Serious question, why is stealing considered "wrong"?

In My Humble Opinion
1

Alright, so it’s obvious every human being has only one life.

Some people are born into better lifes then others, some are born into royalty.

Some are born into rich families, some are born with just better genes. Some are born better looking and can get things easier.

Using these premises it’s easy to come to the conlusion that “life is 100% not fair”

Some people are born with cancer, hiv, terrible things happen in this world everywhere and daily.

Also, we don’t know for a fact if there is an afterlife. We do however know for a fact that we DO have this life now and need to live it to the fullest while we can.

Using those premises, what makes it wrong to steal?

Let me give an example.

Let’s say tommorow i decide to rob my neighbor. This rich older guy.

Let’s say i’m somehow successful.

It’s true that’s messed up…

But why does that matter to me if it’s wrong? It’s true he did nothing to me. But i know nothing about him, that’s a fact.

What if my neighbor is a druglord? What if he raped someone a long time ago and is a bad person and managed to be sucessful?

Why should i punish myself (not living my life to the fullest, having less money) by taking pity on some stranger?

Why is that considered “wrong” to strangers when we know nothing about them or how they became successful.

It’s true that most successful people aren’t “rapist thieves and killers” but that doesn’t mean they didn’t cut other people down to become sucessful.

Maybe he’s a wealthy businessman and in order to become there he had to take other peoples jobs who deserved them more. I’m sure i can come up with a ton of scenarios.

Maybe he’s actually a great person. But since he’s wealthy it’s not going to ruin his life. He’ll still have money. And i won’t rob him 100% blind. He’ll still have his house. He just won’t be living a life of luxury anymore.
I don’t understand morals and i think the only reason they were created is so people didn’t run around doing whatever they want. I don’t think morals were created in a single persons best interest.

If i was born in a very poor household and was mexican and no one would give me a chance anywhere why should i abide by society’s morals when society itself is putting me down? Racism still exists.

I just find morals to be a strange concept with so many exceptions.

Maybe i’m just part of that “new spoiled generation” but i’m just saying.

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There are moral quandaries.

Anyone will steal if given enough reason.

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So you’re saying there are always exceptions and scenarios where it’s “more ok” to steal?

4

Are you OK with him stealing from you?

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In order to have a function, prosperous society, it is necessary that people be able to own property. If there is no law, rule, or taboo that prohibits stealing, then for all intents and purposes, there is no property, and society can’t function.

Here’s a concrete example. A farmer owns some land. He undertakes the tasks of planting apple seeds, watering and fertilizing the apple trees for years until they produce fruit, picking the apples, storing the apples, and transporting them to a place where there are buyers who want to eat those apples. Why does he do all of this work? Obviously because he expects to be paid for the apples.

But no imagine that his property isn’t safe from theft. His apples might be stolen while on the tree. His apples might be stolen after he picks them. His money might be stolen after he sells the apples. In such a scenario, what motivation does he have to grow the apples in the first place?

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Do on to others…

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The arguments about a properly functioning society, and people needing an incentive to produce needed goods, are right on the money.

And yet…

There was a recent episode of Louie where he was shopping in a supermarket with his daughters. His one daughter spied a nice looking elderly woman sneaking some food into her purse (or maybe in her jacket, I don’t recall exactly). With her young child’s black and white view of right and wrong she immediately pointed at the woman and started yelling “she’s stealing!” Louie tried to shush her but a supermarket employee appeared and confronted the woman.

How many of us would have reported a woman who was very likely stealing a can of food or some chicken out of desperation? I don’t think that I would. In fact I think I would feel guilty if I did. I would probably also feel guilty if I didn’t, but probably less so. I understand about right and wrong and the necessity of laws against theft, and I don’t disagree with them, but when real things happen in the real world I think that most of us treat those rules situationally.

To justjake: If you’re talking about stealing to get a new wide screen TV, I don’t think many people would sympathize with you. If you’re talking about stealing to survive well, what you’re asking is something that has been debated by moral philosophers for a long time. It’s not just you being a part of some “new spoiled generation”.

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To clarify, since the editing period has expired on my previous post: I did not mean “stealing to survive well”, which is how it reads. I simply meant “stealing to survive”.

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i want people to live and prospere.

So if they were poor and had to steal from me, so be it.

But i would have a right to defend myself.

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Do you feel you have the right just to defend yourself? Or do you feel you have the right to defend your property also?

How much would you be okay with a poor person stealing from you? Just enough to survive for the immediate future. Or can a poor person steal your car if they can’t afford to buy one of their own? Can a poor homeless person steal your house and kick you out of it? If a poor person steals your car or your house are you allowed to steal it back from them? Suppose you have a few thousand dollars in the bank and a poor person steals your car - are you allowed to steal your car back or do you have to buy a used car with the money you had in the bank? Suppose you have a nice car but your neighbour has three cars - can you steal one of his cars so both of you have two cars?

