Is Jan Brewer an alcoholic?

[Cisco]

First of all, this is not a Brewer-bashing thread. Despite disagreeing with her on most issues, I actually don't hate Jan Brewer. She is good for education, she personally loves my school, and some of the cost-cutting measures she has done are unfortunate, but probably necessary, and I tentatively support them as long as they are reversed when times aren't so lean anymore. Besides that, she can be quite charming.

Now, that being said, the woman just consistently looks drunk as fuck. I'm sure by now most of you have seen the debate clip from last night. That actually isn't the best example of her looking drunk (could have just been nerves), but it's the easiest to find right now.

I saw her speak in person last week, with 2 other people; 1 who is voting for her, me, who is not voting for her, and a 3rd who is undecided. Afterwards, all 3 of us said - independently of each other - that she came off "like a friendly old drunk lady."

I'm wondering if there is any published record of alcoholism in her past (as with W. Bush), or if any alcoholics here see familiar signs when they watch her speak.

And just a funny postscript: her maiden name is Drinkwine and she married a Brewer .

[foolsguinea]

With those names, I'm thinking she was doomed to it. Maybe she doesn't drink, but her names do it for her. Dianetics in action, almost.

[Snowboarder Bo]

She's fucking hammered in that clip. No doubt. Shitfaced.

Four or five sheets to the wind.

In line to drive the porcelain bus.

Getting ready for a technicolor yawn.

[MeanOldLady]

Originally Posted by Cisco

[S]he came off "like a friendly old drunk lady."

This is a good thing, yes?

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by Snowboarder Bo

She's fucking hammered in that clip. No doubt. Shitfaced.

Four or five sheets to the wind.

In line to drive the porcelain bus.

Getting ready for a technicolor yawn.

Or else she just really is that dumb.

[Llama Llogophile]

She's definitely drinking too much. Or perhaps not enough.

I was about to start a thread about her bizarre behavior in that debate. Wasn't sure how to phrase it, but my question was going to be something like, "Is this woman really that stupid?" I don't think I've ever seen a high office holder come off as badly as that.

[Starving Artist]

Seemed like she suffered a couple of major-league brain farts, or was blinded by the lights. Or the green room was too well stocked. It's hard to say.

[Frank]

The OP appears to me to be a cheap shot.

Cisco, you live in Arizona. You live in the capital of Arizona. If there is any evidence that the governor of your state is an alcoholic, you - of all people - should know what it is.

Your anecdotal trifecta is a bit weird, too. You went to hear her speak with two others. Each offered an independent opinion. All three of you said it at the exact same time to other people? Or what?

[Cisco]

Why would I have privileged information just because I live in the capital, Frank?

As for my "weird" trifecta: I said it to my wife, my brother said it to me, and my dad said it to my mom.

[Cisco]

Originally Posted by MeanOldLady

This is a good thing, yes?

1st person or 3rd person perspective?

[Frank]

Originally Posted by Cisco

Why would I have privileged information just because I live in the capital, Frank?

Because the information is available to you, if you wish it to be. I spent 15 years living in the capital of Colorado, and between the print, radio, TV, online, and conversational versions of political news available to me there, there were very few rumors or facts about our governors that I did not have some knowledge of. I'm skeptical that any other state capital has less available information.

As far as I can tell, you're making this up out of thin air.

Brewer didn't look good in that clip, I agree. I see no evidence that it was because she was drunk. Since you don't have background evidence that her being drunk was a likelihood - and you are, in fact, trolling for evidence - I see no reason to give your OP any credence.

Should evidence appear, I'll rethink my position. Till then, I've had my say.

[Simplicio]

The debate clip just looks like she totally spaces on her prepared remarks and then doesn't recover very well. Seems more like a senior moment then being drunk, IMHO.

Originally Posted by Frank

Cisco, you live in Arizona. You live in the capital of Arizona. If there is any evidence that the governor of your state is an alcoholic, you - of all people - should know what it is.

What a silly claim.

[Frank]

Originally Posted by Simplicio

What a silly claim.

Nonsense. Any person who claims to be politically aware and who lives in the capital of their state has the best opportunity to follow and be aware of their state's politics, and has no excuse to plead ignorance.

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by Simplicio

The debate clip just looks like she totally spaces on her prepared remarks and then doesn't recover very well. Seems more like a senior moment then being drunk, IMHO.

And a drunk will be sober tomorrow, but . . .

[Belowjob2.0]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUNtofsW3zE&NR=1


She looks a lot better here, from a few months(?) ago. Lot more alert and engaged. But she still has some brain farts. She's not much of a speaker.

