Is GOP trying to sabotage economy to hurt Obama?

[John_Stamos_Left_Ear]

The subject is from an Associated Press article, from which the following is excerpted:

Are Republican lawmakers deliberately stalling the economic recovery to hurt President Barack Obama’s re-election chances?

The latest Democratic complaint came after House Speaker John Boehner said Tuesday that when Congress raises the nation’s borrowing cap in early 2013, he will again insist on big spending cuts to offset the increase. Boehner, R-Ohio, continues to reject higher tax rates, which Democrats demand from the wealthy.

That led Sen. Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y., to say Boehner is virtually assuring another debt-ceiling crisis as bad or worse than the one that shook financial markets nine months ago.

“The last thing the country needs is a rerun of last summer’s debacle that nearly brought down our economy,” Schumer said in a statement. In an interview, Schumer added: “I hope that the speaker is not doing this because he doesn’t want to see the economy improve, because what he said will certainly rattle the markets.”

Regardless of whether Schumer’s suspicions are right, there’s evidence that unceasing partisan gridlock and the prospect of big tax increases and spending cuts in January are causing some companies to postpone expansions. Even small economic slowdowns are bad news for Obama, who is seeking re-election amid high unemployment.

The Washington Post this past week compiled a list of military contractors, hospitals and universities that are delaying hires and bracing for cuts, partly because of fears that Washington’s partisan divisions will not abate.

The most obvious showdown will happen soon after the Nov. 6 election. Unless a lame-duck Congress can make deals, the economy will suffer a double whammy of large tax increases and spending cuts, starting Jan. 1. The tax increases would hit virtually every working American and the spending cuts would affect military and domestic programs.

Economists say that what Federal Reserve chairman Ben Bernanke calls a “fiscal cliff” could possibly lead to another severe recession.

Federal, state and local government layoffs have been under way for months. They may be necessary to reduce deficits and survive recessions. But they increase unemployment, a problem for any president seeking a second term.

Since February 2010, when the economy began consistently adding jobs, the private sector has gained 4.2 million positions. But federal, state and local governments during that time have cut more than 500,000 jobs.

As for the debt limit, “allowing America to default would be irresponsible,” Boehner said Tuesday at an economic forum. “But it would be more irresponsible to raise the debt ceiling without taking dramatic steps to reduce spending and reform the budget process.”

Democrats say that’s precisely the type of economic saber-rattling that can frighten investors and employers, and damage Obama’s re-election hopes.

That’s far from the only instance of someone making this claim. In their new book, “It’s Even Worse Than It Looks,” Thomas Mann and Norman Ornstein – two of the most prominent talking heads in Washington, known for their balanced view and proclivity toward moderation – say that the Republican Party is to blame. Quoted from a Washington Post Opinion piecebased on the book:

We have been studying Washington politics and Congress for more than 40 years, and never have we seen them this dysfunctional. In our past writings, we have criticized both parties when we believed it was warranted. Today, however, we have no choice but to acknowledge that the core of the problem lies with the Republican Party.

The GOP has become an insurgent outlier in American politics. It is ideologically extreme; scornful of compromise; unmoved by conventional understanding of facts, evidence and science; and dismissive of the legitimacy of its political opposition.

Now, such views may not seem specifically out to get Obama on Election Day, but how transparent do they need to be when no less than the Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell was quoed as saying “The single most important thing we want to achieve is for President Obama to be a one-term President” two years ago?

I had the following exchange a month or so back with someone who was dissatisfied with Obama:

Him: So if a car salesman talked me in to buying something that FAILED, what rationale would I have to buy something from him again?

Me: To make your analogy work, you have a car that failed because the guys who made the engine refused to listen to the car manufactuer and gave the car a crappy engine that always broke down.

You seem to think that it would be a much better outcome to have the people who made the engine now put in charge of the whole damn car.

I guess the debate is as follows:

1. Is the GOP actively sabotaging the economy? Will they do anything - even if it hurts America and their constituants - to have Obama lose the White House?

2. If not, how can we explain everything they have said and done to date?

3. If so, how can we stop them?

[DWMarch]

Going to go out on a limb here and say yes they are.

The debt ceiling debacle was a perfect example of cutting off the nose to spite the face. And they’re getting ready to do it again.

How do you stop them? Don’t vote for them. Condemn their outlandish behavior any chance you get. Let your friends know that you don’t agree with these tactics no matter who uses them.

[ralph124c]

The Obama administration is doing a good enough job of it, all on their own:
-hundreds of billions given to failed “green energy” companies (Solyndra, Fiskars etc.)
-enormous new taxes coming (causing firms to drop expansion plans, limit hiring)
-huge, concealed unemployment (government doesn’t count “discouraged” workers)
-tremendous expansion of national debt
Finally, a mentally retarded VP sent to confer with world leaders-the Chinese leadership takes one look at a guy like Biden, and draws their own conclusions.

