrew Card, for such a smarmy and stupidly transparent display of sycophantic ass-kissing. I’d get on Air Force One immediately, grab a couple of fighter jets as escort, and fly myself straight back into DC and meet with my senior level staff. I’d tell the Air Force to scramble jets to protect DC airspace and escort all my other senior level staff back to DC ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/33 "2011-09-15T00:22:00Z")
Based on the information I would have had at the time, I might not have immediately concluded that the first crash was part of a terrorist operation. But when the second crash happened, it would have been obvious. At this point, I’d assume there were going to be more attacks at various targets. I would also assume that the terrorists were trying to have all the attacks occur as close together as possible - there’s no reason why they would try to space them out at fifteen minute intervals. I also need to find out if there’s anything else happening. Plane crashes might just be one part of the overall attack. So I need information, I need a place I can issue orders, and I need to recognize I’m a target myself and need to be protected. Time to leave the classroom and get to a secure command post. Order all civilian planes to the ground to clear the skies. Order military planes into the air over likely targets. Decide if I’m going to order my fighters to shoot down suspicious civilian flights. ---
**Author:** ![HubZilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ccd318/32.png) [@HubZilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HubZilla)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/34 "2011-09-15T01:04:29Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Speaking for myself, during 9/11 I initially discounted the possibility that the first plane was deliberately flown into the WTC because it’s impossible for anyone untrained to fly a passenger airliner. > > Then the second plane hit, and I changed my mind. My thought (after the second one hit) is they were forcing the pilot to fly into it. Maybe holding a gun to his head or something. In hindsight, it doesn’t make sense, there’s no threat you can make if I’m going to die anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/35 "2011-09-15T01:38:05Z")
> [@gladtobeblazed](#): > > I would do nothing. America is not under attack, it’s just a couple of terrorists flying planes into the World Trade Center. The odds that they could have hijacked more than two planes are pretty damn slim. Let the FBI handle it. > > Now when word reaches me that they crashed into the Pentagon…well what are the odds that they could have hijacked more than 3 planes? That’s even more unlikely than hijacking just 2 planes, so there’s almost no way they could have more planes out there. I see no reason to get involved, let the FBI handle it. You’ve got to be kidding, but I would personally scramble the fighters and order all flights grounded especially around key cities like New York and Washington. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 8:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/36 "2011-09-15T08:32:49Z")
I’m not convinced that going straight back to Washington is the right answer. Until you are sure that all the immediate threats have been identified you would probably _not_ want the President to head straight into another prime target area. AF1 has the technology to communicate with all the necessary people (I assume) for the immediate future. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 8:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/37 "2011-09-15T08:42:10Z")
Immediate term, I stay put until the Secret Service tells me it’s ok to leave, because that’s their job. Then I probably nuke Afghanistan or something. At least, if I remember correctly, that’s what I wanted to do on 9/11/01. Probably good I’m not President. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/38 "2011-09-15T13:11:15Z")
> [@akrako1](#): > > Are you kidding? Just a year earlier, there was a SPECIFIC THREAT of terrorists flying planes into buildings during the 2000 G8 summit. So specific that anti-aircraft batteries were setup around the meeting! > > Besides censoring their general 9/11 page, Wikipedia actually has a decent article regarding this specific issue. See [here](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/September_11_attacks_advance-knowledge_debate#Using_planes_as_missiles) for a list of ‘planes as weapons’ history. Actually, that was just two months earlier, at the July 2001 G8 summit in Genoa, Italy, per your link. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/39 "2011-09-15T18:35:53Z")
Leave the classroom as soon as Andy Card comes in to tell me we’ve been attacked. It’s doubtful whether those minutes would have made a meaningful difference, but there’s no way of knowing what you can or can’t do about the situation until you step out into the hall. ---
**Author:** ![Kozmik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8dc957/32.png) [@Kozmik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kozmik)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2011, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232/40 "2011-09-15T20:08:24Z")
> [@Indistinguishable](#): > > Um, 4) doesn’t really follow from 3) at all… As you may recall, the Pentagon was hit at 9:37 AM. As POTUS I was making a [back-of-the-envelope calculation](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Back-of-the-envelope_calculation): 4) Therefore if there is a third plane it will hit at approximately 9:15 AM. I’m assuming that there is a third plane. This assumption is based on the only pattern I can see, that the interval between the first plane and the second plane is approximately 15 minutes. So that answers the “when” question. The only remaining question is “where?”. Even if I didn’t think of it, it is plausible that someone would reason that since New York City was a target, Washington D.C., obviously the United States capital, would also be a target. Therefore, at 9:06 AM, I would order that both New York City and Washington D.C. to be on alert for an imminent attack. At 9:15 AM I would know three things: 1. No attack has occurred. 2. Two hijacked planes are in the air. 3. Therefore an attack is still imminent. So I would keep New York City and Washington D.C. on alert. At 9:37 AM, what would I know? That is a question for alternative history. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youre-the-president-on-9-11-what-do-you-do/596232.md?page=3)