# You've a Friend? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 20, 2001, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769 "2001-03-20T19:54:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Jinx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Jinx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jinx)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2001, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/1 "2001-03-20T19:54:43Z")
There was a fight in PA that the state slogan, “You’ve Got A Friend in PA” was poor grammar. The argument is that the actual phrase would be “you have a friend in PA”; however, it seems the contraction needs a helping verb, “got”. OTOH, some say “you have got to go”, for example, which can have a slightly different connotation than “you have to go”. Maybe this is like “if I were rich” vs. “if I was rich?” Tongue Tied! - Jinx ---
**Author:** ![Ice\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@Ice\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2001, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/2 "2001-03-22T12:01:38Z")
“I was rich” is correct, BTW. Dunno 'bout the slogan. I like the one with “got” in it, because it has the emphasis of two parts of the language to do with possession: have, and got. The other version sounds too wussy to be a good slogan. 'Sides, English thrives through how everyone uses it. If everyone knows what the slogan means, why be pedantic? ---
**Author:** ![AWB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bb73d2/32.png) [@AWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AWB)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2001, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/3 "2001-03-22T12:33:09Z")
The “have” (represented by the “'ve”) is not used in the sense of “to posess”. It’s part of the present perfect verb tense of the whole statement. “Got” (past tense of “get”) is the word used here to indicate “posession”. So the jist of “You’ve Got a Friend in Pennsylvania” is “you, in the recent past (just after you read my license plate) obtained a friend in Pennsylvania”. This cutesy slogan of course is either completely wrong or obviously right. If I see it on a tourist’s car, it’s suggesting that they’re so friendly that I could consider them my friend immediately. But your plate says you’re “in Pennsylvania”. No, you’re in Washington, DC! Or you live in Pittsburgh. Of course I’ve got a friend here! It of course should read “… _from_ Pennsylvania”. ---
**Author:** ![AWB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bb73d2/32.png) [@AWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AWB)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2001, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/4 "2001-03-22T13:13:11Z")
Jinx: > [@](#): > > Maybe this is like “if I were rich” vs. “if I was rich?” Ice Wolf > [@](#): > > “I was rich” is correct, BTW. Jinx was asking about “_if_ I were rich”, which is the correct use for the _subjunctive mood_, which suggest doubt or a situation contrary to fact. E.g.[ul] [li]If I were rich [but I’m not], I would buy a house there.[/li][li]If he were the murderer [but I don’t think he is], he would’ve thrown the weapon off the bridge.[/li][li]If this be treason [but I don’t think it is], then hang me now![/li][/ul] The other moods are:[ul] [li]indicative - direct statement or question or to express an uncertain condition: “If you build it, they will come.”[/li][li]imperative - commands: “Now you take that diaper off your head and you put it back on your sister!” :D[/li][li]Hi, Opal![/li][/ul] ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2001, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/5 "2001-03-22T15:41:37Z")
I always thought it meant that Pennsylvania in itself is your “friend”, just a friendly place to be. “You’ve Got” is just a more casual way to say it, like “Have you got a minute?” My parents’ families are from PA and they go see them only as a duty, and endure the visit. My father’s reaction to the new slogan was, “With a friend like Pennsylvania, who needs enemies?” ---
**Author:** ![TV\_time](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f17d59/32.png) [@TV\_time](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TV_time)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2001, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/6 "2001-03-22T16:55:16Z")
To translate for AWB (who is completely correct): Always follow “If” with “were” not “was.” ---
**Author:** ![AWB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bb73d2/32.png) [@AWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AWB)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2001, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/7 "2001-03-22T17:33:19Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by gigi \* > \*\* I always thought it meant that Pennsylvania in itself is your “friend”, just a friendly place to be_\* Ah, like the “Toy Story” song “You’ve Got A Friend In Me”. Woody hasn’t eaten a friend of mine, he just saying that he would be my friend. So Pennsylvania is my friend. But will it pick me up from the airport? :D:D > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by TV time_ > \*\*To translate for AWB (who is completely correct): > > Always follow “If” with “were” not “was.” \*\* Thanks for the “completely correct”. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Skwerl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Skwerl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skwerl)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2001, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/8 "2001-03-22T21:36:57Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by AWB \* > \*\*The “have” (represented by the “'ve”) is not used in the sense of “to posess”. It’s part of the present perfect verb tense of the whole statement. “Got” (past tense of “get”) is the word used here to indicate “posession”. > > So the jist of “You’ve Got a Friend in Pennsylvania” is “you, in the recent past (just after you read my license plate) obtained a friend in Pennsylvania”. > \*\* I think the correct conjugation of “get” was “have gotten.” Like, “He has gotten sicker the last couple days” or “We’ve gotten a letter from the IRS saying we owe $1.” “Have got” is I think just a colloquial expression that, while incorrect, is too prevalent to stomp out. ---
**Author:** ![rowrrbazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rowrrbazzle/32/414_2.png) [@rowrrbazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rowrrbazzle)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2001, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/9 "2001-03-22T23:43:04Z")
I didn’t know that was PA’s slogan. I like the play on words of “Friend” referring to your usual friend as well as the Society of Friends (aka Quakers). Does the ACLU know about this? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![wolfstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d6d6ee/32.png) [@wolfstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfstu)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2001, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/10 "2001-03-23T01:00:12Z")