Something's going on with the lady right now. Health issues? Pills? Not necessarily booze. Booze would be pretty easy for those interacting with her to detect wouldn't it?

[Snowboarder Bo]

Originally Posted by Frank

Because the information is available to you, if you wish it to be. I spent 15 years living in the capital of Colorado, and between the print, radio, TV, online, and conversational versions of political news available to me there, there were very few rumors or facts about our governors that I did not have some knowledge of. I'm skeptical that any other state capital has less available information.

As far as I can tell, you're making this up out of thin air.

Brewer didn't look good in that clip, I agree. I see no evidence that it was because she was drunk. Since you don't have background evidence that her being drunk was a likelihood - and you are, in fact, trolling for evidence - I see no reason to give your OP any credence.

Should evidence appear, I'll rethink my position. Till then, I've had my say.

What a ridiculous bunch of "logic".

If we all thought the way you did, no one would ever have suspicions of anything until something blew up in their face.

And I concur that your thesis that somehow proximity = knowledge is ridiculous and can easily be falsified by finding any one thing that any one "knowledgeable" person doesn't know, which is especially easy when your talking about newly unfolding events or current affairs.

[astro]

I think I can with some authority as the son of mother who was the same social class and general education level as the Governor and who was a chronic alcoholic.

The Governor is 66 years old and (per the video) IMO is suffering from memory lapses which could be due to mini-strokes, incipient dementia or simply age. A drunk has impaired motor skills which slightly, but noticeably, slurs their words. There was none of that. In between the epic brain farts her overall enunciation and speaking skills were not impaired in the least.

There's a physical issue of some sort, but it's not alcohol.

[BigT]

Originally Posted by Frank

Nonsense. Any person who claims to be politically aware and who lives in the capital of their state has the best opportunity to follow and be aware of their state's politics, and has no excuse to plead ignorance.

Why do you assume that rumors like that would be published? Or why do you assume that most people are that politically aware follow rumors and not just reported facts?

I know I personally avoid rumors in anything, because it just leads to idle speculation and worry on my part.

And why do you characterize asking for evidence one way or other on a forum of other people who are politically aware (and might actually know what alcoholism looks like) as a bad thing? Bad enough to use a word like "trolling" on a board where not only is trolling against the rules, but so is accusing people of it?

[Cisco]

It looks like Frank was using the pre-internet definition of trolling, but one has to wonder how else a person finds evidence, if not by looking for it. So maybe that word choice did mean something. And apart from that his behavior in this thread has been just bizarre, IMO. I wonder if it's Frank Brewer or Frank Drinkwine.

[BigT]

I know that, but, by choosing that particular word, he implies that what you were doing was just as bad as the Internet version.

[Vinyl Turnip]

Originally Posted by Frank

The OP appears to me to be a cheap shot.

Yeah. Poor woman's had way too many cheap shots already!

[Troy McClure SF]

Relevant.

[Snowboarder Bo]

Thanks, Troy. I had been reading about that in the paper this morning, but hadn't yet seen the clip.

This lady is fucked. I can't imagine how she'll get elected, especially if this type of thing continues from her, but if she does get elected, I think AZ will find itself fucked up beyond anything we can envision at the end of her term.

This is gonna be great fun to watch!

[gonzomax]

We all have encountered drunks like acted like she did in the debate. That is not proof of course. But it sure makes you wonder. It was her opening speech that she probably rehearsed 50 times. It was very important for setting a tone. It did ,but not like she wanted. She should have said forgive m," I am a tea bagger so cut me some slack".
She acted totally befuddled when the press asked her what was going on. She could have defused it with any reasonable answer. She had none. It was a horrible performance that will not sway tea baggers away from her.

[furt]

Originally Posted by Troy McClure SF

Relevant.

That bothers me a lot more than the clip in the OP.

I don't know that she was drunk, but she is clearly addled in some way or the other. Dementia?

[Saint Cad]

Too bad she isn't running against Phil Gordon. She'd look sober by comparison.

[ElvisL1ves]

My first thought was "over-rehearsed" - she had the look of someone who had her script memorized, but forgot a cue and had to improvise, something her "advisers" had sternly told her not to do.

[Snowboarder Bo]

Well, today she sort of backpedaled on her beaheadings comment.

Originally Posted by AZ Gov. Jan Brewer

That was an error, if I said that.

If?

Originally Posted by AZ Gov. Jan Brewer

...the kidnappings and the extortion and the beheadings and the fact that people can't feel safe in their community.

Originally Posted by AZ Gov. Jan Brewer

Oh, our law enforcement agencies have found bodies in the desert, either buried or just lying out there, that have been beheaded.