[Czarcasm]

@ralph124c

The Obama administration is doing a good enough job of it, all on their own:
-hundreds of billions given to failed “green energy” companies (Solyndra, Fiskars etc.)
-enormous new taxes coming (causing firms to drop expansion plans, limit hiring)
-huge, concealed unemployment (government doesn’t count “discouraged” workers)
-tremendous expansion of national debt
Finally, a mentally retarded VP sent to confer with world leaders-the Chinese leadership takes one look at a guy like Biden, and draws their own conclusions.

This doesn’t address the OP’s question at all. Is the GOP attempting to sabotage the efforts of the Obama administration or not? Whether they need to or not is beside the point-are they doing it anyway?

[DrFidelius]

Probably. Partisanship always seemd to trump patriotism during an election cycle. What is best for their party takes precedence over what is best for the country.

This comes from both sides of the aisle, although I admit that I find myself disagreeing with the Republican leadership on goals and methods more often lately than I am disagreeing with the Democrats.

[Acid_Lamp]

I make no pretenses here about my political associations; I’m a strongly left leaning independent, and happy to curse both houses frequently and with feeling. That said, the GOP does seem to be blatantly driving us into a state of inaction purely to pursue their goal of ensuring that Obama is not re-elected. What I cannot understand, (and still do not despite any number of threads on this topic) is: Why?

[DrFidelius]

@Acid_Lamp

I make no pretenses here about my political associations; I’m a strongly left leaning independent, and happy to curse both houses frequently and with feeling. That said, the GOP does seem to be blatantly driving us into a state of inaction purely to pursue their goal of ensuring that Obama is not re-elected. What I cannot understand, (and still do not despite any number of threads on this topic) is: Why?

Why?
Because if a Republican gets into the White House, then a Democrat does not. Party leadership treats the government as a zero-sum game, and they act as if the other party is the opponent. Every once in a while they put aside the one-upsmanship and work together to beat the shit out of some foreigners, but they always come back to playground level behaviour soon enough.

[Acid_Lamp]

@DrFidelius

Why?
Because if a Republican gets into the White House, then a Democrat does not. Party leadership treats the government as a zero-sum game, and they act as if the other party is the opponent. Every once in a while they put aside the one-upsmanship and work together to beat the shit out of some foreigners, but they always come back to playground level behaviour soon enough.

Tribalism is no doubt in play here, but I don’t think that can be the sole driving factor. This strategy just doesn’t make sense numerically. Despite party sniping, I don’t believe that the majority of Republican representatives are simply stupid or evil. They do not have a strong majority in the general population; and swing voters are likely to be turned off by extremism. It makes me consider that perhaps they have some sort of bombshell to drop, but given the extremely petty nature of most of the “issues” being brought up, I have serious doubts that any such thing exists. So what is the end game here? They need to secure the swing voters and independents; the current tactics are strongly alienating them from that desperately needed demographic.

[New_Deal_Democrat]

Republicans created the debt crisis with the dishonest claim that tax cuts generate more tax revenue than tax increases. Now they are using the national debt in an effort to de fund domestic spending programs they have never liked, but which are popular with the voters.

The only proven method to reduce unemployment is to increase government spending and employment, and to pay for it by raising taxes on the well to do. It worked for Franklin Roosevelt. Those who claim that what worked then will not work now are the kind of people who would have opposed it back then.

Republican efforts to oppose government efforts that would actually reduce unemployment seem to be working. They did well during the 2000 election. Romney is competitive with Obama.

[What_the]

@Acid_Lamp

I make no pretenses here about my political associations; I’m a strongly left leaning independent, and happy to curse both houses frequently and with feeling. That said, the GOP does seem to be blatantly driving us into a state of inaction purely to pursue their goal of ensuring that Obama is not re-elected. What I cannot understand, (and still do not despite any number of threads on this topic) is: Why?

There’s plenty of action in the House. Dem’s just don’t like that kind of action.

I think it’s all Harry’s fault.

PS Isn’t this about Elections?

[Acid_Lamp]

@What_the

There’s plenty of action in the House. Dem’s just don’t like that kind of action.

I think it’s all Harry’s fault.

PS Isn’t this about Elections?

Don’t be twee. I’d say the same thing if the Dems were pushing bills that they knew full well would stall or fail. The nation is pretty evenly split politically speaking and that means compromise is necessary from both sides for things to be done. The Left has plenty to answer for, but this thread isn’t about that. If you want to start one I’ll go there and complain about them as well.

[zoid]

Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell has said that the number one priority for the GOP is to prvent Obama from a second term.

The number one priority of the GOP is not the economy, or jobs, or national security, it’s to prevent Obama from a second term.

He obviously doesn’t speak for the entire party but there clearly at least some Republicans willing to do anything to win.

[zoid]

Missed the edit…

In fairness House Speaker John Boehner came out pretty quickly to disagree and state the number one priority should be jobs.