Skwerl: According to my English teacher, “gotten” is not a word at all. I lost marks on a presentation for using it. Also, ‘You’ve a friend’ is acceptable, ‘You’ve got a friend’ is more colloquial, but also passes. ---
**Author:** ![Briny\_Deep](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/briny_deep/32/17188_2.png) [@Briny\_Deep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Briny_Deep)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2001, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/11 "2001-03-23T01:27:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wolfstu \* > \*\* (snip) > > Also, ‘You’ve a friend’ is acceptable, ‘You’ve got a friend’ is more colloquial, but also passes. \*\* I always thought the “you’ve a” contstruction was a Britishism. Rarely have I heard an American use it, at any rate. I had an American boss who used to say “I’ve an idea,” and the effect was actually kind of annoying - sounded like an affectation. Sorry, carry on. ---
**Author:** ![Briny\_Deep](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/briny_deep/32/17188_2.png) [@Briny\_Deep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Briny_Deep)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2001, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/12 "2001-03-23T01:29:50Z")
damn, I usually spell better than that, honest. ---
**Author:** ![Skwerl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Skwerl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skwerl)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2001, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/13 "2001-03-23T03:48:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wolfstu \* > \*\*Skwerl: According to my English teacher, “gotten” is not a word at all. I lost marks on a presentation for using it. > \*\* [Dictionary.com](http://Dictionary.com) says it’s the past participle (aka perfect participle) of “get.” And I’m surprised you didn’t challenge your English teacher! > **[Definition of gotten | Dictionary.com](https://www.dictionary.com/browse/gotten)** > > Definition of gotten from Dictionary.com, the world’s leading online source for English definitions, pronunciations, word origins, idioms, Word of the Day, and more. [http://www.dictionary.com/cgi-bin/dict.pl?term=past%20participle](http://www.dictionary.com/cgi-bin/dict.pl?term=past%20participle) ---
**Author:** ![aseymayo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a88e57/32.png) [@aseymayo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aseymayo)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2001, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/14 "2001-03-23T04:02:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wolfstu \* > **Skwerl: According to my English teacher, “gotten” is not a word at all. I lost marks on a presentation for using it.** Well this is just plain silly. What misbegotten wretch told you this? Is it possible he or she has just forgotten the rules? Or did your teacher buy a diploma with ill-gotten gains? I’d’ve gotten very mad, were I you. Of course, now I’ve said “gotten” so much, it has ceased to have any meaning at all. ---
**Author:** ![Ice\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@Ice\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2001, 10:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/15 "2001-03-23T10:50:45Z")
**AWB** … yeah to the “rich” thing. My brain was out wandering the streets at the time. But I don’t buy the "present perfect verb tense " thing you said. 'Least, not in this case. You’ve a friend = You have a friend. In this case, “have” is part of the verb “to have”. There is “a friend”. Who’s friend? Why, yours! You’ve lost your marbles = You have lost your marbles.(not a personal comment about anyone on this thread, merely an example) In this case, it’s your PPVT. “To have” lost. Sorry, **AWB**. What you said sounded mighty impressive, but it didn’t gel with me. ---
**Author:** ![Andy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/aeb1de/32.png) [@Andy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2001, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/16 "2001-03-23T12:03:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Skwerl \* > “Have got” is I think just a colloquial expression that, while incorrect, is too prevalent to stomp out. While incorrect in _American English_ is what you meant of course;) ---
**Author:** ![wolfstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d6d6ee/32.png) [@wolfstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfstu)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2001, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/17 "2001-03-25T16:01:34Z")
Yeah, I wasn’t too impressed with that teacher, but he was pretty bright other than the “gotten incident”. As I recall, I had intended to use “acquired”, but fell into the “gotten” rut on tape. I think it was the one mark that kept me from getting a perfect score on a big assignment. Oh, well. ---
**Author:** ![Pjen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Pjen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pjen)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2001, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/youve-a-friend/58769/18 "2001-03-25T17:02:22Z")
Could I suggest that the ‘got’ in the phrase may be a mark of emphasis as in ‘got to’ I should go- I’ve got to go I’ve a friend- I’ve got a friend similar construction adding emphasis. Anyway, blame it on Carol King 1960s, ‘You’ve got a friend’. Sometimes, anyway, good coloquial English doesn’t need tyo follow strict grammatical rules- it’s stronger and better when working outside those rules. Oh, and by the way, ‘gotten’ has just about disappeared in colloquial spoken English as well as written English in England, although it still exists with other -en endings in Somerset and Bristol- Gotten, Boughten, Founden, Backen etc.