IF???

[descamisado]

Originally Posted by AZ Gov. Jan Brewer
Oh, our law enforcement agencies have found bodies in the desert, either buried or just lying out there, that have been beheaded.

This proves she was not talking about bodies being found in Mexico either.

She has a pretty substantial lead over her opponent so it doesn't look like he'll overtake her, unless she commits several more major blunders and his campaigns comes on really strong.

And, okay, I'll say it: does she not have any other jacket but that lemon-lime number? She needs to take a page from the Sarah Palin Book of Campaign Perks -- I'll forgive her if it gives my eyes a rest!

[BrainGlutton]

Still, Brewer has been leading Goddard soundly. Are any post-debate polls available yet?

[pohjonen]

The sad thing is she'll probably still win. *shudder*

[Cisco]

Oh, she's pretty much a lock. The whole "git the fedrul guhmint oudda mah bizniss / I'll keep mah guns and munny, you keep the 'CHANGE'" thing is huge here, and she's playing to it bigtime.

[Elendil's Heir]

NPR interviewed a local Arizona political correspondent on Friday afternoon. He said most people were a bit nonplussed by her performance (her "deer in the headlights moment," as he described it), but that she was very, very popular for signing the illegal immigration crackdown bill, and would probably still win reelection.

[Cisco]

At one point I had gotten the impression that she was genuinely struggling about whether or not to sign it. I think her final decision wasn't based on a question about whether or not it was the right thing to do. I think the question was, "do I want to be elected governor?"

[gonzomax]

She has decided to forgo all future debates. Participating in this one gave her 1.7 million dollars in campaign funds. There is no more to get by more debates.
She has the right wing and the haters whipped up . That should insure her election. I thought there was more to governance than that. Live and learn.
She knows where the bodies are buried. Oops ,she doesn't after all.

[dalej42]

I also think she'll win. McCain has drawn only token opposition and there aren't any hot button ballot issues. SB1070 will be in the courts for a long time and the general election will be decided by paranoid seniors who live in fear of the Mexican drug cartel attacking the Sun City Shuffleboard league.

[gonzomax]

The crime rate is at very low levels, yet screaming wolf still works.
People who proudly proclaim ,"i don't vote for the party, i vote for the person", are going to have it easy. She is a joke of a candidate.

[Starving Artist]

Originally Posted by gonzomax

She has the right wing and the haters whipped up . That should insure her election.

So in the gonzo world, you either have to favor being the only country in the world that allows unfettered immigration from neighboring countries, or you're a "hater".

Is that how it works?

I used to think this kind of hooey was simply a tactic to get impressionable people whipped up against conservatives, but the more time I spend around here the more it becomes obvious you people really think this way.

Scary.

[Snowboarder Bo]

Originally Posted by Starving Artist

So in the gonzo world, you either have to favor being the only country in the world that allows unfettered immigration from neighboring countries, or you're a "hater".

Is that how it works?

I used to think this kind of hooey was simply a tactic to get impressionable people whipped up against conservatives, but the more time I spend around here the more it becomes obvious you people really think this way.

Scary.

Hang on. Lemme see if I can get you some help with that big brush your painting with.






Hmmm.


Nope; no one wants to help you paint with that.

[Starving Artist]

Originally Posted by Snowboarder Bo

Hang on. Lemme see if I can get you some help with that big brush your painting with.

Can you offer an alternative explanation for the reason why anyone on the right who opposes illegal immigration is pretty much automatically referred to by lefties as a 'hater'? I've seen nothing coming from any liberal anywhere to indicate that they feel conservative opposition to illegal immigration is based upon anything but racial hatred and/or xenophobia.

[Cisco]

Originally Posted by Starving Artist

Can you offer an alternative explanation for the reason why anyone on the right who opposes illegal immigration is pretty much automatically referred to by lefties as a 'hater'? I've seen nothing coming from any liberal anywhere to indicate that they feel conservative opposition to illegal immigration is based upon anything but racial hatred and/or xenophobia.

Well, look at how the issue is handled by politicians and pundits on the right. It's a political card to pull when the time comes around every so often (see John McCain's record on immigration over the last decade if you don't believe this.) Things like SB1070 don't make your case very well when:

-They're influenced or flat-out written by white supremacist groups
-They do [admittedly, by right-wingers] absolutely nothing to halt the flow of people or drugs over the border
-They [admittedly, by right-wingers] are basically legally toothless

That leaves precious little room for speculation on why it was inacted; one obvious* reason being to appease Mexican haters and "fedrul guhmint" haters (of whom I've yet to meet one who didn't have, at bare minimum, xenophobic leanings.)