[Lobohan]

@ralph124c

The Obama administration is doing a good enough job of it, all on their own:
-hundreds of billions given to failed “green energy” companies (Solyndra, Fiskars etc.)

There is nothing sinister about Solyndra. You have been told it’s sinister by liars who are trying to manipulate you.

-enormous new taxes coming (causing firms to drop expansion plans, limit hiring)

Obama hasn’t raised taxes. You have been told that by liars, and they are misleading you.

-huge, concealed unemployment (government doesn’t count “discouraged” workers)

The statistics don’t count people who have left the work force. This isn’t new with Obama. You have been told that this is sinister by liars who are trying to manipulate you.

-tremendous expansion of national debt

That didn’t happen. Liars told you that to manipulate you. Obama spending binge never happened - MarketWatch

Finally, a mentally retarded VP sent to confer with world leaders-the Chinese leadership takes one look at a guy like Biden, and draws their own conclusions.

Remember the other VP we could have had. Biden is a little jocular, but he’s very knowledgeable.

[Lobohan]

@zoid

Missed the edit…

In fairness House Speaker John Boehner came out pretty quickly to disagree and state the number one priority should be jobs.

I think Boehner is a good guy. He’s utterly wrong about a ton of stuff, but I don’t think he’s outright evil. However, he is currently so afraid of losing his speakership to the outright evil Cantor, or getting primaried out of office by some Tea Party dipshit, that he might as well be one of the bad guys.

As to the OP, I can’t see how anyone who has been keeping up on politics could deny it. The GOP, every single member, has to worry about half of their electorate seething with hatred for the president. They are running from the beast that FOX News and Right Wing Radio has created. An electorate blindly raging with inchoate notions about socialism and Solyindra and czars and dead babies.

[New_Deal_Democrat]

@zoid

Missed the edit…

In fairness House Speaker John Boehner came out pretty quickly to disagree and state the number one priority should be jobs.

“To boost private sector job creation and end the legacy of debt being passed on to our children and grandchildren, we need a smaller, less costly and more accountable government.”

• John Boehner
  http://johnboehner.house.gov/Issues/Issue/?IssueID=3944

I am unaware of any evidence from American economic history that cutting taxes and the size of government has ever lead to a robust job market.

[FixMyIgnorance]

I think the debt ceiling crisis was a pretty good example that the GOP has no shortage of people willing to send the economy off tanking itself for the sake of selfish ideology. It’s disgusting, and people need to vote better. Unfortunately, that is a tall order.

[New_Deal_Democrat]

@FixMyIgnorance

I think the debt ceiling crisis was a pretty good example that the GOP has no shortage of people willing to send the economy off tanking itself for the sake of selfish ideology. It’s disgusting, and people need to vote better. Unfortunately, that is a tall order.

Except for Singapore every country that retains an AAA rating with Standard & Poor’s and Moody’s has higher tax rates than the United States. Most have social democratic economies.

---

S&P lowered American’s credit rating in part because it saw uncertainty in the political brinksmanship that took place in the latest round of debt ceiling talks. In fact, prior to this incident, there had never been “talks” at all. There were no negotiations to raise the ceiling. Instead, it was simply raised in a sort of rubber stamp affair.

This time, the GOP decided to take advantage of what could only be called a hostage situation, forcing the Democrats into a corner. The debt ceiling had to be raised, or the United States would default on its debt obligations. However, although they did not, the “crisis” that took place was such that S&P saw fit to lower the U.S. credit rating anyway.

The GOP in the House attempted to portray the U.S. debt as Obama’s responsibility. However, as noted by Thom Hartmann, the debt is the GOP’s and refusing to pay for it is fraud.
http://www.huliq.com/3257/us-leaves-whos-left-among-countries-both-moodys-s-p-aaa-ratings

Tax Tea Party Time?

[Euphonious_Polemic]

I’d say yes, the GOP is trying to damage the economy as much as possible in order to win the upcoming election.

They are also promoting the idea that the economy is doing badly, and are promoting and encouraging people to accept a pack of lies about what Obama has done in the past few years. They (and their media interpreters) make people believe that somehow we’re recording unemployment figures differently now compared to 5 years ago. They make up stories about “enormous” new taxes when none exist. They create fear about alternative energy and ignore the fact that there was 56 times more waste and fraud from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Here’s my cite:

@ralph124c

The Obama administration is doing a good enough job of it, all on their own:
-hundreds of billions given to failed “green energy” companies (Solyndra, Fiskars etc.)
-enormous new taxes coming (causing firms to drop expansion plans, limit hiring)
-huge, concealed unemployment (government doesn’t count “discouraged” workers)
-tremendous expansion of national debt
Finally, a mentally retarded VP sent to confer with world leaders-the Chinese leadership takes one look at a guy like Biden, and draws their own conclusions.

[Bryan_Ekers]

I figure Republicans opposing tax hikes are like Soviets applauding for Stalin. They all know it’s dumb, but nobody wants to be the first to stop.