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The problem is people that have money have a sense of entitlement to their things because they “earned” them.

While that does make sense what about people that weren’t born into upper class families? What about people that were never given a chance no matter how hard they tried?

Why aren’t they entitled to your things? Who are you? If you’re rich and i wanna steal your car and widescreen, who are you to me? I have one life, why should i respect you? I need to better MY life. You could be a bad rapist person anyways. I don’t know you.

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As others have said, allowing you to steal simply because someone else has more things or nicer things will lead to a totally dysfunctional society from which none of us will benefit.

What you’re saying however, can be an argument for estate taxes and progressive income taxes, and maybe even a basic guaranteed income. In other words, orderly and legal redistribution using government mechanisms, rather than theft by individuals.

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Tevye: “And in the circle of our little village, we have always had our special types. . . .”
Tevye: “. . . And Nahum, the beggar . . .”
Nahum: "Alms for the poor, alms for the poor . . .’
Lazar: “Here, Reb Nahum, is one kopek.”
Nahum: “One kopek? Last week you gave me two kopeks.”
Lazar: “I had a bad week.”
Nahum: “So, if you had a bad week, why should I suffer?”

Prologue from Fiddler On The Roof

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Because if the poor are allowed to steal, the rich will be allowed to steal, too - and they’ll be much better at it. If you can take a rich man’s widescreen TV, a rich man can hire a bunch of goons and take your house. After all, maybe you’re a bad rapist person or something.

15

Robin is quite justified in stealing from the rich Sir Scrooge.

Meanwhile Sir Scrooge has arranged with the army that they march up to Scrooge Forest,
and don’t bring food, its all supplied. They will then prevent the vikings invading.

So then the army comes along, finds Robin has stolen all the food, and then heads back to the city to get a feed. Then the vikings rape Robin’s daughters, sisters,wife, cousins, and his best friends, and put him to the sword as well. Well done Robin.

Maybe the fact that Scrooge had the food could have said "this food is for Scrooge to dispense , and not for Robin to take ? "

“There’s no such thing as a free lunch”; while Robin isn’t actually responsible for his murder (its not suicide…) or the rapes, they did actually happen and he is no longer happily stealing from the rich…

The australian aboriginals also have the idea “what is yours is mine”. Perhaps because when they went walk about they’d be starving and then finally reaching the end, they want a feed…
But what if 50 people go walkeabout and come across a little group which has spare food for 5 ? Starving people starve… murder. reprisals… tribal warfare… They invented a form of a vasectomy to keep their family sizes in check…

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I don’t know you, and I don’t know you’re poor. So it’s okay if I steal everything in your house? After all, who are you to me? I don’t know you, and I don’t know whether your rich and deserve to have your stuff stolen or not.

You’re assigning value to whether someone is rich or not, but at the same time indicating a selfishness towards your own life without caring how other people feel. Your tendency for solipsism has me feeling that maybe you’re a bit sociopathic, to be honest.

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I’m not religious, but this is one of the great concepts that Christianity brought into the ‘mainstream’ if you will, ‘thou shalt not steal’. Before it despotism, or might makes right, was a perfectly acceptable, logical, and seemingly right way of life. Still is today, ignoring any moral or ethical tenets against it.

It also goes by the term: ‘Being a criminal’… :smiley:

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OK, hypothetical: Say I start off life in a low income household. I watch my parents struggle to get by.

As I grow up, I decide I don’t want to live like that, so I work extra hard at school, ace all my exams, end up going to law school, work extra hard there too for a few years and eventually end up as a lawyer, and then a high paid lawyer. I am now more successful than you, financially, but I didn’t have any more advantages in life than you did. I’ve just worked hard to get to where I am.
So, by your logic, just because I have nicer stuff than you (because you didn’t work as hard as I did), then you’re morally entitled to just come and take my stuff? Is that really what you’re saying here?

Go and have a think about that.

Additionally, as someone who has been the victim of theft before, having had irreplaceable items of personal value taken from me, then I have to say: F[redacted because this isn’t in the pit. yet] :mad:

Right. So:

If you see someone that’s pretty and can use that to an advantage, would you go and slash their face up with a razor so they’re not pretty any more?
If someone is good at sports, would you break their kneecaps so they can’t run any more?
If someone is fit and healthy would you inject them with HIV so they get sick?

It seems like your logic is all about removing advantages and levelling the playing field. If you won’t do any of the above, then why should stealing rich people’s stuff be any different?

No. No, it isn’t. Learn to live with that, it’s not going to change.

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OP: TLDR. The main reason it’s TL is the return/enter key is not a space key.

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Guacamole!