*(to me, and I'm in a privileged position being that I live in the capital of AZ)

[gonzomax]

Immigration is a snap to fix, but it will not happen. You can stop them from getting employment. That would require cracking down on corporations and businesses that hire them. Do you believe they don't know what they are doing? When a guy applies for a job and barely speaks English and has questionable paper work, you send him away. But they find exploiting them for low wages makes money. Fine them big time and it would clear up.
I am not for unfettered immigration. Never said I was. But it is an employment migration going on as people follow the jobs. Our economy is so bad now, that the problem is drying up anyway.

[dalej42]

Originally Posted by Cisco;12878119-They're influenced or flat-out written by white supremacist groups
-They do [admittedly, by right-wingers

absolutely nothing to halt the flow of people or drugs over the border
-They [admittedly, by right-wingers] are basically legally toothless

That leaves precious little room for speculation on why it was inacted; one obvious* reason being to appease Mexican haters and "fedrul guhmint" haters (of whom I've yet to meet one who didn't have, at bare minimum, xenophobic leanings.)


*(to me, and I'm in a privileged position being that I live in the capital of AZ)

Not to forget Arizona already banned same sex marriage in 2008 so that horse is dead.

[Cyberhwk]

Originally Posted by BrainGlutton

Still, Brewer has been leading Goddard soundly. Are any post-debate polls available yet?

Probably not what you were looking for, but I checked InTrade after I saw her bomb. She was still >90% to win IIRC.

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by Starving Artist

Can you offer an alternative explanation for the reason why anyone on the right who opposes illegal immigration is pretty much automatically referred to by lefties as a 'hater'? I've seen nothing coming from any liberal anywhere to indicate that they feel conservative opposition to illegal immigration is based upon anything but racial hatred and/or xenophobia.

Because we've seen nothing to indicate it is based on anything else. Certainly not the "rule of law" -- if the illegal-immigration pressure were coming from Canada instead of Mexico, the Minutemen would not exist. There certainly are some sound, non-xenophobic, purely economic or ecological reasons to restrict immigration to the U.S. -- but those obviously are secondary considerations, if considerations at all, to the anti-immigrant right.

[gonzomax]

Really SA ,who is pro illegal immigration? You are making shit up again. But with a bad employment picture in the US, we need all the jobs we can get. We can not give them to illegals.
But who benefits from illegal immigration. It is not the American worker or the average American citizen. Only one group reaps benefits from illegal immigration. That is where you should direct your anger and frustration. That group of course is employers who exploit them for lower wages. American workers get a downward pressure on wages. that certainly does not benefit them. It is one powerful ,politically connected group that wants it and that is why we have it.

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by gonzomax

Really SA ,who is pro illegal immigration? You are making shit up again. But with a bad employment picture in the US, we need all the jobs we can get. We can not give them to illegals.
But who benefits from illegal immigration. It is not the American worker or the average American citizen. Only one group reaps benefits from illegal immigration. That is where you should direct your anger and frustration. That group of course is employers who exploit them for lower wages. American workers get a downward pressure on wages. that certainly does not benefit them. It is one powerful ,politically connected group that wants it and that is why we have it.

As Bush found out, when he tried his hand at immigration reform in his second term: His electoral base thought his plan was too weak, but his real financial/power base thought it was too strong. It split the party and died.

[gonzomax]

Originally Posted by BrainGlutton

As Bush found out, when he tried his hand at immigration reform in his second term: His electoral base thought his plan was too weak, but his real financial/power base thought it was too strong. It split the party and died.

That split is the employers who benefit from open borders and people who vote republican thinking the party has their back. The party relies on people voting against their economic interests in the name of abortion, gun control, immigration or other causes the party has no intention of dealing with.

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by gonzomax

That split is the employers who benefit from open borders and people who vote republican thinking the party has their back. The party relies on people voting against their economic interests in the name of abortion, gun control, immigration or other causes the party has no intention of dealing with.

Well, that must be why Brewer is polling so well in AZ -- because she signed legislation that purports to try to do something about immigration. (If it actually did something about immigration, things would be a lot more complicated for her.)

[gonzomax]

She is screaming about a crime wave caused by illegals. The crime is at a 50 year low. She is crying about a murder rate caused by illegals. it does not exist. She is stirring up the anti immigrant hatred with dishonest figures because it works. She claims to be anti big government. Why ?,Because it works. Who has a clue what she really believes in. Originally she was against the stop immigrants bill until polling proved it was a winner. She has more ambition than brains. If she has ant ethics they are well hidden.