Zero Tolerance

Great Debates
21

Ok, Jodi, we’re on the same field.

I don’t get into the “it was only one” deal either.

Sadly enough, my state representative is a former State Police Officer - several years ago his son’s best friend (they were high school students) died in a drunk driving accident. This Police Officer decided that the kids were going to drink anyhow to express their grief, so had a party on his property where he allowed drinking as long as they spent the night. He was allowed to plead to a misdemeanor so he wouldn’t loose his job. Too bad we didn’t have a “zero tolerance” for cops, too. :rolleyes:

22

<< Your posts seem to contain a fair amount of negativity about wealthy kids being bailed out by “mommy and daddy”. Not, that I’m against that or anything. However, what about poorer children. >>

Well, yeah, that’s what the OP posited.

Wring’s example is just what I’m talking about. Wring worked within the system to right an injustice. His kid was falsely accused and wrongly punished, and Wring helped fight it WITHIN THE SYSTEM. Wring didn’t try to sneak his/her kid out school before the search, or to falsify evidence, or to bribe the authorities.

The OP’s example were parents who helped their kids EVADE the law. The example they set for the kids is that it’s OK to cheat and lie and evade punishment for wrongdoing.

Wring’s example to his/her kid is to stand up for truth and justice within the system. Granted, that’s not always as effective as mere evasion; but it’s the right way to do things.

Night and day.

23

I have to ask - when you were a minor, did you ever get drunk?

24

Gee, Jodi, knowing the apocalyptic consequences had you been tempted by the demon alcohol, on behalf of the entire world’s population let me express our gratitude for your abstainence. Now, would you have acted differently if he had threatened only to withhold your driving privileges, or ground you for a specific time on the first offense, saving “ending the world” for a repeat offense?

The OP doesn’t specify the degree of the punishment (suspension). I have no problem with there being some impact for breaking stated policies (and, yes, the law.) But I do have a problem with excessive reactionary responses. Especially with kids. Kids fuck up. And when they do, that should be used as an opportunity to teach and guide them. Not make an example of them. I am a big fan of progressive punishment. Zero tolerance exists simply for ease of enforcement. Bright lines are easy to identify. But doing so does not address root causes.

So, given the drinking party example, I would have no problem if the kids with no record of drinking or similar behavior were suspended for a couple of days, or prohibited from participating in extracurriculars for a couple of weeks or a month or so – sounds like a punishment that fits the crime. But if the school is going to expel my kid or (possibly) prevent any and all extracurriculars for an excessive time, I can imagine trying to help my kid avoid being caught, and if caught, trying to work through the system to reduce the punishment. I personally drank and did other things when I was a kid that I’d just as soon my kids don’t repeat, but I won’t be surprised if they do. Fortunately, I never got caught. Believe me, if and when my kids are caught drinking, doing drugs, stealing, having sex, etc., they won’t have to depend on the school to realize they are being punished. But, hopefully they will be punished in a manner that will teach them a lesson other than resenting authority. Also, if the kid is being punished by the police/courts, and hopefully by the parents, isn’t additional punishment by the school for the same offense kind of piling on?

Could the school require some kind of extra effort by the kids? Make them tutor, work at something, work with the police or substance abuse centers, assign them to research and report on the dangers and prevalence of drinking? Wouldn’t these type of responses be more constructive than excessive suspension/expulsion? Of course, they would require some more effort than signing a suspension slip.

Final observation, I think a lot of people think school and extracurriculars are valuable to kids in many ways. So what is the most reasonable response to a kid who has shown some signs of tendency towards waywardness? I’ve got it! Prohibit him from engaging in constructive activities and give him a bunch of free time he’ll have to fill up somewhere.

25

Steady now, Dinsdale - that sounds horribly close to reason.

26

wring, the difference between your son and the OP is that your son was on school property and not at someones house. Would you have done something if your son had be caught carring a knife down the street and then suspended from school. I would hope so.

I think I was just getting out of school at the time of this zero tolerance crap, about 1991. Most of the people I knew carried those small swiss army knives to school and near the end you would get kicked out for having even that. Now that I think about it we might of had a policy for athleats getting caught drinking but I don’t ever remember a case that someone was kicked off a team because of it.

I don’t like these types of policies and don’t see how a school can enforce them but I guess they do. I don’t see how they can kick you out of school though unless it happened on school property, the sports teams I guess I can kinda see. I think that parents need to talk to their kids, my father used to tell me that I could drink if I wanted to. He also told me that he would kick my ass if I ever drove drunk, he would tell me that if I needed a ride home to call him and he would pick me up. people need to do stuff like that for their kids. I never did take him up on the offer though, never drove drunk either.